Why are popular striker-fired pistols safe?

[JTQ]

And try riding the safety on this:

View attachment 817075
​

You can't even tell what position it is in by grip.




GR

Essentially a Colt teardrop thumb safety. I do it every time I shoot a 1911.

I'm sorry it doesn't work for you, but it does for the vast majority of 1911 shooters.

 

[Garandimal]

I don’t own any of those, so I can’t run take a snap of them in my grip. I however have shot them all. I rode the safety on each (though the 938 was years ago and I wouldnt absolutely swear to it... though I simply never DON’T ride a safety that is there). I repeat: I have no idea why you think any of this is particularly difficult. Be specific about what you contend makes it impossible.

Because I shoot an OEM Springfield MIL-SPEC 1911-A1, Sig P938, and GLOCK's... lots.




GR

 

[Garandimal]

Essentially a Colt teardrop thumb safety. I do it every time I shoot a 1911.

I'm sorry it doesn't work for you, but it does for the vast majority of 1911 shooters.

It works fine for me.

I fiddle it off when I draw, and then fiddle it back on when I re-holster.

What I don't do is cycle it for every presentation, like a race-gun.

Instead, I just keep my finger off the trigger and shoot it like a GLOCK.




GR

 

[ATLDave]

Maybe post a picture or two of your grip? Or try to actually explain, rather than simply repeating you claim, WHY you contend one cannot ride those safeties?

Just for completeness’s sake, here are overhead views of the M&P and Browning safeties... not tiny, but hardly big extended safeties.

 

[JTQ]

It works fine for me.

I fiddle it off, and then fiddle it back on when I re-holster it.

You do ride it or you don't ride it?

 

[Zerodefect]

Who's fault is it that you can't ride those? The guy who can, or the guy that bought them?

I even ground a paddle safety down to just the little forward nub, like the original 1911's. I rode on that just fine. My Glock has an imaginary safety, and my thumb is right there, riding it as well.

Like this, I ride this all day long:

 

[Garandimal]

Maybe post a picture or two of your grip? Or try to actually explain, rather than simply repeating you claim, WHY you contend one cannot ride those safeties?

Just for completeness’s sake, here are overhead views of the M&P and Browning safeties... not tiny, but hardly big extended safeties.


View attachment 817083 View attachment 817084

Not the M&P Shield.

I actually have to open my grip to engage the Springfield fiddle-switch.




GR

 

[Garandimal]

Who's fault is it that you can't ride those? The guy who can, or the guy that bought them?

I even ground a paddle safety down to just the little forward nub, like the original 1911's. I rode on that just fine. My Glock has an imaginary safety, and my thumb is right there, riding it as well.

Like this, I ride this all day long:
View attachment 817092

Not complaining.

Very happy with the fiddle-switch. They are unobtrusive and even useful on occasion.

But they are not my primary safety.

​

GR

 

[cheygriz]

Why not use a DA/SA or Striker and eliminate the damnnable safety altogether?

 

[Garandimal]

Why not use a DA/SA or Striker and eliminate the damnnable safety altogether?

The problem arises when you have multiple platforms.

Like:
- GLOCK's (CCW/Truck/Woods)
- Springfield MIL-SPEC 1911-A1 (HD/Office/Camp)
- Sig P938 (CCW)

All have their place in my Shooting/SD environment.




GR

 

[ATLDave]

Chey’, that’s going in circles!! The point of this digression is that there is no need to dispense with a safety if one likes them. Learn a proper grip and they are a non-factor in terms of the things anti-safety folks argue.

 

[cheygriz]

Learn proper gun handling is there is no need for them.

 

[ATLDave]

Last photo for now. Here’s an illustration of why it is sub-optimal not to ride the safety. My right thumb here is on the safety. The heel of my left hand is all the way up against it. If I dropped my thumb below the safety, I’d be giving up valuable weak-hand real estate. Even if the safety were completely deactivated, I’d STILL want my right thumb up in that same area.

 

[ATLDave]

Learn proper gun handling is there is no need for them.

Learn proper gun handling and there is literally no downside.

 

[Garandimal]

Chey’, that’s going in circles!! The point of this digression is that there is no need to dispense with a safety if one likes them. Learn a proper grip and they are a non-factor in terms of the things anti-safety folks argue.

Learn proper gun handling and there is literally no downside.

Again, an academic argument.

Grab for your CCW Glock and pull out a P938 in a 3 second/3 AM threat mitigation encounter?

You got problems.




GR

 

[Garandimal]

Last photo for now. Here’s an illustration of why it is sub-optimal not to ride the safety. My right thumb here is on the safety. The heel of my left hand is all the way up against it. If I dropped my thumb below the safety, I’d be giving up valuable weak-hand real estate. Even if the safety were completely deactivated, I’d STILL want my right thumb up in that same area.

View attachment 817094

Bet you a boxcar load of nickels that, with that grip on either an OEM Springfield MIL-SPEC 1911-A1, Sig P938, or M&P Shield - you couldn't tell me the position of the safety, or manipulate it without breaking your grip.

And lets not even address one hand shooting, which is common, because your off-hand is warding off an attack/ carrying a light/ bracing or manipulating a barrier/ getting more ammo.

Fiddle-switch.




GR

 

[ATLDave]

Garand’, you keep making pronouncements about what I cannot do or what I will not be able to do. I think you need to actually EXPLAIN what the basis of your claims is. What PRECISELY do you contend is going to happen at 3am, and how will that bear on the grip that I use EVERY time I handle a semi-auto pistol?

 

[ATLDave]

Bet you a boxcar load of nickels that, with that grip on either an OEM Springfield MIL-SPEC 1911-A1, Sig P938, or M&P Shield - you couldn't tell me the position of the safety, or manipulate it without breaking your grip.GR

I absolutely can. Because if my thumb is on top of it, it’s off.

This is truly a bizarre discussion. I think you simply have no idea what people who use the STANDARD method of handling 1911-ish guns do.

 

[Garandimal]

I absolutely can. Because if my thumb is on top of it, it’s off.

This is truly a bizarre discussion. I think you simply have no idea what people who use the STANDARD method of handling 1911-ish guns do.

So you re-engage the fiddle-switch without breaking that grip? Then your thumb is under the fiddle switch when it's engaged? With that grip? and then you reach up and disengage it when you need it?




GR

 

[Riomouse911]

I have noticed in the past that trained Military Police can draw, rack the slide, and fire a 1911 about 99 percent as fast as a shooter with a cocked and locked weapon.

There is much to like about condition three. I would be reluctant to tell the Military Police or the Israelis that they're wrong.

That works well if you:

Train to the level of proficiency of an Army MP or Israeli solder. 95% of shooters aren’t even close.,.. and I am including police officers and sheriffs deputies in this number.

And... have both hands free to perform such a maneuver. You can’t do it with something in your hand (like your phone dialing 911), if you are fending off an attack with your off hand while drawing your sidearm, or only have one hand available due to injury, etc.

Outside of the Army, which operates under very strict rules catering to the lowest soldiers ability, and the Israelis,who are under constant threat and can be some seriously capable badasses, you’ll be hard pressed to find any first-responding agency who employs that carry mode. I wouldn’t recommend it to anyone carrying for self protection, unless they dedicate themselves to train to the level described above.

Stay safe!

 

[ATLDave]

So you re-engage the fiddle-switch without breaking that grip? Then your thumb is under the fiddle switch when it's engaged? With that grip? and then you reach up and re-engage it when you need it?

GR

No, I’m not switching the safety on and off with the gun in-hand. The safety is for bolstering and carrying. Not for when the gun is being used.

 

[Zaydok Allen]

You cannot. Which is why they are dumb!

LOL! And that's why the only 92 series gun I own is a G model.

This thread........wow

 

[Fine Figure of a Man]

This is truly a bizarre discussion.

Yes it is, and oddly entertaining as well.

 

[Garandimal]

No, I’m not switching the safety on and off with the gun in-hand. The safety is for bolstering and carrying. Not for when the gun is being used.

With an extended safety, sure.

For the OEM fiddle-switch, what difference does it make - if you already disengage it with the draw?

So as long as you shoot that platform, that way, no problem.

Mix in a GLOCK, and a few diminutive manual safeties, maybe one-handed, and see how you do when you don't have time to sort it out.




GR

 

[ATLDave]

LOL! And that's why the only 92 series gun I own is a G model

Funny thing... the earliest, Italian model 92’s had a frame mounted, down to fire safety (and the Taurus clones still do). The US DoD wanted a decocker, though, and that required a slide mounted device in the Beretta.

A few times, Beretta made special versions with a FMDTF safety. Probably the only 92 I’d be really psyched to get is the Steel I, which combined a steel (not alloy) frame with a Framr safety. They made very few of these, though.