Why are the handgun bullets heavier rifle bullets?

[jeepnik]

If you look at caliber rifle and handgun of the same caliber, the rifle usually has a heavier bullet.

There are exceptions, but for the most part it applies. Comparing different calibers with regard to weight is even more apples and oranges.

 

[1911Tuner]

Unless I missed something, one point that hasn't been mentioned is the rifle's role in the scheme of things.

The rifle's main attribute is reach. With a rifle, one can attack from a distance far beyond the reach of a sidearm. With distance comes bullet drop. Velocity flattens trajectory and thus not only provides a better chance of hitting the target at distance, but also with enough energy and momentum to do sufficient damage to the target to incapacitate it at these ranges.

Just food for thought.

 

[Propforce]

Well, that is part of it. However, the fact that the bullet lost almost half of its weight (22 grs.) by shedding those petals means that the base (28 grs.) had a lot less momentum to drive deeper into the gel block. I am not sure that I'd want to rely on such a bullet for SD, but some folks do find this sort of performance to be exactly what they want.

481,

You are a quantative guy. Let me ask you the following :

If the M4/AR-15 demonstrates effective killing power to 300 yds with 55 gr bullet out of a16 in barrel at ~3,000 ft/s, what is the needed muzzle velocity for a 55 gr bullet out of a 5 inch barrel to be an effective man-stopper out only to 50 yds?

We can assume in both cases they are the same .223 rem bullet diameter.

 

[Jim Watson]

2100 fps
Which will be a good trick out of a handgun.
The .22 TCM gets a 40 gr to 1875 fps and the vaunted 5.7 FN has 28-31 gr at 2050-2130.

 

[strambo]

Yes, around 2000 fps is the threshold where you start to get permanent tissue damage in the temporary stretch cavity. Problem with handguns is in order to get this velocity you have to use such a small and light bullet it (generally) will neither penetrate enough or create that big of a wound anyway.

The 5.7 out of a 16" barrel is about like a 5.56 out of a SBR so it is doing decent.

In my googling of the 5.7 out of a pistol it looks like most shots I see, penetration is in the 9" range, but a few are 12-13" A 12-13" penetrating load would be a solid choice. The 5.7 seems to make the concept work for close in work, the stuff of pistols and PDWs, add any distance and the round quickly gets below 2000 fps and you just get a .22 hole.

There is a photo on the FiveSevenforum where a 22lb pork shoulder was shot with a 5.7 pistol and it graphically demonstrates what 2000+ fps velocity gets you, a 4" wide permanent wound cavity. It penetrated 9", but that is in solid muscle, so in gel it would have went further.

I don't own a 5.7 or care about them one way or the other, but it is an easily researched way to see the light/fast (~2000 fps) concept in action.

 

[mavracer]

If the M4/AR-15 demonstrates effective killing power to 300 yds with 55 gr bullet out of a16 in barrel at ~3,000 ft/s, what is the needed muzzle velocity for a 55 gr bullet out of a 5 inch barrel to be an effective man-stopper out only to 50 yds?

There is no black and white answer, there are too many variables, different body tissues that react much differently to temporary cavitation, 2000fps isn't a magic number where it all of a sudden appears, Sometimes damage from temporary cavitation can be evident at a much lower velocity.

 

[481]

481,

You are a quantative guy. Let me ask you the following :

If the M4/AR-15 demonstrates effective killing power to 300 yds with 55 gr bullet out of a16 in barrel at ~3,000 ft/s, what is the needed muzzle velocity for a 55 gr bullet out of a 5 inch barrel to be an effective man-stopper out only to 50 yds?

We can assume in both cases they are the same .223 rem bullet diameter.

Can't say without a concrete definition of ''effective man-stopper'' and answering that question merely in terms of "muzzle velocity" would be to mislead intentionally.

As pointed out above, "There is no black and white answer..."

 

[BlindJustice]

Propforce - JHPs are designed for the usual velocity range of the
bullet diameter. Velocity is not necessarily king. Greaater bullet
weight = greater momentum

45 ACP HD/SD 230 gr. 900 FPS and reliable expansion with many
different JHPs Gold Dots, Golden saber, Fed HST etc.

a 55 gr. in 9mm or .45 cal wouldn't be much of a Ballistic Coefficient

Usually heavier cuz handguns have bigger bores than most rifle
cartridges

R-

 

[olafhardtB]

Some of this has been done by making the projectiles out of lighter materials. Check out cast zinc bullets. I once saw an article on home defense 44 magnum loads turned out of oak. I have a 1/2 inch aluminum rod that I intend to saw up into wadcutters to shoot out of my 500 S&W Handirifle.

 

[tipoc]

There has been more than one attempt to manufacture and sell aluminum bullets that travel at very high velocity. You can use the search function here or Google it to see past discussions of very light weight bullets. 55 gr. 45s and such.

The general problem with them is that they lack penetration and very rapidly lose energy once they strike something. They also often break up. While recoil is reportedly light there is usually a good deal of muzzle flash and noise.

They often produce very ugly and damaging wounds which show wide cratering a few inches deep with pieces of the material traveling some deeper. Similar to the Glazer safety slugs or a 410 shotgun shell from a handgun.

I think it's easy to forget that the 5.56 and the AR weren't designed primarily for long range shooting and lethality against humans. While this varmint round can do that and do it accurately it was primarily placed in the AR with accurate 3 round bursts and full auto in mind and still being controllable, which the .308 from the M14 was not. They also wanted it to be able to make longer range shots.

It isn't just material and weight that are factors. Powder and pressures are also a factor.

There is a trade off for trying to get a handgun to fire even a light weight bullet at 2500 fps. There is considerable debate over whether you gain much at all with the Five-Seven for example.

tipoc

 

[mboylan]

RC, thanks for the link. At least it validates the theory of significant velocity increase, but noted there are other mechanical issues needed to be worked out.

The problem is you need 556 velocities for that little bullet to be effective and you will not get that in a common handgun case.