Why do people buy guns?

[General Geoff]

To folks like the OP's friend, the gun literally IS just a tool, like a fire extinguisher or a power drill. There's nothing wrong with that. He's ostensibly put a mag or two of ammo through it, and loaded up the rest of the box of WWB in it and keeps it in his bedroom drawer.

That's perfectly fine. He's not looking to become an IDPA top ranking shooter or anything, he just wants something to help in case of a home invasion. It's simply not a priority to him, to practice monthly with it or whatever. Again, nothing wrong with that. He's better prepared than half the folks out there.

 

[The Gunman]

He has no clue as to how it works or how to fix it should it break. My theory is that if you have a gun for home defense you need to be excellent at many things......even in the dark. Shooting with each hand, loading, fixing jams, moving while shooting, kneeling, laying prone, everything. If you arent at least good at those its probably more dangerous to have a gun than it is to not have one.

Please take this as an observation and not as a personal attack, after all, you asked our opinions.

That sounds almost like the argument used against carry laws. You seem to indicate that if someone is not at expert at armed defense they should not be allowed to have a firearm.

As far as how it works or how to fix it, how many people drive cars that are not ASE certified mechanics?

A person doesn't need to be a gunsmith to operate a firearm, although I do believe anyone who has a firearm should be competent in handling it safely and that includes operations like loading and unloading. Heck, most people couldn't explain how a microwave oven works or how to fix one.

If I may make a suggestion, when you go to shoot offer to take him along. (Sounds like you have.) You might even suggest cleaning and maintenance or offer to help as a concern for his safety.

Blunt honest observation, it sounds like you really like the gun and are upset he won't sell it to you. On the other hand, you may be like me and feel sick to your stomach to see good firearms being treated like an old shovel rusting away in the shed.

 

[Homerboy]

Well, I totally diasagree with a person owning a gun and not at least devoting enough time (2-300 rounds a year) to become proficient with it.

Guns are not fire extinguishers. They are a lethal weapon that, if used by untrained hands, can seriously injure or kill a person. I wouldn't have such a problem with it if it was strictly a range gun, but anybody who buys a gun for protection, and then doesn't take the time to learn to use it, is irresponsbile. God forbid he has to use that gun for protection. Even experienced shooters have a horrible hit ratio in real life and death situations. Now you have some guy who barely knows which end of the gun is the dangerous end trying to use it? Bullets go through walls. Can't even tell you how many times I have seen somebody buy a gun, ask how many rounds go in the clip, where is the safety (usually on a Glock), and why does the slide stay back when I am empty? They are accidents waiting to happen. Does your friend even know that the gun is still loaded and capable of firing with the mag out? A good friend of mine has a gun for the last 5 years, and he did not know that when I picked it up to inspect it for him the last time I saw him. he left the mag out of the gun but the bullet chambered "in case his son ever found the gun, he can't fire it". Not to mention the dust unnies that fell out of it when I removed the slide.

 

[donato]

I own a handgun mostly because I like to go to the range and shoot - used to be on a pistol team. Secondly, they do serve as a home defense measure. My long guns were purchased for the purpose of hunting.

 

[edSky]

I think it is a combination of many things. You have some you like, and like to shoot, but don't want to "wear them out." Then you want some of different calibers (and you need to double up since you don't want to wear them out, either). Then there are different barrel lengths, manufacturers, applications, features (bobtails?), etc.

And we haven't even gotten out of the 1911-types yet!

Fire-extinguishers? Bought one the first day I christened my man-cave (reloading bench).

 

[boostedxt]

Please take this as an observation and not as a personal attack, after all, you asked our opinions.

That sounds almost like the argument used against carry laws. You seem to indicate that if someone is not at expert at armed defense they should not be allowed to have a firearm.

As far as how it works or how to fix it, how many people drive cars that are not ASE certified mechanics?

A person doesn't need to be a gunsmith to operate a firearm, although I do believe anyone who has a firearm should be competent in handling it safely and that includes operations like loading and unloading. Heck, most people couldn't explain how a microwave oven works or how to fix one.

If I may make a suggestion, when you go to shoot offer to take him along. (Sounds like you have.) You might even suggest cleaning and maintenance or offer to help as a concern for his safety.

Blunt honest observation, it sounds like you really like the gun and are upset he won't sell it to you. On the other hand, you may be like me and feel sick to your stomach to see good firearms being treated like an old shovel rusting away in the shed.

none taken... I like didnt opinions and am 100% open to them.

Here is the thing. If i wanted to have the gun...I would just go and buy one just like his.

However...there is a difference between knowing how to fix a car with major mechanical issues and being able to change a tire. He has no clue really how the gun works. My issues is this....when we went shooting if the gun jammed he handed it me. Instead of learning how to fix it, which I showed him how, he just didnt care. THAT is my problem. Yes he has a gun which might make him feel safe....but is he? Experienced shooters miss their target under pressure..what does that mean for an inexperienced shooter?

my issue is this...having shot with him he is NOT competent and the only way for him to become competent is to practice.


joe

 

[ChCx2744]

I don't know if this question has been asked yet, and if it has, I apologize, but...What kind of gun is it?

 

[mesinge2]

gun collectors no more consider their guns as weapons than coin collectors consider their collections as pocket change

Jim Keenan, I really like this statement.

 

[The Gunman]

boostedxt-

He has no clue really how the gun works. My issues is this....when we went shooting if the gun jammed he handed it me. Instead of learning how to fix it, which I showed him how, he just didnt care.

Then we are in agreement for sure!


Sounds like a lack of ambition on his part. You might express to him the need to safely handle and operate the weapon. Just keep in mind he may not have the same passion for firearms you do.

Sorry, when I read your original post, I had just gotten done with the "technical" stuff in the gunsmithing section of the forum. When you mentioned knowledge of how it works I was thinking a bit more complicated. I was reading "how it works" and "how to fix it" and thinking "complete dis assembly and repair"...wow.

 

[Ed Ames]

OTOH, his behavior (handing the jammed gun over instead of fixing it, etc) could easily be a reaction to you.

I know several people who do that type of thing specifically to shut down or mess with "over enthusiastic" people. They might be very computer savvy (build their own computers, work with 3+ operating systems, etc) but they play totally disinterested around "enthusiasts", right up to the point of letting someone else deal with issues, specifically because they don't want all conversations to turn to computers. Same deal with cars... I know people who have done significant work on their cars, are interested in cars, but don't want all conversations to turn into motorhead posturing sessions so they play dumb. I've even seen it with guns.

Your friend could be doing that with you and guns. He may have decided that if he shows too much interest you will never talk about anything else.

Just a thought.

 

[boostedxt]

OTOH, his behavior (handing the jammed gun over instead of fixing it, etc) could easily be a reaction to you.

I know several people who do that type of thing specifically to shut down or mess with "over enthusiastic" people. They might be very computer savvy (build their own computers, work with 3+ operating systems, etc) but they play totally disinterested around "enthusiasts", right up to the point of letting someone else deal with issues, specifically because they don't want all conversations to turn to computers. Same deal with cars... I know people who have done significant work on their cars, are interested in cars, but don't want all conversations to turn into motorhead posturing sessions so they play dumb. I've even seen it with guns.

Your friend could be doing that with you and guns. He may have decided that if he shows too much interest you will never talk about anything else.

when the gun jammed I stayed back and watched. I wanted to see how he would handle it. I am an instructor and teacher, not with firearms, so I enjoy watching how someone reacts to something and then instruct them on the good and bad of their actions.

he has never once mentioned the gun...besides wanting to buy one and go shoot it andhave it for HD. I helped him, then thats where Gun talk has ended.

joe

 

[Shadow 7D]

You might want to offer him a trade for an alarm system (you pay installation or first year or so) and a good dog, and point out how much more useful they could be without the "danger" of having a loaded gun around.

 

[Ed Ames]

The only good reason I can see for disarming someone (including convincing them to trade gun for alarm) is if you intend to rob them. If you don't plan to take advantage of their disarmed state why are you so eager to disarm them?

 

[aprayinbear]

Don't hate me guys but.....

I have no problem with somebody stashing a gun away in the nightstand for self-defense. That's a reasonable choice. But if that guy (or gal) isn't proficient with safe firing and use of that gun, then they become a danger to themselves and to others. And that should never happen. I sure respect dealers that won't sell until they have thoroughly demonstrated to the customer how to properly use the firearm they are buying. And if someone didn't have the time to learn, then I have no problem with saying "no gun for you." We do it with drivers licenses, why not with firearms?

Case in point.... years ago, as an adult, I delivered newspapers from my car to make a little extra $$. That means I was on the streets and alleyways every morning around 3 a.m. One morning a police officer pulled up in front of me while another pulled up behind me. The guy in front jumped out of his car, crouched down behind his car door, pulled his weapon, pointed it straight at me and yelled " Get the &%^$# out of the car with your hands up." All the while I was praying, "I hope he knows how to use his gun!" I knew I was just a few pounds of fingertip pressure away from being shot! Fortunately he realized who I was, lowered his gun, jumped in the car and sped away. I couldn't help but ask myself, "what would of happened if he wasn't properly trained. Or what about your friend if he approached the milkman (who he thought was a thief) squeezing that trigger for all his life.

My response.... Training and practise and nothing less if you plan to own a gun. By the way I love to shoot, own several guns and learned how to shoot at an NRA club for kids when I was 11. The lessons are still fresh.

 

[Shadow 7D]

I meant it more sarcastically, as that is the antigun line, Sorry I should have expanded that.

 

[f4t9r]

I know a guy who bought a pistol in 38spl just so he had something to protect his family if needed. He did shoot some back years ago but has not used the gun for many years. The big reason is he has the right to own a firearm.

 

[Vern Humphrey]

I have no problem with somebody stashing a gun away in the nightstand for self-defense. That's a reasonable choice. But if that guy (or gal) isn't proficient with safe firing and use of that gun, then they become a danger to themselves and to others.

Statistics say otherwise. Just this week I posted the latest national accident statistics (which are a few years behind -- takes a while, I suppose to collect and check the data) which indicates there are less than 800 fatal firearms accidents annually in a nation of 300 million.

 

[Ed Ames]

That story about being a paperboy and getting assaulted doesn't seem to fit in this thread. If anybody does that you have a responsibility to stop them. At the very least you should've been on the phone to the state police saying that people in what looked like cop cars are driving around pointing guns at people and then driving off before they can be identified.

It certainly has nothing to do with the level of training or skill and knowledge needed to safely keep a gun in your home.

 

[rogertc1]

Collecting guns has been a 40 year obsession of mine. Need less to say I have a lot and have not fired over 3/4 of them nor desire to. I have plenty to shoot yet I have many older firearms too. Example is I just got a Jap Type 26 revolver cause it was so darn interesting and because I didn't have one. I like the mechanics and history of firearms. Also have 6 cars n trucks too and I can only drive one at a time.

 

[surfinUSA]

There are alot more gun owners than shooters. Especially when there is a violent crime spike in their city.

Most of these folks would probably be best served whith a 38/357 revolver with a 3-4 inch barrel from S&W, Colt or Ruger. Just as many or the new breed of PO that wouldn't carry a gun if they didn't have to.

But are surprisingly able to protect themselves when a threat prevents itself. Even though they only shoot once a year when they have to qualify and probably clean their gun only after an inspection and are ordered to do so , and then do a mediocore job.

The nice thing about revolvers and DAO semis is you only have to recognize the threat, whixh is usually at close range get the gun out. Natural pointing abilty and a healthy does of luck is what saves these people.

 

[Dannix]

With no hard data, I would imagine most "fire extinguisher type" gun owners own shotguns. imho not all that hard to use a pump shotgun in an HD situation, esp. if they were the kind that grew up with bb guns at their grandparents or some such.


To the OP - do you have a fire extinguisher? When was the last time you tried to put out a fire with one? How long did it take to put out? Was it just a small pan fire (= range shooting) or a real, serious fire (= proper firearm training)? I don't think you are properly considering the risk to your family caused by fires. Fires kill more people than home intruders do.

I have a fire extinguisher in the pantry...I think. I haven't seen it for about 15 years, but I'm sure it's still back there somewhere, covered in dust. I find it hard to slight someone treating a "just in case" HD gun the same way, though, true, you can't smother an intruder with a semi-auto the way you can a fire with an auto full mag dump of a fire extinguisher. The apathy wouldn't be such an issue it was a ww2 surplus tommy/sten/mp40 by the night stand.