Why Stay

[hrgrisso]

I’ve been mulling posting this question over for quite some time. I mention that to share that my intent is not to offend but to truly gain insight and I didn’t want to post it until I could put into words my thoughts.

I ask those that live in areas where self defense via modern means i.e. firearms/knives and even pepper spray etc. are banned and trampled upon.

Great Britain
Europe
Eastern Europe
Russia,
New York
California

Why do you stay? I apologize if the question is impertinent but I know that I grow weary of anti’s moving to Az from California. I would love to welcome brother and sisters in arms from around the globe, as I know that many others would as well.

Especially if, upon arrival would join us in the working to reverse the anti’s progress and continue in promoting a realistic world view.

At what point is enough just that?

I know of the desire to stay in the land of your forebears, but is it realistic to believe that the current trends of foreign nations will be reversed? Just as those members in Cali and other states that may be too far gone, isn’t it time to push off and seek refuge in states with more appropriate world views? I mean to keep this respectful. Thank you for your time?

 

[Thernlund]

You have to feel pretty strongly, almost extraordinarily so, to pick up and move your entire life just out of principle. It's just not that easy.


-T.

 

[ArmedBear]

We're fortunate to live in a very, very nice place, with a whole lot of reasons to stay. Outdoor recreation is a big deal to me, and we have lots of it, and conditions that make it fun to be outside all but a few days per year. Surfing is fun, too. And I really hate hot humid days with biting insects everywhere; we don't have days, or months, like that, here.

It's not an easy choice to leave that place, with all it offers, just so I can remove a tiny modification from my AR-15. Honestly, I'm pretty well-armed. 10-day waiting periods for firearms purchases are a PITA, but that's all they are. We don't have FOID's, pistol permits, or the like, either.

I've been to a number of other places in the US, and many of them make me damn glad to go home. Not all of them do, and a move to one of the places that seem attractive may be in the cards at some point.

Now if I lived in some other parts of California, I'd probably already be gone. Guns would be only one little factor in that.

 

[Shortdog22]

Complacency, cowardice, and shamelessness. Those words explain the general public. If more were like you, our country would be much better.

 

[The Tourist]

This might come as a shock to firearms enthusiasts, but not everyone chooses a home using guns as a deciding objective. I don't, and wouldn't.

I like my home area. My family is here, as is my wife's family. I enjoy the change of seasons. I have a beautiful home. Based upon my job, income and social network, I got to retire as a younger man.

I could never do all of those things living in the most gun-friendly areas of the country.

Truth be told, I never believed in the JBT conspiracy theory for the future of a Mad Max style America.

 

[Tribal]

You have to feel pretty strongly, almost extraordinarily so, to pick up and move your entire life just out of principle. It's just not that easy.

Either that, or have virtually no other choice. Many immigrants to America came because, had they stayed where they were, they would have starved or been killed. Others were forcibly compelled to leave their homelands. Leaving your family and all your friends is hard, and sometimes obligations (such as sick parents) prevent people from leaving.

Also, we can't always be running. Sometimes you need to be one of the ones who will stay and help turn the tide.

 

[Kingcreek]

many people, many reasons...
Illinois is not on the list but could be. some of my reasons are:
I live in a house I built myself on a nice piece of land that I own in a beautiful rural area.
I have an aged mother 6 miles away that lives on her own but relies on me for many things.
family, including grandchildren within an hours drive.
a business that I own, that is not easily portable. moving would mean starting over in my 50's.
some of the best whitetail deer hunting on the planet and a generous archery season.

 

[CountGlockula]

Everything is not ALL about guns.

There are other major factors for me staying in CA; but the future is in the Lord's hands so there's no telling where he'll put my family.

Besides, CA has the highest minimum wage status...great insurance when having kids...etc. Too many other pros to choose from and of course cons.

But again, it's not ALL about guns in my opinion.

 

[ctdonath]

I stayed in NY because of family. Some things are more important than relatively abstract concepts. FWIW, in NY (not NYC) I owned Glocks, a pre-ban AR-15, even a class III item. For all the BS there you can still own & carry some pretty serious hardware (.50BMG, no-flash-suppressor ARs & AKs, older high-cap mags, even carry while drinking at a bar) so long as you shuffle thru the paperwork, consider your applications, ignore the hysteria, and lean with the legal winds. For all the hype, it's not so bad as to warrant moving for that reason alone.

Subsequently, I left.
Once you move, you learn doing so isn't all that bad.

 

[hrgrisso]

Turn the Tide

I understand the sentiment of wanting to stay and fight the good fight. But at what point is enough enough? I was reading the posting today about GB knife laws. So part of the question I guess is what is the breaking point?

I know that not everyone will move/leave I get that, but what keeps someone in essential servitude/slavery.

Also I was wondering the thoughts of more of our European/Foreign members but thanks to those that have answered from our coasts.


BTW: Never considered WI the bastion of liberal rights infringment...

 

[Josh Aston]

Why Stay

When I saw the thread title I thought you were asking why you should stay. I was going to say so you can finish your story.

 

[Gunsby_Blazen]

I would assume people stay to be close to their job or maybe be close to their families...
There are alot of compelling reasons why a person would stay in a state or country that only grants them limited rights. I live in Illinois and its not one of the most free states in terms of gun rights but I have lived here all my life and i have family here. I don't think I could leave just to get a few more gun rights. I have pride in where I grew up and where I am from so I reckon I will have to stay here and fight the good fight.

 

[strat81]

People do not like to leave their comfort zone. Some folks refuse to move out of their county, let alone their state.

Family is important but family doesn't pay my bills. I followed the money (and the lower cost of living) out of NYC and into NE.

 

[PTK]

I didn't stay - I grew up in Boston. I now live in Colorado. It's a nice change.

 

[RP88]

let's be honest: there is more to life than guns. It shouldnt be to where we actually have to make that sacrifice, but the fact is that it is like that for alot of people.

I'll be transferring to a college soon from my current community college right next to my house. I may be living on campus for a bit. That means that my guns will either stay locked up in my parents' house, or I'll have to hopefully find a parking garage that isnt part of the campus, and keep everything in the trunk of my car, or a decent place to store them. Since I'm not very comfortable with doing either, my guns most likely won't be with me. Sucks, but life will go on. Or, at least until I get my own place.

luckily, the only anti-gun place I'd ever consider is Cali, because the other places are dirty, crowded, expensive, and cold.

 

[ArmedBear]

I grew up in Boston. I now live in Colorado. It's a nice change.

That would be a much easier choice than the one I face.

Denver, though, wants to kill one of my dogs. No thanks.

 

[bikerdoc]

grandpa left Sicily for west virginia, dad left WV for Mass, I grew up in boston left to go into army went back when I got out and hated it, got divorced, and came to viginia with everything I owned in my truck, married a local girl and have been happy ever since

 

[Joe Cool]

A good question.. but

You cannot always optimize everything.
You can add NJ to the list of NY and CA...

Are family and lifelong friends nearby? Check.
Kids doing well in school, friends, activities? Check.
Great job? Check.
Nice home? Check.
Good Tax situation? No!
CCW Gun Rights? No!
Can I still shoot at the range and teach my son to hunt? Check.
Retire here? No!

Decision - stay and fight or run away from it?
I'd rather stay and fight, call me both stubborn & idealistic, but that's my choice.

 

[BrianB]

My family and business are here. until I can afford to move them (two other households) and my income somewhere else, I'll probably have to stay.

Besides, my dissenting vote is needed here to counter the anti's in NE Illinois.

 

[hrgrisso]

Thanks

For those reading/responding thanks!

Let me add to this that I understand life is not all about guns. I understand leaving family/friends is hard.

But usually the infringment of one liberty is just a sign of a greater disease (which is why so many of use guns as a litmus test for candidates). So my question is more societal than gun.

As to college, I understand the issues related to college as I am in my last year of my BS and I've still got at LEAST four more years of college. Thankfully I've managed to work out a way to live off campus every year of college.

I really am looking for genuine responses. Thanks!

BTW: Post 600 not too shabby as I try not to be a thread hog.

 

[Mr White]

Same sentiments as the Count and the Tourist. Its not all about guns. I happen t be fortunate enough to live in a great state for gun ownership, but if that changes tomorow, I'd figure out a way to deal with it, but it wouldn't include moving.

I have family here as does my wife. We live in a nice, crime free small town. We have friends and jobs and all the things that make for a good life. Packing it all up and starting over somewhere else just to satisfy one of my interests wouldn't be a reasonable thing to do.

 

[ArmedBear]

Let me add to this that I understand life is not all about guns. I understand leaving family/friends is hard.

That ain't it.

In fact, when it comes to some other liberties, California is better than many states.

It's a tradeoff. California may not be the best compromise right now, but it has been, and we own property here already.

 

[bluto]

Good question.

First, it isn't easy to abandon your job, pick up your family, and go somewhere else with the hope that the laws where you're moving don't change. It's also very costly. And it won't, in the long run, be the solution.

I see that you've listed Eurasia in your post. Might as well throw in Australia and South America while we're at it. We're really "it" as far as armed freedom to defend yourself against government tyranny goes. Believe me, a lot of Europeans, Aussies, Asians, and South Americans would be "moving" to this country if they had a had a contiguous border with the U.S. And a lot of them would bring anti-gun sentiments with them - with the possible exception of former eastern block residents.

There's another element to your question and that's the apparent tendency of gun owners to resist activism. How many gun owners are there in the U.S.? 30 million? 50 million? More? Pick any state, including mine, and I bet you'll find that only a tiny fraction of gun owners write their congressmen, contribute to the NRA (What, like, 5 million members? Pathetic. It should be 50 million), or even bother to vote. If they do vote, it certainly can't be in a block. I think a lot of gun owners are perfectly willing to let a few of their number do all the heavy lifting. And that's killing us.

If we acted like the lefties and got organized we might reverse this trend even in "lost" causes. Look at the Heller case. That's in D.C. for god's sake. The strictest gun laws in the country. If it can be done there, it can be done anywhere.

Finally, there's the worst part: those gun owners who not only write off whole territories of the U.S., but spend hours and hours and thousands of words getting angry and insulting/blaming their fellow gun owners instead of joining the cause. To me, THAT's the real reason we've lost so many rights.

You mentioned anti's moving to Arizona. I love AZ and would like to move there when I retire. But by that time it may be more like California than not. To me, that's a direct result of making excuses NOT to get involved: "Its too late", "I'd rather spend those NRA dues on another gun", "When it gets too bad I'll just move", "I'll just bury my guns before they come to get them." We've all heard it and even felt that way at one time or another. Myself included.

Circumstances, in the short run, may prompt me to leave this state if my right to gun ownership is forfeited. In the long run though, anti-gun sentiment will spread because anti-gun activists are more devoted to their shameless cause than we are to our righteous one.

 

[Harley Quinn]

Life style and being aware of your surroundings is important. If you are in fear all the time move, if not enjoy.

Firearms are not important to many people, if they are important they seem to dictate what you do, when you do it, or why you do it.

Regards

 

[camslam]

Different priorities for different people.

Guns aren't the only consideration for where to live, but for me they are a big one.

In our lifetime I don't think it is a matter so much of "if" as "when" you are going to need a firearm for something.

Living in an area that restricts your ability to use a firearm when needed, or makes the use of a firearm so prohibitively costly in consequences is just not something I care to do.

I have never had to pull my CCW, but there have been 3 times where I have been EXTREMELY glad I had it with me. If I were to live in certain areas, that would not have been an option.

Like I said at the end of the day it is different priorities for different people. Nothing wrong with that, we just all have to be willing to live with our choices.