Wilderness shootings

[spentbrass]

Deltaboy, (can't find a quote function?)
I do hike alone at times, that's why I carry. A couple of years ago two women were out hiking on a very popular trail and were murdered. It's turned into a cold case. That incidence shook the hiking community here to the core, and that was when I decided I was going to carry a firearm while hiking, where legal, absolutely of course.
Sometimes you have to hike alone, sometimes the solitude is nice, but I guess you're never alone when you have Sturm Ruger & Co with you!

 

[LAK]

Arbor

The wilderness is probably one of the least likely places in the world for you to be attacked by other humans. I have been a serious backpacker for years, and I can tell you it is not worth the extra weight to pack a firearm. People don't get robbed in the backcountry. Once you get even ten miles from the road, the odds of you needing to defend yourself from someone are very slim at best.

On the contrary it is quite common - though spread perhaps more thinly in a geographical sense than the urban areas, and not often broadcast or written about by the larger metropolitan news services.

While it is arguable that the risks are lower than some more populated cities, some of the potential consequences are much higher for vaious reasons already noted.

And that is aside from some of the four legged critters to think about. Bears come to mind; not so often thought of are feral dogs which sometimes run in packs; nationwide dog attacks are very common and not isolated to any particular type of environment or areas.

I will gladly packed the extra few pounds thanks.

-----------------------------------------------

http://gtr5.com
http://ssunitedstates.org

 

[PBinWA]

I almost always open carry when hiking in the woods. It's legal in WA state and more often than not the few people I run into are also carrying.

We all have the same reasoning - bear protection.

 

[Mainsail]

I regularly hike the Cascades and the Olympics and usually carry a .45 1911 or a .44 Alaskan. The threats as I see them are illegal grows, 2-legged lunatics, surprising a car prowler at the trailhead, or hungry animals desiring to demonstrate their opinion of their place in the food chain. Some hikers think being armed is silly, other do not. Since you’ve already decided to carry, I won’t entertain that debate. I will suggest that if you’re hiking in the National Forests or Wilderness areas, carry openly. If you need it, trying to grab your handgun from your pack or under a shirt (which is under a pack belt) will be too slow.

I'm also going to suggest that you look at ham radio if you consider communication necessary. A mayday call to the appropriate sheriff will minimize any false reporting by the bad guy should you need to draw. Cell phones are useless almost everywhere unless you’re doing one of the hikes along the I90 corridor. A ham license costs about $20 and a decent VHF radio is $100 to $200 depending on what bells and whistles excite you. The geography in Washington is excellent for amateur radio with repeaters atop some pretty high peaks.

A few months ago I was with a large hiking party going to the Big Hump on the Duckabush trail. To get to Big Hump you have to depart the established trail and hike ‘own navigation’ to the hump. As our group had gotten strung out along the trail we kept in touch via ham radios on the Wilderness protocol frequency. This is a simplex frequency so no repeaters were used. At the Hump, I was surprised to get a call from a 10-year-old girl on Mercer Island, over 40 miles away! That’s 40 miles with hand held radio running about three or four watts. We were also speaking to a friend in Bremerton, about the same distance. With a repeater I can talk to almost all of western Washington, using that same hand held radio.

 

[expvideo]

If a tree falls in the woods...

ETA:
Hey Mainsail! I like the pics. I could tell that was Washington before I even saw who posted them. Beautiful!

 

[MostlyHarmless]

I've spent a lot of time in the wilderness, almost always alone, most of it in Georgia and Tennesee, some in Colorado, some in Minnesota. Most of it in really remote country where nobody goes.

I think a few words on threat assessment are important. There are a few wilderness areas which are dangerous. There have been well-publicized incidents near the Appalachian Trail, for example. The presence of large numbers of hikers (seasonally), the AT culture of poverty and reliance on others, and the easy access of portions of the trail to populated areas, combines to create crime problems not entirely different from the crime problems in non-wilderness areas.

Therefore, some threat assessment is called for. If you are on the AT, or somewhere else where the density of hikers is high and civilization is conveniently close, be careful, you're still in the city, in a way. In truly remote areas, no people = no threat from people. In areas that are rarely frequented despite having easy access, you have to pay attention for marijuana grow or meth lab operations.

Carrying won't help much with most of that. In the wilderness, you can be surprised.

 

[coloradokevin]

In Ohio, several years ago, down in Mohican State Park, some knucklehead who worked at Diebold in Canton decided to go "people hunting" Worst case scenario huh? You'd never have a chance to draw in self defense. I think about that when I hike in isolated areas

That deal was no joke. I was a kid growing up in OH when those shootings were going on, and I remember that it was a legitimate concern for hunting for a couple of years.

We used to hunt near those areas on occasion, and I remember my friend's parents (who took us hunting) were extra vigilant on at least a couple of times out.

I spend a great deal of time in the wilderness... even more time than I spend involved in shootings sports. When my schedule was far more flexible a few years back I would log over 100 nights per year in the backcountry!

The wilderness environment is certainly unique in terms of how encounters with criminals might be handled:

1) You are very unlikely to run into a psychopath deep in the wilderness. These encounters seem more likely on "fringe" areas, such as near-urban open spaces, and the first mile or two from a trailhead. Exceptions are always possible!

2) Although you may be further from trouble, you are also further from help. You will be forced to resolve the situation yourself, and may not have "back-up" for days.

3) All the normal rules apply, but the margin of safety could be greater. In other words, I will more carefully guard my "personal space" when I'm completely alone, if a situation starts to feel "off". Furthermore, guns can be more readily visible in a wilderness environment than they can in the city environment (I'm not necessarily talking about pointing it at a potential threat, or using the gun as an idle threat, but rather at least recognizing that you can have the gun out... after all, you can target shoot in many wilderness areas already).

Honestly, I consider humans to be a very small threat when I'm deep in the backcountry. Environmental factors and animal encounters rank much higher on my list of backcountry concerns. Still, an ounce of prevention...

 

[thirdeagle]

Recently, a young woman was murdered and beheaded in north Georgia. She was encountered while day hiking in the woods, subdued, tied to a tree, and then killed sometime later by her attacker.

A couple of years ago a family was confronted by a black bear in east TN; in or around the Smokey's, I believe. IIRC, the mother was able to stop an attack on one child but lost track of her little girl. The young girl was later found dead from being mauled by the black bear.

About 15 years ago a woman was tied to a tree and murdered just outside of Asheville, NC.

Now tell me you don't need to be prepared when enjoying the great outdoors. I'm armed when I'm camping, fishing, hiking (even a few hours on the trail), etc. And if it's not legal to carry I don't go or I "compromise." I will never be in the wilds without 10+1 of 10mm auto or 6+ of .44 mag.

I'm searching high and low for a good used 329pd for this very reason.

 

[MostlyHarmless]

thirdeagle,

I think the point remains that being armed doesn't necessarily help much in some of these scenarios. Someone alone in the woods is still vulnerable.

 

[LAK]

Without a doubt, if someone spots you - either from afar off, or closer due to cover - and decide to shoot you outright from concealment when you are close enough your chances are very low. Otherwise you have a fighting chance as good as you'll get anywhere else. Anytime you encounter someone on the trail - even if it is a lone female - you should be watching them, whats going on around you, and be ready to act.

 

[markallen]

I always carried a firearm when I hiked.
I never had any trouble with people, mostly trouble with feral dogs.
When you get back country, the people you run into, if any usually have the same attitude as you, thats why they are there.......But still why take the chance, Train, and carry.
The only times I had any uneasy feelings was always coming into the trail head.
Most trouble makers hang out there, had my truck broken into once.
As example' In Virginia on the Appalachian Trail, the trail parallels Skyline drive, with many parking areas just a hundred yards from the trail. They crowd up on the weekends, and some people will spill out onto trail to camp.
So always take time and check out the trail head, before just popping out of the woods and heading straight for your vehicle.

 

[benEzra]

My father had a "save" with a pistol here in eastern NC, when I was a young child. He was alone on National Forest land, in a parking area, getting gear out of his truck late one night while getting ready to go gigging for flounder in the shallows of the Neuse River.

It was his habit to open-carry a pistol on his belt while floundering. As I recall, he didn't have it on yet, but pulled it out of his truck (still in the holster, but with his hand on the grip, I think), put on his "authority voice" (former Air Force), and asked them "Can I help you?"; his accosters saw the gun, backed off, looked at each other, turned around, and left.

Extra weight? Certainly. Worth the trouble? Yep.