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Would you trust carrying you DA/SA or SA Cond. 0?

Discussion in 'Handguns: Autoloaders' started by FIVETWOSEVEN, Jun 30, 2010.

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  1. FIVETWOSEVEN

    FIVETWOSEVEN Member

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    Just a thought that entered my head but would you trust carrying your gun cocked and unlocked? There are guns with the firing pin safety that releases as you pull the trigger, would you trust this to carry?
     
  2. usp9

    usp9 Member

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    No.
     
  3. Thedub88

    Thedub88 Member

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    not only no ... but HELL NO :scrutiny:
     
  4. MCgunner

    MCgunner Member

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    That's sorta how I look upon Glocks except that they are not fully cocked, but it don't take much to fire 'em. Nope, I don't carry my SA revolvers cocked in my holster either. :rolleyes: They all have transfer bars, but safety can't be too redundant IMO. I much prefer DA or DAO autos or revolvers and that's what I carry, thank you very much. If I carried a SA gun, it'd be cocked and locked and not in my pocket, but on my hip. In a pocket, a single action would either ride condition 2 or 3 in MY pocket. Of course, condition 3 is safest and the slide can be racked fast if needed on the draw with practice.

    I have no desire to shoot myself. Gun safety is VERY important. I suppose you can be a Glock head and use the bugger picker out of the trigger argument, safety is in the head, and all that total BS. Not saying I don't believe in safe gun handling, I do, but if you don't believe in Murphy's law, knock yourself out. :rolleyes: Me, I'll keep my DA and DAO guns. I just hope I'm never around you somewhere in a check out line with your cocked and unlocked series 80.
     
  5. IMTHDUKE

    IMTHDUKE Member

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    So what condition are you going to carry a DA/SA in? In a defensive critical situation, you will need to rack the slide. I pocket carry in a good holster cocked and locked.
     
  6. AirForceShooter

    AirForceShooter Member

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    I carried a 1911 for over 20 years at condition Zero.
    It's still got the trigger and the grip safety.

    See mom? It's just like a Glock this way.

    AFS
     
  7. loadedround

    loadedround Member

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    Why push your luck? The 1911 was designed to carry cocked and locked for almost 100 years so why change things now. :uhoh:
     
  8. The Bushmaster

    The Bushmaster Member

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    What the hell is "condition 0"?? I've heard of "condition 1" Which is chamber loaded, cocked and locked (the only way to carry a 1911), but not "condition 0"...
     
  9. FIVETWOSEVEN

    FIVETWOSEVEN Member

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    Condition 0 is where your Gun is cocked and unlocked.
     
  10. IMTHDUKE

    IMTHDUKE Member

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    Yeah....guess that's a new condition recently implemented.:D

    Condition 1 as 1911 is perscribed to be carried, has at least three safetys not counting the firing pin block. The slide lock saftey, the grip safety and the the most important one....

    safety.jpg

    Cocked and unlocked would still give you two safteys.
     
  11. Fleetman

    Fleetman Member

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    I carry my 1911 cocked and locked. There is NO way I would depend on having to rack a slide in an emergency....I don't care how fast you are, odds are you won't be fast enough. The same goes, at least on a 1911, with the hammer down on a chambered round.....you ain't gonna be fast enough when the BG is closing in on you.

    A quality, well maintained 1911 cocked and locked is perfectly safe and (almost) instantly ready. I also carry, at times, a Keltec PF9 and I feel the DAO is a little safer although the trigger pull tends to pull the shots low.

    I agree with IMTHDUKE, the number one safety is your finger. I've heard of "Condition 0" many times but feel that method of carry is downright foolish! If you are familiar and comfortable with your SD firearm, a simple swipe of the safety should come natural. If not, you have no business carrying that particular firearm. Practice, practice, practice....makes perfect!
     
  12. easyg

    easyg Member

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    Sure.
    This one is single-action, but it does have a grip safety....

    HPIM6525.gif
     
  13. easyg

    easyg Member

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    Let me get this straight....

    You have no problem with carrying a DAO or a DA/SA pistol, but you wouldn't carry a Glock, for safety reasons?

    What you're saying is this:
    I trust a pistol, without a safety, that has a 10 lbs trigger-pull, but the same pistol with a 5.5 lbs trigger-pull is unsafe. :scrutiny:


    As if a mere 5.5 additional lbs of pressure is going to make much difference.:rolleyes:
     
  14. saturno_v

    saturno_v Member

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    Actually yes...I trust more my P-11 than a Glock...not only the trigger is much heavier but the pull is way longer...
     
  15. 9mmepiphany

    9mmepiphany Moderator

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    why would you carry a defensive pistol without a round in the chamber?
     
  16. saturno_v

    saturno_v Member

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    And I carry always my DA/SA pistols (I own only DA/SA other than my pocket piece, the P-11) with one in the pipe, decocked...that is the correct way to carry them.

    Practice your DA pull at the range.
     
  17. Lonestar49

    Lonestar49 Member

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    ...

    My bet is that it's the unsure/unknown new to handgun effect in place..

    Give these new owners about 1 - 3 months and the "if the gun accidentally fires-effect by itself or by me" will prove they just don't go bang by themselves and as shown above, the trigger finger is the key to safety or unsafe handling of any weapon..

    Once they get a solid base of safety foundation and the new gun proves they don't just go boom on their own, then the round gets chambered and "the fear/unknown" factor enters again but not as bad nor as long, about 1 week, maybe 2, then it's understanding with confidence that, hopefully, all of us retain and pass on.. the solid_base of using the 4 rules of gun handling and safety.

    Some take longer, some less, and a few just never carry with a round in the chamber i.e. Israeli style.. and that's their choice and with all the rules and knowledge ingrained in such individuals, I would not argue with their choice given they are proficient in the use and handling of weapons..

    It's an individual choice (in the end) we all make on how to carry

    Myself, as most others, "I recommend carrying with one in the chamber" as I walked the same unknown path, mentioned above, 3yrs ago, hard to believe, with my first handgun, a Beretta DA/SA Px4 40 F, converted to a G-model 3 months later, 2 weeks after I got my second handgun, a Sig P229R CT 9mm and 5 more handguns todate, now up to 7 - You all know the, ongoing, drill.. lol

    And to answer the OP's question: No, I would not carry any of my DA/SA loaded guns in SA mode/holstered.. no need, along with - Yes when I'm using my SA 1911, EMP 9mm, SAO, loaded - cocked and locked, as they should be, again, IMHO..

    OMMV


    Ls
     
    Last edited: Jun 30, 2010
  18. Red Cent

    Red Cent Member

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    I am slow but I will catch on in time.

    Condition 0 - Cocked and not locked and one in the chamber.?
     
  19. Steve C

    Steve C Member

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    Safeties both active and passive are there to prevent accidental discharge without the trigger being pulled if the pistol is dropped or struck and for no other functional reason. A 1911 pre 80 series and similar clones without the firing pin block has a high likelihood of discharge if struck hard in a drop under condition 0. The inertial firing pin and the grip safety will not prevent discharge if the hammer is bounced off the sear or the sear is snapped.

    Its incorrect to equate a cocked single action pistol of this type in condition 0 with a double action or Glock type action pistol. Modern DA and DAO pistols with passive safeties in unaltered condition carried with hammer down or Glock type striker fired pistols are incapable of discharge if dropped or struck.

    There is a lot of irrational "feelings" about safeties but while they may hinder an inept handler from discharging a weapon they certainly can't prevent it if the person is persistent. This is the function of locks and keys, not safeties.
     
  20. Girodin

    Girodin Member

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    Anyone thinking they can rack the slide plenty fast enough for a defensive situation would be well served to test that theory out with the following both a shot timer and some force on force drills. Report back to us on you Tueller drills done with an empty chamber.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kX8hIeevPlg How would this one have gone had he needed to rack the slide?

    I hear this a lot but what I have never heard of is the safety being swiped off. In a decade the safety has never come off of my mustang while in a pocket holster. That is of course no guarantee that it couldn't happen tomorrow but it seems to me that it is rather unlikely.

    To answer the OPs question no I would not carry condition 0. If I were to carry my DA/SA sig it would be chambered hammer down. If I carry a 1911 it is condition one. I see no real advantage to having the safety off (some might argue speed but the safety comes off naturally and rather quickly in the process of the draw so that I see it as no real advantage at all) and I can think of a few advantages offered by having it on.
     
  21. Sheepdog1968

    Sheepdog1968 Member

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    If a gun has a safety, I would have it rendered safe in a holster.
    If it's a 1911 style I would carry it cocked and locked no problem
    If it's a DA/SA such as a Sig with no safey, I would carry it hammer down and round in chamber no problem
    Glocks and XDs round in chamber

    Under no circumstances would I carry something say as a 1911 cocked and unlocked or a Sig cocked. It is inviting a disaster.
     
  22. Nushif

    Nushif Member

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    I guess I'm not following ... You mean to carry .... with no rounds in the chamber, and the hammer pulled back? Doesn't the hammer pull back when you rack the slide? Which is what you'd have to do anyways?
    Or do you mean that the safety is off, there is a round in the chamber ... and the hammer is down?
    Or do you mean the hammer is down, the round is in the chamber and the safety is not engaged?

    I am really confused as to the practical aspect here.
     
  23. lions

    lions Member

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    Full mag, loaded chamber, hammer cocked, safety off.
     
  24. Nushif

    Nushif Member

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    Aha, that makes more sense.

    Just for casual carrying? Naw, I don't mind the safety, it goes off quite fast. If I was about ready to use it, such as walking into a situation ... that's how I'd carry a SA pistol. Ready to use.
     
  25. Ratdog68

    Ratdog68 Member

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    I've carried DA/SA and SA. I carried the DA/SA with a round chambered and the manual safety engaged (decocked). I carried the SA with a round chambered, cocked/locked, and prefer a holster with the keeper strap between the gun and the cocked hammer.

    Upon holstering either type... I double check the manual safety to make certain it's in "safe" mode before turning my attention away from the holstered weapon.

    I will not knowingly/intentionally carry cocked/unlocked with either platform.
     
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