Your thoughts on handgun lasers?

[ezenbrowntown]

When I first noticed the lasers several years back, I thought of them in the sense of a novelty. It'd be something fun to target shoot with and maybe even to impress your shooting buddies.

However, with the plan of getting my CC permit and the research I've added along with it, the idea of a laser sight sounds more and more appealing. The laser sight seems to offer several tactical advantages over just the ordinary sights. Anyone care to offer up their experience with a laser sight? And if so, do you use it on your concealed carry?

 

[mgregg85]

I'd prefer tritium sights on my XD45 over a laser but on my little P3AT, you don't really have the option of tritium and the sights are puny. A laser that doesn't take up much room and adds very little weight can be a real help in aiming the tiny gun. I find my P3AT much easier to use at night with the laser.

Regardless, training is key. Even with a laser you should still practice with your iron sights in case the laser dies or breaks right when you need it most.

 

[Hawk]

The Viridian X5L just showed up for the 325TR. This is ostensibly the property of the spousal unit and I haven't managed to appropriate it yet.

But, with respect to the CTC, I found this, from one of the converted, to be interesting:
http://booksbikesboomsticks.blogspot.com/2008/08/see-dot-be-dot-shoot-dot.html
Enjoy.

 

[Drail]

Total bling. If you can't hit with sights a laser is not going to help. If it's too dark to see your sights then you probably can not see the target either so what are you shooting at? And then the battery fails. What you gonna do now?

 

[Marcus L.]

Lasers are nice targeting systems, but they do have a tunnel vision flaw to them that can limit their usefullness. Lets say it is night time, and all you are using is a laser on your pistol. You are in an open area and are trying to put your laser onto a moving target. Your background is an open field, so it is essentially to infinity and you can see no red dot unless your laser is hitting the target. This makes it more difficult to track where your pistol is aimed in and more difficult to aquire your target. With tritium night sights, you have a sight picture whether your are on target, or not since the sighting is not dependent on a reflection of the dot on the target or background.

A much better system would be a reddot or holograph type sight since they are also not dependent on a reflection. The only problem with them is that they are not very compact. This is why good ole iron sights are still the best overall sighting system.

 

[jfh]

Personally, I now would not have a daily carry gun without a laser on it.

For me, that package is a lightweight J-frame, typically a M&P340, with the Crimson Trace 405 (boot grip) laser on it.

You don't use a laser like a set of sights. You use them to learn to point shoot, at least in up-close-and-personal settings.

Further, for aging eyes--and here I am including almost anyone over 55 or so--they are arguably the best accessory one can have.

Jim H.

 

[jad0110]

They can be a good supplement IMO, but like scoped-rifles, it is best to become competent/proficient with the standard sites first. Lasers can crap out, and Murphy has a funny way of showing up at the worst possible moment. And I'd imagine that little red dot can be tough to see under certain lighting/movement conditions.

 

[nutter]

Can someone explain all this sight business to a total noob (me).

I know what laser sights are because I've seen them in movies. But what are tritium night sights, reddot, and holograph type sights?

Thanks in advance.

 

[MICHAEL T]

Their a waste of money Learn to use you real sights. Or if really close you should have already learned to point shoot. KT's are great for this type shooting

 

[mcwjr13]

I agree with learning to use your sights first and foremost. While I am not a huge proponent of lasers I do recognize that they have their place. In a defensive situation they can make for very quick target acquisition, as someone previously mentioned they can cause tunneling which most people do under high stress anyways. I really believe that this is a secondary system i.e. train equally with both sights as any electronic system can fail.

 

[Kleanbore]

From jfh:

Personally, I now would not have a daily carry gun without a laser on it.

Nor would I. The OP did mention CCW.

For me, that package is a lightweight J-frame, typically a M&P340, with the Crimson Trace 405 (boot grip) laser on it.

And for me (642, in my case).

You don't use a laser like a set of sights. You use them to learn to point shoot, at least in up-close-and-personal settings.

Right, and civilian SD shooting differs a great deal from range shooting and LEO combat practice. Quick draw from concealment, quick shots at body mass at someone closing on you fast from a distance measured in single digits of yards. No time for a sight picture, and no need.

Further, for aging eyes--and here I am including almost anyone over 55 or so--they are arguably the best accessory one can have.

Agree.

The laser also aids the effectiveness of dry fire practice.

 

[PcolaDawg]

I've got laser sights on my 642 and my Kimber Ultra Carry II. Very, very glad I do, and I find they are very accurate. When I pull the trigger, a hole appears wherever that laser is pointed.

It also allows me to shoot accurately from the hip or other awkward positions, which is an added bonus.

It's nice if you have time to line up a target on sights, but you may not have that kind of time and, with a little snubbie, it's not that easy to do to begin with. A laser sight takes care of that problem very nicely.

 

[fireman 9731]

you cant beat crimson trace laser grips....

 

[Marcus L.]

Can someone explain all this sight business to a total noob (me).

I know what laser sights are because I've seen them in movies. But what are tritium night sights, reddot, and holograph type sights?

Thanks in advance.

Tritium sights are like standard open sights(also called iron sights) only they have a tritium element added to them. Tritium is a radioactive isotope and as it decays it released light energy. So, they glow and are quite visible in low light conditions. Don't worry, it's safe. You get more radiation just going out into the sun for 15minutes that you do carrying night sights all day on your hip. The life of the tritium glow is about 24 years, so after 12 years they will be half as bright as they were when you bought them. One of the best companies for these sights is Trijicon Night Sights and they can usually be bought for around $100.

Reddot sights are kind of like a scope sight, only it isn't as much of a tunnel vision as a regular rifle scope. As you look inside of the sight you'll see a reddot that is like a rifle crosshair.....only it is powered by a battery and is visible in day or night conditions. It's a great combat sight with great durability, and its battery has a very long life(many years). A good sight for this is made by AimPoint and they range in price from $100-$600.

Holograph sights like EoTech use a clear window display and a hologram image of a dot or arrow is your sight. Since it is a hologram, if you shift your head a little to the side the image of the dot/arrow will shift to compensate for your head movement so that you can still see where your weapon is pointing. They give you a little better field of view over reddot sights, but they eat up battery power fast and are not as durable as reddot sights like the AimPoint. They usually run from about $200-$600.

There are also tritium reflex sights which is a clear window kind of like the EoTech, but it uses a tritium element for the dot/arrow. I think Trijicon makes one.


For handguns though, tritium nights sights are still the best overall option. They are much more durable, have no batteries to worry about, and are the most versitle. Also, a pistol needs to be compact and the other sight options take up more space. A laser is a good addition if you want to add something extra since they can be installed in to the grip and take up almost no additional space.

 

[nutter]

Thank you!

 

[Gunfighter123]

Hello and Good Post,
I like plain old black sights but I do agree that there are other options. I have shot IPSC action matches for about 25 years.
Out of those , I used a "red dot" for about 5 years . I still like "Bomar black " the best.

However ---- like "red dot" sites , the laser sights have come a long way in the last 10 years.

You have to get used to the "jiggle" of the laser on your target ---- seems like in very fast shooting -- the laser jumps around like crazy !!!!! LOL And , not a big thing for home defense but if there are more then 1 laser on a target it could be hard to tell which is yours.

I think a light AND a laser are good things and have them on my HD shotgun.

 

[rondog]

I have CTC Lasergrips on my Compact 1911, and wouldn't have it any other way. They're not for target shooting, they're for close-in, save-your-life use when the BG is nearly in your face and it would be stupid to try and use sights. If you can dot him, you got him.

 

[moooose102]

Total bling. If you can't hit with sights a laser is not going to help. If it's too dark to see your sights then you probably can not see the target either so what are you shooting at? And then the battery fails. What you gonna do now?

well, i hate to tell you this, but in MARGINAL lighting situations, a laser can be a real asset. if you are talking total darkness, then yes, it will not do much good. but in most "dark" self/personal defense situations, you can see the bg, even if it is not clearly. and if you KNOW that he is the one, a laser can mean all the difference. my pistol does not have one, but my wifes does. at night, when i come downstairs to check out a noise, i bring the pistol with the laser. WAY FASTER TARGET AQUISITION than trying to line up sights. and, since i do not have to concentrate on sight alignment, i can concentrate more on who it is, and or what he is doing. in the daylight, they are worthless, but in the dark (not pitch black) they are worth their weight in gold. which, by the way, is about what they cost! lol!

 

[mavracer]

order this free DVD from crimson trace gobs of info and instruction. http://www.crimsontrace.com/Home/FreeDVDOffer/tabid/316/Default.aspx

 

[Gun Slinger]

Never been a fan of hanging lights on my pistol.

Having cleared many, many structures over the years in the line of duty using only tritium night sights, I am convinced that they are all that is needed and they perform admirably in that role. The task is quite similar to what a homeowner encounters while going to investigate that "noise" that just doesn't sound right in the dark, wee hours of the morning.

Lights/Lasers hanging on guns are problematic in that:

1. They depend on batteries. Batteries will make a fool of you and "die" at the worst time possible. (I hate batteries.)

2. They "mark" your position for a hostile/intruder both by the light that is directly emitted from the device and the "back-glow" that is easily seen by anyone who has allowed their scotopic vision to fully develop. Unanticipated self-illumination is bad tactics and will result in your death given the presence of an intruder who is willing to kill you simply for your possessions.

3. Operating lights/lasers requires the employment of fine motor skills to operate them and diverts/detracts from the already complicated task of operating the weapon and its controls while under stressful, frightening situations which is why we have the gun out in the first place.

4. The untrained/undisciplined typically resort to the sloppy and dangerous habit of using the light/laser to illuminate subjects/objects that pose no tactical/lethal threat or should not have a weapon pointed at them in the first place. This is usually not a problem until someone confuses an "off" switch with the trigger. (It's always fun until someone loses an eye.)

5. The untrained/undisciplined commonly begin to rely on the laser in most, if not all, lighting scenarios instead of going to their open/iron sights first. The laser should be an alternative only when lighting conditions warrant its use. To fall into this behaviour is nothing more than pure laziness.

6. Weapon mounted lights make finding proper fitting holsters a royal pain in the behind. Modifications are usually in order unless one is fortunate enough to find a holster that is designed for the weapon mounted light.

Tritium night sights pose none of these problems since they directly replace the iron/open sights on pistols and they don't rely on batteries.

I see weapon mounted lasers/lights as mere gadgetry and gimmickry that possess limited value that can get me wounded or killed in exchange for the little that they offer. They typically become a "crutch" and interfere with good pistolcraft if the user is sloppy or undisciplined.

 

[mavracer]

Gun Slinger do you have any training in the use of lasers.didn't think so.

If you clear a house with nothing but your night sights your not gonna see the laser until your painted if it's used properly.
The untrained/undisciplined need training and discipline or nothing's gonna help.

 

[U.S.SFC_RET]

A laser on a pistol is the best thing going when you would love to learn how to point shoot. No better feedback without expending round after round.
Security? Second to none and bar none. I would hate to be on the receiving end of anyone who has the drop on me with a laser. Knowing that I would never stand a chance.
There is no substitute for learning how to shoot. Most of us who frequent THR know this. Lasers when used in the proper context should never circumvent the proper shooting skills we need to develop.

 

[innerpiece]

lasers dont "illuminate"

lasers dont target unless you can SEE yer target.

lasers can create 'dominant focus' that can narrow your spect of target acquisition.

dont matter if you have a laser, OR night sights.. if you cant see what yer pointin at, you dont know what yer shooting at..

Id suggest both mavracer and gun slinger go get tac lights instead...

and yes, I have had formal/advanced training with pistols and theri tactical application.
but your opinion may vary... this is merely mine.

ip.

 

[innerpiece]

agreed U.S.SFC

they are good for low light conditions, but not Dark.

beams also have the intimidation factor going for them..

however, personally, I prefer to blind someone, with a light. and be able to identify my target at the same time.
"tapping" a tac light is also quite effective for moving in a dark situation and still concealing youre position..

I dunno, Im just in favor of a light over anything when it comes to pistols, everything is real close.. It just what Im best with in that scenario..

ip.

 

[Gun Slinger]

Gun Slinger do you have any training in the use of lasers.didn't think so.

M-

Your presumption regarding my training is uninformed yet not surprising in that the general public (which includes factory workers) commonly believes that they can watch a TV cop show series or a few cop/action movies and know the job as well as one who has actually done it. Impressive credentials to be sure.

Unfortunately, it is also those so tragically misinformed that also believe that they know best how to perform the tasks of the LE profession and what LE should be equipped with when so engaged.

My opinion is formed from 20+ years of professional law enforcement field experience and training.

I must confess that you have me at a disadvantage. I was unaware that factory workers like you (your "Occupation" as listed in your public profile) routinely performed such duties in that line of work and possessed such expertise in the field. I bow to your greater knowledge.