Don Dayacetah
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I do OK with my CZ70. Been looking for a viable 9mm in the same size, but they're always on the safety/size line.
What is the Smallest, Lightest Defensive Pistol You WOuld Rely On ?
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I do OK with my CZ70. Been looking for a viable 9mm in the same size, but they're always on the safety/size line.
Alte Schule
Member
Agree 100% with this. Carry the firearm that fits the circumstance. Although I have a wide range of handguns available to me from .22 to .454 Casull as an elderly gent I carry, and prefer, 90% of the time, my Colt Detective Special in .38 Special loaded with Hornady Critical Defense Lite. I find I can shoot it accurately, out to twenty feet, with decent follow up shots.
Since I retired last year I like to take walks in the morning right when the sun is coming up. In the wintertime I can get away with having my Colt in my hoodie pocket but not during the summertime. This morning at 0600 Hrs. it was 84 degrees with 70 % humidity so anything above a pair of shorts and a tank top would be intolerable so I have to pack light. A Beretta 950 Jetfire in .25 fits fine in my back pocket with my cell in the other. The .25 is fairly anemic but I don't think I'm going to run into much of a problem where I live although it is fairly rural. I come across feral pigs and coyotes quite often but they don't want anything to do with me. If circumstances change I will adapt.
My extended family has a large piece of property in SW Texas near Valentine. When I'm out and about down there, usually on a 4 wheeler, it's prudent to take precautions from four and, regrettably, two legged varmints. SW Model 25 in .45 LC in an open carry holster on my right hip or Hi-Power in a shoulder holster along with an AR or SKS in a scabbard. It wasn't like that 40 years ago but times and people have changed.
JTHunter
Member
While I have an old Colt .32 ACP, its barrel appears to be shot out and its accuracy is only good to about 25 feet.
The smallest gun I would depend on is my Astra .380 that I have owned for about 40 years. It is one of the guns I have stashed around the house - JIC. I also have a .357 hanging in its holster in the bedroom on the gunrack and just below a 12 ga. and an AK.
The smallest gun I would depend on is my Astra .380 that I have owned for about 40 years. It is one of the guns I have stashed around the house - JIC. I also have a .357 hanging in its holster in the bedroom on the gunrack and just below a 12 ga. and an AK.
Old Dog
Member
Sometimes, one's lifestyle simply doesn't fit with what the threat one may face will be. Good luck with that.
Sistema1927
Member
I have a fire extinguisher in my kitchen, and not a fire truck in my driveway.
The answer for me is: nothing. Literally nothing. I often don't carry (too much time in and out of secured environments, relatively safe office and residence locations, etc.). I'm quite comfortable in most of my daily life being armed with nothing more than situational awareness and a charming personality. Others with different life circumstances, of course, may feel differently.
The corollary to that is that when I decide to carry, it's usually because I am going outside of my little circle of relative safety. Maybe I'm going into the woods where there are known bears, or back to a rougher old neighborhood I used to live, or maybe I'm running to the store late in the evening, or to a really crowded-yet-uncontrolled environment where the risk of "random" events is higher. If I'm going do depart from my usual (which is not carrying), then I'm going to make it worth the bother. A commander-sized 1911 is the smallest thing I'll bother strapping on.
The corollary to that is that when I decide to carry, it's usually because I am going outside of my little circle of relative safety. Maybe I'm going into the woods where there are known bears, or back to a rougher old neighborhood I used to live, or maybe I'm running to the store late in the evening, or to a really crowded-yet-uncontrolled environment where the risk of "random" events is higher. If I'm going do depart from my usual (which is not carrying), then I'm going to make it worth the bother. A commander-sized 1911 is the smallest thing I'll bother strapping on.
FLNT4EVR
Member
Ruger LCR
theotherwaldo
Member
It varies with the weather and the situation.
The line-up includes: P3AT, AMT .380 or .45 Back-ups as ankle guns; and,
G27 with Lazermax in the waistband.
Two is one, and one is none.
The line-up includes: P3AT, AMT .380 or .45 Back-ups as ankle guns; and,
G27 with Lazermax in the waistband.
Two is one, and one is none.
Old Dog
Member
While pithy, a poor analogy. We're talking personal choices easily within the realm of possibility, not extremes. Were that the case, I'd like to cart around an M-134 Mini-gun.
bassjam
Member
Really though, what is planning for the "worst-case scenarios"? Do you keep an AR15 strapped around your shoulder with 6 loaded mags in a vest? Or do you require a battle rifle in case you need more range? Because all things considered, all handguns are pretty poor defense weapons. For the majority of self defense scenarios, the difference between a 6 shot LCP and a Glock 21 with extra mags is pretty negligible.
Me, around the house I keep a NAA .22 in my pocket. When I'm out the smallest I carry is an LCP, but I prefer to have a j-frame.
someguy2800
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HB
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Eh, get a shot timer (free from App Store, works ok) and run a couple el prez drills. Draw an LCP from your pocket and then try the same drill with a Glock 19ish sized gun. LCP is laughable, especially when most criminals that use guns aren’t carrying pocket pistols.
bassjam
Member
Old Dog
Member
Well, since the thread topic is about the smallest, lightest handgun one would rely upon for self-defense, presumably carrying it concealed, I'm simply speaking to the smallest, lightest handgun I would rely on should I require a handgun for self-defense in the event of a worst-case scenario (say a crazy guy shooting up a Wal-Mart and trying to carjack people at the gas station, firing multiple rounds into their vehicles, which, oh wait, just happened the other day in my area ... or more than one assailant ... a business robbery gone bad ... whatever). Given the choice between an LCP and a Glock 21 with extra mags, I'd go Glock every time. I've been visited by violence, though, so I'm not denigrating anyone's personal choice, just wondering why a few ounces in weight or an inch or two in length makes so many compromise.
mdauben
Member
The smallest, lightest defensive pistol I will rely on is my Ruger LC9s. I'm simply not comfortable relying on anything smaller than 9mm.
If I absolutely, positively had to pick something in this range, it would probably be a Ruger LCP in .380ACP. Not sure I am really comfortable with .380 ammo, but its certainly the best you are offering.
I know some people use them as back ups or for "deep concealment" but I would never trust my life to an NAA .22 revolver. IMO the gun itself is more a range toy than a serious SD gun, and .22 ammo is just too unreliable both in the gun and it's terminal effects. The other possibilities (.25ACP and .32ACP) are AFAIK even less effective than the .380 and the guns they work in are not IMO sufficiently smaller than the LCP to make the trade off worth while.
YMMV of course.
OLD DOG,
The question is not which is a better weapon, but what can you carry at ALL TIMES? If it did not matter that a gun had to be concealed, then medium to large guns make a lot more sense, but if you get spotted, just whipping out your CCP may not cut it.
In Florida, it is called brandishing and it can get you arrested and almost certainly get your CCP suspended, maybe permanently.
Concealed guns beat being unarmed and trying to duke it out with someone anytime.
As for the theoretical giant, mad biker, meth head robber that you need a GLOCK 21 and spare mags for, try walking around in Florida with that rig on in June, July or August. Down here plain clothes cops usually wear their guns openly, but with a t-shirt saying police. Without that police label, you can attract all sort of unwanted attention.
Sometimes, you have to reach a practical compromise between what you would like to have (say a 20 gauge pumpgun with a light and dot sight attached) and a GLOCK 42 you can walk around all day without attracting attention.
Jim
The question is not which is a better weapon, but what can you carry at ALL TIMES? If it did not matter that a gun had to be concealed, then medium to large guns make a lot more sense, but if you get spotted, just whipping out your CCP may not cut it.
In Florida, it is called brandishing and it can get you arrested and almost certainly get your CCP suspended, maybe permanently.
Concealed guns beat being unarmed and trying to duke it out with someone anytime.
As for the theoretical giant, mad biker, meth head robber that you need a GLOCK 21 and spare mags for, try walking around in Florida with that rig on in June, July or August. Down here plain clothes cops usually wear their guns openly, but with a t-shirt saying police. Without that police label, you can attract all sort of unwanted attention.
Sometimes, you have to reach a practical compromise between what you would like to have (say a 20 gauge pumpgun with a light and dot sight attached) and a GLOCK 42 you can walk around all day without attracting attention.
Jim
somethingbenign
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And this is important I think. I haven't been in any violence that I couldn't bluff my way out of being 6'2" and fairly broad of shoulder to boot. I'm also in the process of learning hand to hand with a local ex-PD officer. With that being said my pistol is my last line of defense in a confrontation and hope to God I'll never get there. I'm not trying to drag this through the mud and please don't read any of this as confrontational but I just want to help give a more complete picture of my choices since you do seem genuinely interested.
Now if I could pick my perfect carry pistol I would like something with the width of a LCP, weight and height of my RAMI, and length of P-07 or P-09 (sorry I'm not terribly well versed in the Glock product line otherwise I'd reference them). Width and height are for comfort and concealability, weight to manage recoil, and length for a nice sight picture. As far as I know there isn't a pistol out there that fits that description and I'm sure there is a very good reason for that since there are much more experienced and smarter men that I in the industry. Until something like that comes about I'm having to make one compromise or another and sadly being concealable is higher on the priority list than I'd like.
I posted this in another thread awhile back. While there may be times when it is simply impractical to carry a service size handgun, the potential limitations of any handgun should be a matter of mental preparation and conditioning.
In the case of smallest, lightest and least number of available rounds it is all the more important....
https://www.policeone.com/police-he...ne-cop-carries-145-rounds-of-ammo-on-the-job/
In the case of smallest, lightest and least number of available rounds it is all the more important....
https://www.policeone.com/police-he...ne-cop-carries-145-rounds-of-ammo-on-the-job/
chicharrones
needs more ammo
For me, an LC9 sized gun won't fit in the pockets of the pants I own. I know because my shootin' buddy has an LC9. I do have a Glock 36 that is a bit larger than the LC9 and it won't fit in my pockets either.
The 36 is saved for the few cold weeks we have when I'm not working, which allows me to wear a jacket and a shoulder holster. But that is rare.
Why do I choose to pocket carry? I'm essentially a mechanic of sorts that has to wear a tucked in shirt but no jacket. That alone isn't the problem, as I have to work on my knees, on my back, on my sides, and of course on my feet. My first carry gun and holster is/was a Taurus 85UL carried IWB. I found I could get by carrying that revolver in my pocket more successfully at work than carry it IWB.
Having a gun in a pocket puts that gun on my upper thigh. I can work for hours in weird positions with a small gun on my upper thigh, but I can't do that with a lump of gun anywhere on my waist. Same goes for working on things at my house. In the attic for the AC or underneath cars in the driveway.
Sure, drawing from the pocket in any of those positions is problematic. But I'm hoping that when I'm working on a customer's machine that I don't have to keep watching my back. Having a gun in my pocket is for the times in between working on machines whether for work or at home. Being able to upsize the gun and change to an IWB/OWB holster isn't something I can do readily unless I'm at home.
Of course, that's just me. Others have their own reasons.
Armored farmer
Member
....my bad.MedWheeler
Member
golden writes:
This is not accurate. The brief, open display of a normally-concealed handgun not in a rude or threatening manner does not constitute "brandishing" (which is actually known here as "reckless display" or "aggravated assault" depending on the circumstances.) The prolonged (read: not "brief") open-display of a firearm without any such handling violates a different statute, one prohibiting "open carry." Dale Norman was not charged with "brandishing" in my county when he was arrested for walking down a public street with a clearly-visible holstered firearm; he was charged with (and convicted of) unlawful open-carry of a firearm, a misdemeanor in Florida.
Also, there is no "CCP" in Florida in this context; it actually goes under the acronym CWFL.
But, yes, Florida remains one of few states still prohibiting general open carry.
This is not accurate. The brief, open display of a normally-concealed handgun not in a rude or threatening manner does not constitute "brandishing" (which is actually known here as "reckless display" or "aggravated assault" depending on the circumstances.) The prolonged (read: not "brief") open-display of a firearm without any such handling violates a different statute, one prohibiting "open carry." Dale Norman was not charged with "brandishing" in my county when he was arrested for walking down a public street with a clearly-visible holstered firearm; he was charged with (and convicted of) unlawful open-carry of a firearm, a misdemeanor in Florida.
Also, there is no "CCP" in Florida in this context; it actually goes under the acronym CWFL.
But, yes, Florida remains one of few states still prohibiting general open carry.
JR24
Member
How long does it take you to get off 3 shots with a pocket carried LCP if you don't have a hand in your pocket?
Timing these kinds of things led to me abandoning pocket carry as my primary.
Pocket carry is sometimes "the only way" due to circumstances. Where it is at it's worst is sitting down.
JR24
Member
Obviously, that wasnt my point. My comment was geared to the thinking that a pocketed LCP is fine because of the 3 in 3 in 3 average, but you gotta be able to deploy the gun to make that work.
If ya gotta or want to pocket carry, great! There are zero circumstances in my personal life where I could only pocket carry vs something (even if it is just as small, like a .38) on the belt or belly band that would be easier to use*, should I need it.
*yes, a pocket gun is fast if your hand is in the pocket but I don't walk with a hand in the pocket 100% of the time and we cant depend on complete situational awareness, as much as we strive for it.
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