.22 Short for self defense?

The problem with the K-Bar is that if you need to go to the Mini due to NPE considerations, a large knife isn't generally going to fly either.

I agree that defensive spray should always be a part of your carry regimen. My problem is that I would generally prefer a bit different safety cover / discharge mechanism that what is typically on the market.

I don't know if I would use it for self defense but I have been hanging on to a nice stash of 22S in hope of finding a decent Astra Cub one of these days. I also have some 22L around.

MikeInOr said:

I would choose carrying a .22 short over a sharp stick.

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I'd rather use OC or a baton than a .22 Short out of a handgun, even in the face of a lethal threat. Blinding an attacker or a hard strike to the face will probably better save your life than your Cracker Jack prize little noise maker that's going to get you into trouble on all fronts both on the street and in court.

I have to say, usually I’ll agree completely with @CDW4ME , but this time I agree with him totally.

(Even though it was said much better by DoubleNaught.)

Beats feet, fists and foul language. Jeff Cooper said if limited to a 22 to aim for the eye sockets.

It's still a gun and if it's all you had, definitely use it.

But I wouldn't purposefully use one for self defense.

Ive talked about the effectiveness Ive seen of the 22lr being all over the place. Sometimes it would work pretty well (penetrating through the facial bones and lodging in the spine) and sometimes it fails spectacularly (hits the shin bone and the bullet shatters without even cracking the bone). Now we are talking about lighter weight bullets at significantly less velocity.

I've always looked at the 'caliber continuum' like this:
No gun----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------22 short-22LR-32-380-9MM-40-357-44Mag

In short, any gun is *way* better than no gun, and the differences between calibers aren't nearly as important as we often make them out to be.

Larry

DT Guy said:

I've always looked at the 'caliber continuum' like this:
No gun----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------22 short-22LR-32-380-9MM-40-357-44Mag

In short, any gun is *way* better than no gun, and the differences between calibers aren't nearly as important as we often make them out to be.

Larry

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There comes a point where I know that statement just isn't true.
Put yourself in a tight room with no escape, you with your .22 short.... and an angry assailant with knife/club/chair/glass bottle/.38 snubbie/AK47???
(You will never get to choose which weapon they have in case you forgot that part)
You do, however do get to choose yours.
If push came to shove, you could wound up beaten, cut, sliced, stabbed, clobbered, or shot to death by an attacker after you emptied an entire magazine of your .22 short into center mass.

Palladan44 said:

There comes a point where I know that statement just isn't true.
Put yourself in a tight room with no escape, you with your .22 short.... and an angry assailant with knife/club/chair/glass bottle/.38 snubbie/AK47???
(You will never get to choose which weapon they have in case you forgot that part)
You do, however do get to choose yours.
If push came to shove, you could wound up beaten, cut, sliced, stabbed, clobbered, or shot to death by an attacker after you emptied an entire magazine of your .22 short into center mass.

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Consider this:
1. Many encounters are ended simply by the presentation of a gun. No, you can't count on it, but it happens quite frequently.
2. Folks not scared off by a gun may well be scared off by a gun being fired, regardless of effect.
3. 22 shorts are NOT a first choice defensive caliber, but in terms of effect, a face full of them could well convince the attacker they should die, or at least sit down a bit.

I stand by it; there is far less difference in WHAT gun than there is in having a gun and having none at all. Doesn't mean I'm itching to carry a .22 short, but a determined person with one is orders of magnitude better off than an unarmed person.

Larry

I think I'd rather face a .22 Short than a trained fighter. Especially in the hands of Joe Average, I figure I have a better-than-even chance against a .22 Short, but Mike Tyson would kill me ten times out of ten.

Now, I am a firm believer in the idea that simply displaying (not "brandishing", but producing a gun with the intent to use it if necessary) stops the great majority of fights in their tracks - but I'm not sure if an NAA counts. I suspect that the physical size of the gun plays at least some role in the psychology. A bigger .22 Short would probably do the trick, but then, who buys a full-size gun in .22 Short?

Pretending any real firearm isn’t dangerous is bad policy. Coming up with preposterous scenarios where one skips past their AR, 12 ga, and .44 Mag in a rush to grab a mini-revolver is disingenuous, and the sheer level of snarkiness here lately is frankly beyond my comprehension. I used to get points for far less, then I read the rules.

I don’t know what any of you carry but to hear some talk they are toting multiple G19s, a G43 for back up, a non-folding blade, high intensity flashlight, and now pepper spray at all times because there is no place “more safe” than any other.

My pockets just can’t handle all that, nor am I allowed by my employer to have a firearm or large bladed weapon on property. Or at school, or the Court House, or any other Government facility I frequent. For that I always have situational awareness, cardio, martial arts, wrestling, and boxing training.

Besides, bad guys rarely shoot Gold Dots, as they are blissfully unaware that the HST is no longer enough bullet, so I should be fine.

Nope. There are hundreds of better choices.

Palladan44 said:

There comes a point where I know that statement just isn't true.
Put yourself in a tight room with no escape, you with your .22 short.... and an angry assailant with knife/club/chair/glass bottle/.38 snubbie/AK47???

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That’s true of any fight and so the statement can be said to be untrue regardless of what you carry. Put yourself in a tight room with no escape, you with your 17-round 9mm...and 75 members of an angry biker gang with fully automatic machine pistols.

Palladan44 said:

you could wound up beaten, cut, sliced, stabbed, clobbered, or shot to death by an attacker after you emptied an entire magazine of your .22 short into center mass

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Just the same as emptying a 9mm or .38 or perhaps a .45 into center mass. More than 1 person has survived ventilation by 9mm before so again, the statement holds true despite carrying your chosen caliber. As likely? No, but the level of confidence being misplaced in this caliber war is unsettling. Would I actively choose .22 Short over 9mm? Not in theory or practice, but I’ll never dismiss it as ineffective.

I don't know if new .22 shorts are of better quality than those of my youth, but I wouldn't trust their reliability as more than a fun noisemaker. I've see a lot of boardwalk/carnival shooting galleries where they had difficulty taking down those cheap metal targets.

Well, I guess if the choice is between a firearm that the ammunition falls out of or a .22 short, I would choose Death. And hope no one finds out about my choice of pistols, while being mortified in my casket.

TTv2 said:

Why do you automatically assume this .22 Short/Long revolver is my nightstand gun? You think I don't have other, better gun right next to my bed?

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Umm…literally the first sentence in your OP…

TTv2 said:

Since we've got a thread going for .22 Mag, I wanted to see what others think about the OG .22 rimfire and what potential it has for defensive use

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If you have a more specific scenario we could consider…
Ha! Just kidding, I won’t consider it.
And I am forced to clandestinely carry a 32Auto.

If that is all you have, than it is better than nothing. Having intricate knowledge of anatomy in this case could be helpful to you if being attacked.

CDW4ME said:

Oh yea!!!
Criminal (singular) will run away when you pull a gun
If you do have to shoot 100% good shots expected and attacker will drop ASAP from marginal caliber hits.

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DT Guy said:

Consider this:
1. Many encounters are ended simply by the presentation of a gun. No, you can't count on it, but it happens quite frequently.
2. Folks not scared off by a gun may well be scared off by a gun being fired, regardless of effect.
3. 22 shorts are NOT a first choice defensive caliber, but in terms of effect, a face full of them could well convince the attacker they should die, or at least sit down a bit.

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I didn't include the sound of gun being fired , is that a warning shot? No can't be ...
Even better than 100% good hits - its a face full - so that can't be a warning shot.
However, with a marginal caliber even with a face full the expectation is they will "sit down a bit"

I'd rather have .22 loaded with #11 bird shot......
They're much louder than the shorts, and better chance of blinding an attacker.
......I've watched a few ASP videos, and asked myself how could it have gone if our good guys had some form of .22 short.......it doesn't look good.

CDW4ME said:

View attachment 1036939

I didn't include the sound of gun being fired , is that a warning shot? No can't be ...
Even better than 100% good hits - its a face full - so that can't be a warning shot.
However, with a marginal caliber even with a face full the expectation is they will "sit down a bit"
View attachment 1036940

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I'm glad I was able to add some humor to your day.

Now, for the other, more serious, folks, answer this honestly:
There's a small, middle-age female walking to her car in the parking lot late at night. She's not a martial artist, wouldn't know how to aggressively use a knife, and only has good situational awareness and a .22 short ready when you try to jump her as she pulls out her keys.

Are you comfortable, knowing she 'only' has a .22 short, in having a go at grabbing her? She'll be at near-contact distance, probably isn't Rob Leatham, and will thus be pointing the gun at you from a couple feet away and dumping the magazine.

If you'd be fine doing that, I imagine you're right; a .22 short is completely useless. If you wouldn't......

Larry