A .22 handgun for home self defense?

I definitely agree on the revolver trigger, many times it's even worse like in the case of the LCR where not only does the 22 have a heavier hammer spring it's an 8 shot which adds a smidge to the trigger due to leverage.

This recent thread stands out in my mind.
 
That's the most common argument, but it's still a terrible argument, real or not. Kinda like the old woman who swallowed a fly...22 is somewhere between spider and frog. Better than a stick or a slingshot, but still near the bottom of the list.

But not reliably deadly. Sure you can kill lots of things with one, but I've seen enough raccoons, possums and groundhogs kinda shrug off a .22 and go on about their business for several minutes before keeling over.
there's always a bigger gun
 
That's the thing they all suck.
I definitely agree on the revolver trigger, many times it's even worse like in the case of the LCR where not only does the 22 have a heavier hammer spring it's an 8 shot which adds a smidge to the trigger due to leverage.
The Taurus vs Bobcat comparison doesn't reflect my experiences, my last Taurus center fire couldn't get thru a full mag without a light strike and my Beretta Bobcat runs like poo thru a goose with CCI mini mags. Ironically my TX22 I had before trading it for the p322 was 100% with everything except Win T22 that even my bolt actions choke on.
I’ve been wanting a Ruger LCR in 357. I’d only shoot 38 spl out of it but I wanted the extra heft. I read the LCR trigger was very smooth which is why I want one. So the trigger is not that great? Right now I have a Taurus snub that I really like but the trigger pull is so darn heavy I could never shoot it well.
 
I’ve been wanting a Ruger LCR in 357. I’d only shoot 38 spl out of it but I wanted the extra heft. I read the LCR trigger was very smooth which is why I want one. So the trigger is not that great?
The trigger on the center fires is great the rimfire versions are quite a bit heavier.
 
I suspect most would scoff at this...but is it necessarily such a terrible idea? My thinking is if I hit an intruder with a .22, no it won't do as much damage, but I'm thinking it's more about making contact at all vs how much. Getting shot with even a .22 won't exactly tickle. Most intruders are trying to rob you for whatever and even the "lesser" damage caused by a .22 is probably more than it's worth. This isn't a Clint Eastwood movie. :) Also in most situations, it's not like I'll have the luxury of assuming the "proper stance" (etc) to fire the gun, I might even need to fire it with one hand. Given that, the far lesser kickback of a .22 has its appeal. Is that crazy talk? Or a viable consideration?
circling back, yes, 22lr is certainly viable. viable doesn’t mean ideal in all circumstances. any well-practiced, familiar, accurate, reliable firearm is viable. i really don’t understand folks who harp on centerfire as an all or nothing choice. give yourself some years and/or unexpected infirmities, or a serious financial setback, or an unplanned but obligatory move to an antigun locale, and you may come to acknowledge the viability of 22lr for protection.

o.p. posed a useful question.
 
For stopping an attack, a .22 is sub-marginal at best...but may be of some use as an intimidation aid, IMHO. However, used as a sub-caliber, familiarization gun with little recoil and muzzle blast, and significantly lower ammunitions costs, a .22 makes sense both as a recreational gun, and/or an understudy to a more substantial arm.

I'm not aware of any reputable self defense trainer that recommends a .22 for home defense or CC use. For those who's physical limitations preclude manipulating an auto's controls and racking its slide to load, or a DA revolver's heavy trigger pull, a .22 with its lighter spring tension etc. is better than nothing, as others have pointed out.
As to physical infirmities, I'm 77 now, with nowhere near the strength I had at 60 or even 65, but have no difficulty with any of my autos and revolvers, regardless of caliber. I attribute this to my daily exercise regimen: a 3 mile walk with my short-haired pointer, followed by 25 minutes of calisthenics & weight training...it makes a big difference in stamina, endurance, and mental acuity. I strongly recommend something similar for any over-40 adult.

To the OP: YMMv but I'd get a bigger caliber defensive arm as soon as your finances allow. Rod
 
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Perhaps one of the multi shot 22 Magnum pistols if you can get one.

My FIL and I were having this discussion recently. He's in his '80's and has lost a lot of his strength. He can't shoot his Taurus 9mm any longer because he can't rack the slide. We bought him a Mossberg 500 in .410, the one with the muzzle brake, and while he can shoot it well enough, he's at the point where he can hardly lift it with both hands into a firing position. He started asking me about a .22 revolver... my thought was a 8- or 9-shot .22MAG DA revolver... but then looking at what's available, and for what prices, I don't know. I still wish I had my J-frame .38SPC to give him. I also thought about a 9mm revolver, but it would have to be small... because of the weight.
 
I think the most important factor in choosing a firearm or cartridge for self defense is to understand why you are choosing it, understanding the benefits and understanding its liabilities. I have yet to see any real data, that analyses real-life defense outcomes that provides significant evidence that the firearm, cartridge, capacity, or action type makes a material difference in the outcome of defensive use of firearms. If such data exists, I’d love someone to point me to it. In lieu of that, we are all making suppositions. There is ample evidence that the .22LR is lethal (e.g. Cascade Mall shootings); There is ample evidence that >55g projectiles penetrate through walls, potentially endangering innocents; There is ample evidence that some .22LR ammo can be unreliable in some semi-automatic actions; There is ample evidence that highly-motivated, high body mass, and(or) drug altered people can endure significant body trauma before the threat is eliminated. It just about understanding what factors you expect to encounter in your given situation and what risks you are willing to take in the process of defending yourself. Sort that out and that will give you the answers.

Let me point you to an interesting study of self-defense outcomes that generally concludes that the weapon, cartridge and capacity of the defensive weapon did not make a major impact on the outcomes studied. This is interesting but again, just one point of data. If you live in a situation in which you want to have the best chances of a successful defense against a group of highly motivated drug cartel members, you will likely have extraneous factors to consider rather than the person that is willing to risk the chances of that being low and being mostly focused on defending against a drunk teen breaking in and stealing alcohol and you live in an apartment or other situation in which penetrating a wall and killing an innocent is a big factor/concern.

Link to study: https://tacticalprofessor.files.wordpress.com/2014/12/tac-5-year-w-tables.pdf

Other notable data points:

1. **FBI Ammunition Testing**: The FBI conducts extensive ammunition testing to determine the performance of various calibers and ammunition types. They have found that shot placement and penetration depth are more critical than caliber size in determining effectiveness.

2. **The Marshall and Sanow Study**: A study conducted by Evan Marshall and Edwin Sanow, "Handgun Stopping Power," analyzed real-world shooting incidents and correlated them with the caliber of the firearm used. Their study suggested that there was a notable difference in stopping power between various calibers, but the data has been debated and criticized for its methodology.

3. **Guns and Ammo Handgun Stopping Power Study**: This publication has conducted tests and published data on the performance of different handgun calibers and ammunition types. However, its findings are often used as a reference point in the ongoing debate rather than definitive conclusions.
 
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It's better than nothing, but there are much better options.
Concur. Beats cursing or shaking an angry but unarmed fist. Home invaders are not lot soldiers bent on a conquer or die mission. Easy gain is their goal and the price of being shot and injured or killed makes them think again.
 
My FIL and I were having this discussion recently. He's in his '80's and has lost a lot of his strength. He can't shoot his Taurus 9mm any longer because he can't rack the slide. We bought him a Mossberg 500 in .410, the one with the muzzle brake, and while he can shoot it well enough, he's at the point where he can hardly lift it with both hands into a firing position. He started asking me about a .22 revolver... my thought was a 8- or 9-shot .22MAG DA revolver... but then looking at what's available, and for what prices, I don't know. I still wish I had my J-frame .38SPC to give him. I also thought about a 9mm revolver, but it would have to be small... because of the weight.

Like I mentioned up the thread, the problem with a double action rimfire revolver is usually the stiff double action trigger pull.

My wife’s Ruger LCRx has a much easier DA trigger pull than a rimfire, weighs about 20 ounces loaded, holds 6 shots of .32 ammo of differing power levels. Either soft shooting .32 S&W Long, mid level .32 H&R magnum, or “full house” .327 magnum.

My wife is not a gun person, doesn’t have the best hand strength, and wanted something simple to use. No magazines, no slides, no safety levers. Just pull the trigger.

I think the slightly heavier* Taurus .327 revolver makes sense, too. Especially for those that favor the S&W style cylinder release.

*22 ounces empty vs. 17oz. empty for the 2” barreled LCR in .327.
 
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My FIL and I were having this discussion recently. He's in his '80's and has lost a lot of his strength. He can't shoot his Taurus 9mm any longer because he can't rack the slide. We bought him a Mossberg 500 in .410, the one with the muzzle brake, and while he can shoot it well enough, he's at the point where he can hardly lift it with both hands into a firing position. He started asking me about a .22 revolver... my thought was a 8- or 9-shot .22MAG DA revolver... but then looking at what's available, and for what prices, I don't know. I still wish I had my J-frame .38SPC to give him. I also thought about a 9mm revolver, but it would have to be small... because of the weight.
"Ruger LCRx has a much easier DA trigger pull than a rimfire, weighs about 20 ounces loaded, holds 6 shots of .32 ammo of differing power levels. Either soft shooting .32 S&W Long, mid level .32 H&R magnum, or “full house” .327 magnum"

I'm another vote for the LCR.

Let me point you to an interesting study of self-defense outcomes that generally concludes that the weapon, cartridge and capacity of the defensive weapon did not make a major impact on the outcomes studied
If I was that actor in the movie The Martian and NASA or whatever space command was in that movie told me I had a 19% chance of getting off the planet but if I ripped out the excess garbage from the rocket and made it lighter then my odds jump to 23% but the tradeoff is gonna be a rough ride, I would say, let's rip the excess out of this rocket!
It's life and death, I'll take any advantage, however small, you can give me.

But that's just me. I don't speak for anyone else.
 
If you're gonna pick a rim fire for self-defense for God's sakes do so with a revolver.
True.

And a revolver holds the reliability advantage over a semi-auto.

As experienced shooters we tend to become immune to the affective destructive power of modern cartridges, including .22 LR, which is perfectly capable of neutralizing a threat.
 
I didn’t realize the LCR came in .500 S&W. Which cartridge in LCR are you carrying?

If I was that actor in the movie The Martian and NASA or whatever space command was in that movie told me I had a 19% chance of getting off the planet but if I ripped out the excess garbage from the rocket and made it lighter then my odds jump to 23% but the tradeoff is gonna be a rough ride, I would say, let's rip the excess out of this rocket!
It's life and death, I'll take any advantage, however small, you can give me.

But that's just me. I don't speak for anyone else.
"Ruger LCRx has a much easier DA trigger pull than a rimfire, weighs about 20 ounces loaded, holds 6 shots of .32 ammo of differing power levels. Either soft shooting .32 S&W Long, mid level .32 H&R magnum, or “full house” .327 magnum"

I'm another vote for the LCR.


If I was that actor in the movie The Martian and NASA or whatever space command was in that movie told me I had a 19% chance of getting off the planet but if I ripped out the excess garbage from the rocket and made it lighter then my odds jump to 23% but the tradeoff is gonna be a rough ride, I would say, let's rip the excess out of this rocket!
It's life and death, I'll take any advantage, however small, you can give me.

But that's just me. I don't speak for anyone else.
 
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I didn’t realize the LCR came in .500 S&W. Which cartridge in LCR are you carrying?


"Ruger LCRx has a much easier DA trigger pull than a rimfire, weighs about 20 ounces loaded, holds 6 shots of .32 ammo of differing power levels. Either soft shooting .32 S&W Long, mid level .32 H&R magnum, or “full house” .327 magnum"

I assume you are pointing to my use of the term "full house". "Full House" basically means a cartridge loaded near the maximum for a given chambering. I wrote of .32 ammo in the context of revolvers made in the 21st century. https://www.buffalobore.com/index.php?l=product_detail&p=284

The term "full house" has been used for other cartridges as well. I'm sure there are "full house". .500 S&W loads, but I don't dabble with that cartridge.

"When you get tired of shooting full-house ammunition in your 1911" - https://www.athlonoutdoors.com/article/loading-your-own-45-acp-ammo/


 
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My FIL and I were having this discussion recently. He's in his '80's and has lost a lot of his strength. He can't shoot his Taurus 9mm any longer because he can't rack the slide. We bought him a Mossberg 500 in .410, the one with the muzzle brake, and while he can shoot it well enough, he's at the point where he can hardly lift it with both hands into a firing position. He started asking me about a .22 revolver... my thought was a 8- or 9-shot .22MAG DA revolver... but then looking at what's available, and for what prices, I don't know. I still wish I had my J-frame .38SPC to give him. I also thought about a 9mm revolver, but it would have to be small... because of the weight.
There are some techniques that can help with racking the slide. This website is a treasure trove of information that deal with strength issues. Kathy's book Cornered Cat is excellent.
My dad went thru some of the same issues we ultimately found that an AR pistol worked pretty well for him.
 
Like I mentioned up the thread, the problem with a double action rimfire revolver is usually the stiff double action trigger pull.

My wife’s Ruger LCRx has a much easier DA trigger pull than a rimfire, weighs about 20 ounces loaded, holds 6 shots of .32 ammo of differing power levels. Either soft shooting .32 S&W Long, mid level .32 H&R magnum, or “full house” .327 magnum.

My wife is not a gun person, doesn’t have the best hand strength, and wanted something simple to use. No magazines, no slides, no safety levers. Just pull the trigger.

I think the slightly heavier* Taurus .327 revolver makes sense, too. Especially for those that favor the S&W style cylinder release.

*22 ounces empty vs. 17oz. empty for the 2” barreled LCR in .327.

I'mma look into those and see. I was also thinking just a nice, used Model 10 in .38SPC... which I used to have, but sold off, because I'm stupid like that.
 
I'mma look into those and see. I was also thinking just a nice, used Model 10 in .38SPC... which I used to have, but sold off, because I'm stupid like that.

Another gun I considered was the more expensive Kimber revolvers with 6 shot cylinders. Around 23 to 25 ounces in weight for the 2" and 3" stainless steel models, chambered in .357 mag, but launching .38 special down the tube. It would probably bridge the gap nicely between my 2.5" S&W 66 and my wife's 1.9" Ruger LCRx.
 
I have yet to see any real data, that analyses real-life defense outcomes that provides significant evidence that the firearm, cartridge, capacity, or action type makes a material difference in the outcome of defensive use of firearms. If such data exists, I’d love someone to point me to it.
The FBI papers on handgun wounding effectiveess contain "real data".
here is ample evidence that the .22LR is lethal
Lethality is irrelevant. The objective is to stop an assailant timely.
It just about understanding what factors you expect to encounter in your given situation
Whether one expects to face human attackers or large animals would be meaningful, but if we are speaking of defense against humans, what one "expects" is not a driver in this.

Let me point you to an interesting study of self-defense outcomes that generally concludes that the weapon, cartridge and capacity of the defensive weapon did not make a major impact on the outcomes studied. ....

Link to study: https://tacticalprofessor.files.wordpress.com/2014/12/tac-5-year-w-tables.pdf
The "study" is a compilation of incomplete data that encompasses only successes, and it cannot be considered an analysis of handgum effectiveness.
**FBI Ammunition Testing**: The FBI conducts extensive ammunition testing to determine the performance of various calibers and ammunition types. They have found that shot placement and penetration depth are more critical than caliber size in determining effectiveness.
True, but that applies to distincions among service clibers only.[/QUOTE]
 
Please, point me to an FBI paper that gives data on self defense outcomes. Data on performance of handguns and ammunition may be “real data” however, it is not a self defense outcome as I’ve stated.

I have made no assertions that anything I have said is conclusive evidence of “handgun effectiveness.” It’s simply more information of various perspectives for people to consume, parse and inform their own thoughts and decisions.

What someone expects to defend against is 100% a driver. The expectations (aka: assumptions, conditions, requirements, success criteria) are key to making any effective decision. If you live on the Israeli/Gaza border, your expectations may be different than if you live in a gated condominium complex at the Villages in Lady Lake, FL. Is your expectation to defend against a squad of highly motivated terrorists wearing body armor, a polar bear, etc. The FBI “real data” studies you reference all have various assumptions, if you have dug very far into them, you will find the assumptions and success criteria.

The FBI papers on handgun wounding effectiveess contain "real data".
Lethality is irrelevant. The objective is to stop an assailant timely.
Whether one expects to face human attackers or large animals would be meaningful, but if we are speaking of defense against humans, what one "expects" is not a driver in this.

The "study" is a compilation of incomplete data that encompasses only successes, and it cannot be considered an analysis of handgum effectiveness.True, but that applies to distincions among service clibers only.
 
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