Primers

I see sslfirearms.com, a firearms and ammo on line auction service is selling off lots of primers tomorrow night. If you are from central Michigan and need some the price may be going closer to normal. Sale ends 12/7/2021 at about 8 pm. eastern time. They are a regular dealer and seem to have no trouble in getting stock for heir sales. Careful as buyers premiums are in effect.

My attitude has just changed on primers. I stocked up pretty well as the plannedemic hit and I continued to stock as prices climbed. Just last week I ordered a brick for $80 but now I'm done. I'll adjust or decrease my shooting and let the $80 primers stay on the shelves until I really need them. I know retailers don't have it easy but they'll have to bend on prices because I've paid all the dues I'm willing to pay.

Airborne Falcon said:

Deal! You're on. Big Cool Hand Luke fan here.

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When does the egg eating commence?

We don't want to do this but finding a way to lay off and let the market adjust to lower demand, ,as has already been mentioned here, is the only realistic solution. I will admit myself that I'd probably buy 20K LPP if my local guy offered me them at anything under $60. But since I don't see this happening, I have accepted that next Bullseye season for me will be a 22 only season. I have mentally accepted that I will not need a primer until 2023 and as a result am not checking for them anymore. If they show up earlier and I accidentally see them while in a shop for other reasons, I will be pleasantly surprised but at least I can compete and hunt. I don't want to live through an entire year or more, angry and frustrated and constantly checking on-line suppliers and calling and driving to gunshops. Now, "accepting" a vaccination requirement or a shortage of my favorite bourbon is another deal.

Inthealders said:

But since I don't see this happening, I have accepted that next Bullseye season for me will be a 22 only season.

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That's a good plan... unless one is also short on 22 ammo.

WiTom said:

I was at Cableas last friday, and low and behold, sitting on the shelf behind the gun counter, was 10 1k boxes of CCI small pistol primers ... They were $79

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This tells me there is no issue with supply side and now the demand level will dictate the future pricing of primers moving forward.

Retailers/vendors will continue to sell primers at the price they will sell. If they don't, prices will keep falling until they do.

Hartkopf said:

My attitude has just changed on primers ... I'm done. I'll adjust or decrease my shooting and let the $80 primers stay on the shelves

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I am encouraged by "in stock" trend of primers reported by members and anticipate a gradual decline of primer prices in the coming months/years.

Many of us who have lived through previous component shortages have learned to stock up for cycles of shortages that have lasted several years. In 2018-2019, many of us were recommending to other members to stock up as component prices were likely as low as they were going to get (Primers were being sold for $20-$27/1000 at the time). I also encouraged others to stock up on 22LR when they were down to $16-$20/500 shipped.

For our current component shortage, we are going on year 2 with prospect of another year or more before I anticipate we hit bottom. Those who plan to reload in future decades, take note and monitor how long current shortage runs and as prices bottom, stock up enough to last more than the number of years shortage cycles run. The previous shortage cycles were in 2009 and 2013.

As member Hartkopf posted, there are things we can do now while we wait for primer prices to fall:

• Use up stocked up primers
• Reduce amount of reloading/shooting
• Use up stocked up 22LR to preserve primers on hand
• Stop shooting and pursue other hobbies
• Save money to buy when primer prices hit bottom (again like in previous cycles)

LiveLife said:

For our current component shortage, we are going on year 4 with prospect of another year or more before I anticipate we hit bottom.

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I began reloading in February 2018 after buying my first press kit in November 2017. I enjoyed a great run of buying everything needed, without issue, until March 2020. My greatest score in primers occurred in March and August 2020, when I picked up 9 bricks ($26.56/1K) and 10 bricks ($32.27/1K), respectively. Bullets declined in availability and increased in price thoughout the year, but have moderated dramatically in 2021, such that I have more of everything needed than ever. That said...I've had to explore new (to me) powders, as my familiar powders weren't available. Happily, I discovered that I'm a big fan of Hi-Skor 700-X, and IMR 4227 is quite versatile.
As to primers...I did manage to pick up TulAmmo primers. Meh! I'd trade them in a heartbeat. Hard seating, won't flow well in my primer tubes, and I have more duds with them than all other brands combined. Nope...not a fan.

markr6754 said:

As to primers...I did manage to pick up TulAmmo primers. Meh! I'd trade them in a heartbeat. Hard seating, won't flow well in my primer tubes, and I have more duds with them than all other brands combined. Nope...not a fan.

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Interesting! The TulAmmo LRP are my goto's for 7.62x54R, 7.65mm Argentine and 8mm Mauser. They were recommended to me by a competitive MilSurp shooter as "safe-r" in self-loading rifles. I had several - SVT, Hakim, FN49, etc. - and the "hard" Tula's worked well. Never had problems with duds or light fires. Must be new production. I think we can expect to see some of that in the first few runs of new stock.

LiveLife said:

• Use up stocked up primers

• Reduce amount of reloading/shooting

• Use up stocked up 22LR to preserve primers on hand

• Stop shooting and pursue other hobbies

• Save money to buy when primer prices hit bottom (again like in previous cycles)

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I am loading primers on hand.
I am shooting about as many IDPA and USPSA matches as I like, but practice and testing is way down.
I am shooting a good deal of .22; my most usual IDPA club is running a rimfire division.
Nope.
Yup.

LiveLife said:

This tells me there is no issue with supply side and now the demand level will dictate the future pricing of primers moving forward.

Retailers/vendors will continue to sell primers at the price they will sell. If they don't, prices will keep falling until they do.


I am encouraged by "in stock" trend of primers reported by members and anticipate a gradual decline of primer prices in the coming months/years.

Many of us who have lived through previous component shortages have learned to stock up for cycles of shortages that have lasted several years. In 2018-2019, many of us were recommending to other members to stock up as component prices were likely as low as they were going to get (Primers were being sold for $20-$27/1000 at the time). I also encouraged others to stock up on 22LR when they were down to $16-$20/500 shipped.

For our current component shortage, we are going on year 4 with prospect of another year or more before I anticipate we hit bottom. Those who plan to reload in future decades, take note and monitor how long current shortage runs and as prices bottom, stock up enough to last more than the number of years shortage cycles run. The previous shortage cycles were in 2009 and 2013.

As member Hartkopf posted, there are things we can do now while we wait for primer prices to fall:

• Use up stocked up primers
• Reduce amount of reloading/shooting
• Use up stocked up 22LR to preserve primers on hand
• Stop shooting and pursue other hobbies
• Save money to buy when primer prices hit bottom (again like in previous cycles)

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I was convinced 2016 was going to go in a completely different direction than it did - back in 2015. We were on buying trends for durables and stocks of disposables when November of 2016 came around. We slowed but didn't stop and I went on a selling spree of my less-used rifles, shotguns and pistols as prices spiked. I stopped selling briefly when they fell again. So far, I have only sold one or two pieces at less than 100% profit and haven't lost money - after inflation and relative value adjustments - on anything. But 2019 hit us HARD for cash and health problems so I wasn't able to keep on a restocking trend. Have I lacked for anything? No. I've given away and sold off ammo and supplies to those who needed them in my local community and this online community. But that's me and this is about the future. I am really, REALLY happy to see supply returning. Expensive on the shelf beats cheap out of stock any day. I learned in the post-88 gluts/shortages, buy now at any price just doesn't work; but not buying at all even when prices are within reason - adjusted for inflation and the value of the dollar - to "teach retailers/suppliers/manufacturers a lesson" will have the same result as any boycott - less product in the future as the risk of entering the supply market increases with an unstable consumer demand. If you can't count on selling at a reasonable profit, you make what you can while you can then get out of the marketplace.

I kind of wish I'd bought truck tires when they were still $150/each instead of the $300+!!!! they are now. I can buy cheaper tires but you get what you pay for.

LiveLife said:

For our current component shortage, we are going on year 4 with prospect of another year or more before I anticipate we hit bottom.

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Oops, I meant year 2. < Fixed post >

Sounds great to stop shooting... if I was 30. I'm not getting any younger, and what time I have left, I'm going to shoot. I will hopefully have plenty of time left, to shoot my stocked 22LR, as I get older, but sorry, if I want to pay $79 for 1k of primers, and I have the money, I'm going to do it. I suppose you also are suggesting I quit eating steaks, and eat cheaper hotdogs, until the price goes down again, is that any different? To me, $79 was a deal because of no hazmat, and I don't think the supply chain issues, have gotten better, yet, and we have a long way to go to stabling out prices. Hope I'm wrong, and we are all seeing cheap primers on every shelf soon.

WiTom said:

Sounds great to stop shooting... if I was 30. I'm not getting any younger, and what time I have left, I'm going to shoot. I will hopefully have plenty of time left, to shoot my stocked 22LR, as I get older, but sorry, if I want to pay $79 for 1k of primers, and I have the money, I'm going to do it. I suppose you also are suggesting I quit eating steaks, and eat cheaper hotdogs, until the price goes down again, is that any different? To me, $79 was a deal because of no hazmat, and I don't think the supply chain issues, have gotten better, yet, and we have a long way to go to stabling out prices. Hope I'm wrong, and we are all seeing cheap primers on every shelf soon.

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why not! going to do a Sportsman and Cablelas (maybe) Run! I’ll report back on what on the shelves. Maybe some photos too

Nothing… but tons of Percussion Caps and BP stuff

Mark_Mark said:

Nothing… but tons of Percussion Caps and BP stuff

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A friend of mine came over last Saturday. He brought his recently acquired Ruger Old Army.

I instructed him regarding the care and feeding of said ROA, using my stash of supplies. I sent him off in search of his own - he called later to tell me of success at Academy.

Seems at least percussion caps and Pyrodex P are available.

Hooda Thunkit said:

A friend of mine came over last Saturday. He brought his recently acquired Ruger Old Army.

I instructed him regarding the care and feeding of said ROA, using my stash of supplies. I sent him off in search of his own - he called later to tell me of success at Academy.

Seems at least percussion caps and Pyrodex P are available.

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Seen these round tins with 200 caps, 20-25 tins on the selves, no-limit. and been seeing lots for Triple-Seven everywhere. Might be a sign to get some. Eventually I’ll get into BP, We all do. Wonder how long BP last??

Mark_Mark said:

Wonder how long BP last??

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Real BP apparently lasts forever.
As for Pyrodex, I have a bottle from the 90s that is still potent - almost 30 years later.

89 dollars for 1000 primers? Found a note on my shooting range BB selling primers (L pistol, S pistol, S rifle) for $100 per thousand .. I spent $600 for two of each and was happy get them....I don't know if he is sold out but he had several boxes left. This was last month...my guess he has sold all of them but maybe not!

FYI where I work was just informed all technology upgrades are on hold. The Global Chip Crisis struck again and we're being told WHEN/IF supply comes back there will be "quality issues" with the first runs. I can't help but extrapolate to the primer and powder situation think maybe the first runs of them coming back into the market might also have some quality issues. I've heard some anecdotal reports of primer with no compound, missing anvils, out of spec' length and such. I can't imagine what "quality impaired" powder might do??? Just be careful out there and don't assume new stuff is just as good as it ever was.

Here it is, almost one year later, the 30th (of November 2022) will be one year.

Where do we stand compared-to what we all predicted a year ago?

I'm still not seeing any primers around here in any of my LGSs, Sportsman's Warehouse, Bass Pro or Cabela's or Shooter's Choice.

Looking at the big box online stores right now ....

Midway USA .... completely out of stock and the prices shown continue to be $89.99 or higher.

Midsouth ... same as above except their avg price is $94.00 and they too are completely out of stock.

Nachez and Titan, same and same. Completely out of stock and prices shown are higher.

walkalong .... .... cold drink wise brother, I only drink water so we're cool. I was hoping you'd be right but this thing is still a ways away from getting back to a new normal.

I will add this, powders are back ... everyone seems-to-be getting plenty of propellents in stock.

Airborne Falcon said:

Where do we stand compared-to what we all predicted a year ago?

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It appears that if the situation has improved at all, it's only marginally better. I don't know anyone who has no primers, though they've paid more than they'd hoped...and they lament the replacement cost when it's time. I think a lot of folks have come to accept that supplies (and prices) aren't likely to return to 2019 levels anytime soon

Funny, but I have rimfire tunnel vision and can't remember the last time I actually checked to see if a place had primers. It has nothing at all to do with supplies and prices. I've got more components than time and haven't loaded anything since probably before my last post in this thread.

The prices need to drop more at the retailers. Some of it sounds like gouging in the marketplace.

I am really hoping that once the VV primer-making facility gets up and running and in full production .... I am hoping availability goes-up and prices go-down.

Late 2023, early 2024 maybe?

I'm glad we documented the situation from a year ago, in this thread, so that we could revisit and compare here ... a year later. IMHO this may be the new norm and, I agree to some extent, prices (when available) may be being kept artificially high by the retailers.

I know I had a local big box stocking employee tell me that they are pricing their propellants based-upon cost plus hazmat and shipping fees in order to maximize their profits and that all off-the-shelf hazmat items are being priced that way. So a $44.00 one pound cannister of propellent off-the-shelf is still cheaper than buying a $34.00 cannister of the same flavor from Midway or Midsouth or wherever .... by the time you pay hazmat and shipping.

We're all sitting here basing our online big box pricing on their advertised pricing per unit but .... when we figure hazmat and shipping on primers (where bulk buying is either limited or not permitted) the cost goes-up exponentially.

If Midway or Midsouth offer primers at $89.99 per 1000 ct, and you're limited to one per customer, the cost of those primers just went to somewhere around $115.00 per 1000 ct and that's best case scenario.

It's just brutal right now.

Wolf primers are no longer being allowed to-be imported. Tula, same thing from what I understand.

I am really getting desperate for small pistol primers.