Profiling - What Do You Do?

Profiling is common sense.

Damn, if I profiled where I work I'd be in condition orange all day long.

I profile, but it has nothing to do with race. In our area I see more white "tater heads" than blacks or hispanics. I pick out/spot/watch/alert on (whatever) thugs of all races, therefore, it's not racist.

Stay safe.
Bob

I profile. But it's more cultural and behavioral than racial. I'm gonna be just ask skeptical about a group of black gangbangers with sagging pants, as I am a bunch of white skinheads with "WHITE POWER" tattooed on their arms. There are degenerates and low lifes in every race, and they are all equally scum. If a man is wearing a nice shirt and knows how to speak English properly, and is courteous, he will place low on my list, no matter what race he is. I'm white, but if I'm walking with my GF and I see a bunch of white kids with spiked necklaces and "Aryan Nation" shirts, I am going to condition orange/red until they are well out of range.

Profiling, even racial profiling, can be 1 useful tool. It becomes a problem when it is the only tool used. Don't base your threat decisions off of just 1 set of criteria. A person of one race being out of place in a place frequented by another can be 1 piece of evidence used to evaluate a threat. But if it is the only thing you use, you are indeed a racist. The same goes for any other type of profiling or even observation. If you are using just one set of criteria to sort between "threat" and "OK" you've got it all wrong, no matter what that criteria is.

And whatever goes on in your mind, racist or not, is your own business. As long as you keep it in your head, and only actually act when truly appropriate, it doesn't really matter.

I'm always alert to people's behavior & I'm always more careful when there are groups of young men around. That demographic commits the most crimes.
My guard is always up & I listen to my gut.

If you are trying to avoid gangbanger types, you have it wrong. You cannot recognize a threat by the way a person dresses. You must watch their behavior. Here is a basic primer I wrote on the subject of recognizing threats.

Click to expand...

well, I think that is what I said, maybe just badly....
it seems all I have to do to thwart many of you, is just appear white (check), dress reasonably (check), make sure my hair is combed (well, whats left of it -check ) and avoid looking midly furtive ( let's say check for that too)...thank heavens the unsavoury sort could never manage all that.....

I profile on both appearance and actions.

I can think of two cases in particular, years apart, and in each I was taking my mother out on her birthday.

In the first, we were on a skywalk in downtown St. Paul and we both saw a young black male watching us without being seen to be watching us . . . my mother shifted her purse to the other shoulder, and I put myself between her and him. He rolled his eyes with an expression like "Oh, crap, they made me" and walked down a nearby stairway. There's NO DOUBT he was weighing his chances of snatching her purse and outrunning me afterwards.

In another, more recent incident, we parked near a restaurant, and a couple of scruffy white guys, sitting in the parking lot, really looked us over . . . as we were getting out of the car, they walked by, really giving us the eye . . . and went around the back of another building. Less than 30 seconds later, they reappeared, and seemed very surprised, and, dare I say, disappointed - to see us still by the car. (BTW, good thing about pocket carry - you can stand there, hand on gun, and nobody sees anything but a guy casually standing with one hand in his pocket. But you're about 1/2 second away from BANG! if you have to shoot.) They then got back in their car, adjusted their mirrors, and watched us.

We left for another restaurant - they didn't follow.

thank heavens the unsavoury sort could never manage all that.....

Click to expand...

Of course they could. But how often do they try?

well, maybe they are, but you're just not seeing them.......

Well the next time a guy in a suit pulls a gun out of his Armani briefcase and mugs me, I'll alter my plan

You saw a group of gang members who happened to be a different race.
Your wife saw a group of a different race who happened to look like gang bangers.

WHO's racist?

Click to expand...

...are you trying to say the wife is racist because she saw a group of a different race? Why is it that rightist cons always think taking note that someone is of a different race than yourself is racist?

And yeah, whenever I see a middle aged white guy wearing flannel and dressing and looking really conservative-redneck, I always put my hand on my gun and prepare to shoot in case he tries to attack me in a racist rage.




But seriously, everyone profiles. I don't know if it's good or bad, but I try to not let it get to a point where it's affecting anybody else. But when I do see redneck looking guys, I do start thinking about where my CCW is located. Probably the opposite of most of you. I'm a 1000 times more tense when I run into guys like this



than guys like this.

I would be leery of both equally.

Interesting that the rednecks have a Confederate flag on their license plate, and an American flag in the back.

If you don't profile, if you can't make a reasonable delineation between various individuals and groups, what on earth do you do? Suspect nobody? Stupid. Suspect everybody? Impossible.

When there's a string of older men in Stafford shirts and Dockers convicted of muggings, I'll adjust my parameters...

Well, in my way of think'in - "its better too be tried by twelve, than carried
by six". So, if that offends anyone I apologize in advance~!

IMO If you can spot a threat your ahead of the game. I went to a club with some friends not to a year or so aggo. (something i don't do anymore)
They were talking about this big biker looking guy and how they wouldn't want to mess with him. I'm possitive he wasn't the real deal and no threat.
There was a guy sitting at the table next to us. wearing a suit, clean shaven, 140lbs soak and wet. normal dress except for heavey gold rings on every finger. Let me tell you he was a dangerous man. My gut told me he was a killer and i believe my gut. The other poeple i was with never even noticed him. hell they could have reached over and touched him he was so close.
If your really spotting gang bangers and not baggy clothes wearing teenagers,
consider it a gift and don't listen to anyone else including your wife. Trust your gut.

As for cerial killers looking like the average joe, thats a hole other level of crazy. Thats a real scary thing. I'd rather take my chances with an obvious killer then someone totally un predictable that looks like uncle Ned.

My 2 cents

It Comes to This...

People who don't know me tend to be VERY WARY!

I'm 6ft .5 inches. 300pounds. In a word. Large. I do not sneak up on people. I used to, but thats a whole different story.

When a group of animals whether four legged or two approach me they haven't "not seen" me.

I take whatever measures seem appropriate to protect myself from physical harm, and harm to those I love, around me.

Do I profile? Yes. Have I been mugged? Never succesfully. And I hope that if I do my part that I never will be.

Also, in Arizona, it doesn't matter about drawing on an "unarmed" group if there is violence. If it's +4 on 1, it's can be justified.

Sometimes you need to pay some attention to more than the visual cues and listen to that inner ear.

http://thelawdogfiles.blogspot.com/2007/02/object-lesson.html

Profiling is one of the most effective LE tools available, yet LE is barred from using it. And that's a damn shame!

Click to expand...

When LEO profiles they do it in the context of violating your civil rights.
When citizen profiles they do it in a context of self defense.

Profiling is quite alright. Its the actions you take based upon that profile that can be right or wrong. Pull over every minivan with a grateful dead sticker and you may catch a few pot heads but you also violate the rights of a lot of
citizens in the process. If you profile a percieved gangbanger in the parking lot and he doesn't make a move to harm you the worst thing that happens is you may offend them. Tough, get over being offended if you don't like the idea of people "profiling" you.

Perscuze me... My skullbleep sticker is right next to my NRA sticker...

Sometimes the hair stands up on the back of your neck.


Pay attention when things don't look right.

Prejudice and Ducks

Experience is the result of living life for a while. The longer you live the more you SHOULD have learned from experience. The experience that is the best teacher is the BAD experience.

We tend to look back at our past experiences whenever we encounter a new person, place, or thing, we look to past experience to determine the "best" response pattern to apply to this new encounter. This is the foundation of the "duck" legal concept. If it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck then chances are it is a duck.

This is the essence of profiling. Human beings are designed to do rely on past experience called learning in order to survive. This learning creates prejudice. Sometimes prejudice is incorrectly formed, but it is usually safer to rely on your experience until proven wrong.

Clothes do not make the man. But the way you dress, the way you act, even the way you walk, is the way you present yourself to others. Someone dressed up like a "thug" and waving gang signs might not be one but they have included themselves in that culture, if only superficially. There is nothing wrong with intelligent profiling. If people wearing pink slippers tend to be pathological liars, it's smart to keep that in mind when talking to someone with a set of those fuzzy bunny shoes on.

If profiling is wrong, should a black man given equal attention to a paraplegic and a guy wearing a white sheet with a torch? It's like the Carlin joke about "the quiet ones." If someone is drinking quietly and another guy is banging a machete on the bar 'n screaming about killing everyone, who will you watch?

Just because society says its cool to have sex doesn't mean you don't teach your children. Just because society teaches you shouldn't profile doesn't mean you go walking into the wrong crowd. You down wid that?
Society will never pass the common sense test. I profile everything, I get profiled and I don't mind it.

Amen USSFC RET. What common society thinks is OK should never be the guide for actual sensible people.

I trust me and God . I'm not sure about anyone else! 'Nuff said.

"I'd much rather pay for an attorney than a mortician."
koja48