Hog huntin Harry
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Would a 117 grain core-lokt 25-06 at 3,000 fps provide any meaningful improvement over a 100 grain core-lokt .243 at 2,960 fps concerning killing power on coyote, wild hog, and whitetail deer at 200 yards and under ?
.243 Winchester vs 25-06
- Thread starter Hog huntin Harry
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No.
Folks get wrapped up in the stats and ballistics but unless there's a difference on the order of 20% or greater, it's usually not worth the effort. Much more comes down to bullet design and can the loose nut on the end of the stock do his part.
Folks get wrapped up in the stats and ballistics but unless there's a difference on the order of 20% or greater, it's usually not worth the effort. Much more comes down to bullet design and can the loose nut on the end of the stock do his part.
GooseGestapo
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LoonWulf is right.
But it gets worse for the .243.
Most .243 sporters don’t come close to getting advertised velocities.
More likely, the .243 has a 22” barrel, or shorter, and will likely get something like 2,700-2,850fps.
The closest comparison I can give you is two coyotes I shot 2 months apart. Both out my kitchen window. Dogs were standing within 20’ of same location. One was shot with a .270win with a 130gr Speer hotcor at 3,120fps from a 22” Rem M700 (chronographed). Second was shot with a .243 with a 90gr Speer HotCor at a chrono’d 3,090fps. (Max load of IMR4350). The .270 made a noticeable entry wound and SUBSTANTIAL exit wound (4”). The .243 had no noticeable entry wound and no exit wound. Deer shown was dropped with the .270.
Note exit wound on deer. My experience is the .243 would not exit on a deer either. I’ve shot, and lost more deer with a .243 than any other cartridge. It’s arch rival, the .257Roberts, has taken more deer for me than any other cartridge I’ve used. And by the way, it does get 3,000fps with a 115-117gr bullet. What it does to a deer with a Berger 115gr VLD is astonishing!
But, admittedly, I’m biased.
But it gets worse for the .243.
Most .243 sporters don’t come close to getting advertised velocities.
More likely, the .243 has a 22” barrel, or shorter, and will likely get something like 2,700-2,850fps.
The closest comparison I can give you is two coyotes I shot 2 months apart. Both out my kitchen window. Dogs were standing within 20’ of same location. One was shot with a .270win with a 130gr Speer hotcor at 3,120fps from a 22” Rem M700 (chronographed). Second was shot with a .243 with a 90gr Speer HotCor at a chrono’d 3,090fps. (Max load of IMR4350). The .270 made a noticeable entry wound and SUBSTANTIAL exit wound (4”). The .243 had no noticeable entry wound and no exit wound. Deer shown was dropped with the .270.
Note exit wound on deer. My experience is the .243 would not exit on a deer either. I’ve shot, and lost more deer with a .243 than any other cartridge. It’s arch rival, the .257Roberts, has taken more deer for me than any other cartridge I’ve used. And by the way, it does get 3,000fps with a 115-117gr bullet. What it does to a deer with a Berger 115gr VLD is astonishing!
But, admittedly, I’m biased.
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I would think both acceptable.
But one might shine a little brighter on the bigger stuff.
A .25-06 Ruger #1 B would be my plains deer rifle.
One in .243 would be my chuck/yote rifle.
Bolt guns? I like short actions better.
If most of your killing is gonna be yotes, lesser recoil and easier watch of the hits might give the nod to the .243win.
Really, what is available in what type of rifle...........might be more of a determiner.
My old bud killed deer w an octagon bbl B78 in .25-06. That was a very cool rifle.
But one might shine a little brighter on the bigger stuff.
A .25-06 Ruger #1 B would be my plains deer rifle.
One in .243 would be my chuck/yote rifle.
Bolt guns? I like short actions better.
If most of your killing is gonna be yotes, lesser recoil and easier watch of the hits might give the nod to the .243win.
Really, what is available in what type of rifle...........might be more of a determiner.
My old bud killed deer w an octagon bbl B78 in .25-06. That was a very cool rifle.
I shot a deer (one) w .243 win.
100gr Winchester SP factory round.
50 yards on the trot, it whistled right through both lungs............and he trotted over to my area, looked at me, licked his nose, turned and walked 60 yards and fell over.
Looked like you stuck your pinky through the gut pile. Rib hit on entrance and exit.
I did buy some Deer Season XP 95 gr to try the following yr but saw nothing big enough to shoot.
That rifle has a 20" bbl.
100gr Winchester SP factory round.
50 yards on the trot, it whistled right through both lungs............and he trotted over to my area, looked at me, licked his nose, turned and walked 60 yards and fell over.
Looked like you stuck your pinky through the gut pile. Rib hit on entrance and exit.
I did buy some Deer Season XP 95 gr to try the following yr but saw nothing big enough to shoot.
That rifle has a 20" bbl.
Dead, didn't take too long. Would have liked faster.
Eh, some deer just keep the ghost longer.
Am not going to condemn the cartridge based on one kill, and maybe my choice of bullet/load not being ideal.
Supposed to have been good enough. It shot great and the deer went in my freezer.
I like em to react more to the hit.
He mule kicked so high/hard I thought he would somersault. But after that he acted like nothing was going on.
They don't behave like that when I swat em w a .35 rem 200gr. Run hard and dead quick.
Just sayin.
Eh, some deer just keep the ghost longer.
Am not going to condemn the cartridge based on one kill, and maybe my choice of bullet/load not being ideal.
Supposed to have been good enough. It shot great and the deer went in my freezer.
I like em to react more to the hit.
He mule kicked so high/hard I thought he would somersault. But after that he acted like nothing was going on.
They don't behave like that when I swat em w a .35 rem 200gr. Run hard and dead quick.
Just sayin.
I've had a few .243's..........
Rem 600
Rem Model 7 stainless
Ruger 1B
Ruger 1 RSI
Rem 700 BDL
Rem 700 ADL
Rem 700 ADL
Savage Axis
and if I was gonna go for mule deer, whitetails and or pronghorn............
I'd get a .25-06.
Either a 700 stainless synth or a Ruger #1 B.
Rem 600
Rem Model 7 stainless
Ruger 1B
Ruger 1 RSI
Rem 700 BDL
Rem 700 ADL
Rem 700 ADL
Savage Axis
and if I was gonna go for mule deer, whitetails and or pronghorn............
I'd get a .25-06.
Either a 700 stainless synth or a Ruger #1 B.
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GooseGestapo
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Added: I’ve had better luck with the .223 and heavier bullets (55-70gr). This buck was shot twice with a 60gr Hornady PtSpt at 2,800fps mv at 170yds (lased, approximately 50yds beyond where coyotes were standing. Second shot was broadside and exited mid ribs. First shot was near frontal and exited low behind shoulder (heart shot). BTW, I let the feist track it for practice. She’s quite good at it. She’s found several deer that I otherwise would have lost.
I too concur on the .35Rem! I run the 200’s over 40gr of H4895 at 2,250fps from my Marlin M336C. Up to 200yds, it’s probably my favorite..
Like Jack O’Connor once wrote comparing the .270 and .30/06. “The ‘06 tends to make them flinch a bit more when hit” discussing the difference on elk... Likewise with the .35, and comparing the .243 vs. the .25/06.
But, there is the story of a coworker who had a deer shot by some night hunters with a .25/06 that he confiscated. It was shot with some Winchester 87gr hp. At 8:00 the next morning, while he was booking in the violators at the county court house, the sheriff walked in the booking area and told him the evidence had woke up and was trying to escape his pickup bed... I had to write up the damage report on the .357mag bullet hole in the truck bed....
Shot placement is ALWAYS important.
I too concur on the .35Rem! I run the 200’s over 40gr of H4895 at 2,250fps from my Marlin M336C. Up to 200yds, it’s probably my favorite..
Like Jack O’Connor once wrote comparing the .270 and .30/06. “The ‘06 tends to make them flinch a bit more when hit” discussing the difference on elk... Likewise with the .35, and comparing the .243 vs. the .25/06.
But, there is the story of a coworker who had a deer shot by some night hunters with a .25/06 that he confiscated. It was shot with some Winchester 87gr hp. At 8:00 the next morning, while he was booking in the violators at the county court house, the sheriff walked in the booking area and told him the evidence had woke up and was trying to escape his pickup bed... I had to write up the damage report on the .357mag bullet hole in the truck bed....
Shot placement is ALWAYS important.
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MacAR
Member
I've shot a lot of critters with my ol 25, but never dropped the hammer on a deer. Its my varmint rifle, you might say. My 25 is a Ruger M77 MKII, with a heavy 24" barrel. The load I shoot puts a 117 grain bullet out the barrel at about 3150 fps. Shot lots of Yotes with that load and not one of them walked off. Another pet load of mine is a 75 grain v-max running 3400. It makes a mess out of smaller critters, needless to say. But its quite effect as well.
I used to own a .243, also a Ruger, but an American. It did not impress me. The .243 didn't perform as well as I'd hoped on varmints, and the cost of the ammo was similar to that of my 25. So, I sold it to a young lad that needed a cheap rifle.
So, at the end of the day, I'll take the 25. Its a lot more versatile in my eyes, and I feel like it has an advantage at longer ranges (though the op didn't ask about that). I'd also mention that a very close friend of mine taken his 25-06 M70, loaded with 125 grain Sierra bullets, on an elk hunt in Colorado. He came back with a nice 4x4 bull, killed with one shot at a measured 253 yards. He's a good shot, to be sure, but I'd not feel comfortable trying the same with a 243.
Mac
I used to own a .243, also a Ruger, but an American. It did not impress me. The .243 didn't perform as well as I'd hoped on varmints, and the cost of the ammo was similar to that of my 25. So, I sold it to a young lad that needed a cheap rifle.
So, at the end of the day, I'll take the 25. Its a lot more versatile in my eyes, and I feel like it has an advantage at longer ranges (though the op didn't ask about that). I'd also mention that a very close friend of mine taken his 25-06 M70, loaded with 125 grain Sierra bullets, on an elk hunt in Colorado. He came back with a nice 4x4 bull, killed with one shot at a measured 253 yards. He's a good shot, to be sure, but I'd not feel comfortable trying the same with a 243.
Mac
skeeterfogger
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Lost count of deer I've taken with 243.
entropy
Member
Both will do the job. Were I buying one of the two calibers, it'd be the .243.
someguy2800
Member
A 25/06 is for all intents and purposes a scaled up 243.
Having shot a whole lot of deer with 25-06 and a few with a 243 I would say yes absolutely there is a difference. I get more reaction to the shot from the 25-06 and better blood trail.
The 243 has the advantage of ammo availability that can’t be denied though.
Having shot a whole lot of deer with 25-06 and a few with a 243 I would say yes absolutely there is a difference. I get more reaction to the shot from the 25-06 and better blood trail.
The 243 has the advantage of ammo availability that can’t be denied though.
someguy2800
Member
My 22” 25-06 is pretty comfortable at about 3000-3050 with a 120 grain. If I try to push any faster than that I loose the primer pockets in a couple reloadings. I could probably get a little more with some of the really slow aliant powders but that’s all it wants to give with the powders I’ve tried.
You try h1k, ret, and 7828? Those would probably be edging on the slow side, but usually I can get enough into an 06 class case to get good velocity with one of those. I've never loaded for the 25-06 tho, so that's simply from past experience with it's larger bullet sibs.
No difference get the one you like and have access to ammo. Always seems on forums that what people already have and use is the best. I have taken deer and varmints with a .243 for over 50 years and never lost one. Run a few yards yes but never lost. Of course I don't care what you shoot one with that can happen with that last shot of adrenaline they get...
someguy2800
Member
I have not. I primarily use H4831 and RL19 but have tried a couple others. I am quite satisfied with 3000 so I stopped experimenting long ago.
Either would do what you listed just fine but I would take the 25-06 just because I might want to use it on heavier game or at longer ranges and just because I would like one. Mine actually is a 6mm Rem and it would do great for what you listed also.
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Hog huntin Harry
Member
What barrel length do ammunition manufacturers use to attain advertised velocities ?
Not sure about factory loads but Hodgdon uses 24” with their reloading data for 243 Win.
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