44 accuracy issues.

[Axis II]

I loaded 20 44mag 240gr xtp bullets with starline brass and 24gr imr 4227 with a heavy crimp for a handi rifle and fired 10 shots at 50 yards and all would hit within a baseball or tighter of front and rear bag.

at 100yards sometimes they would hit very close to each other or hit the bull and others would shoot 2-3 inches away. what are the odds its my reloads that aren't up to par? if all of them shot off at 100yards I would say okay its the gun or scope but say 5 of 10 shot bullseye and 5 shot all over.

 

[murf]

if you want consistency @ 100 yards: trim all cases to same length, measure case mouth thickness and reject any over .002" variance, bell case mouth only enough to reliably seat bullet (have a xtp bullet handy to check this every time you set up the belling die), ream all case flash holes with a .080" drill bit, make sure you do each reloading step the same for every round.

luck,

murf

 

[Load Master]

I guess I'm not sure what your complaint is. What you state seems pretty good for a revolver round shot from a rifle. I had this same conversation with a fellow at the range two days ago. He too was frustrated that he couldn't keep tighter than a 4 inch circle at 100 yards with his .44 Mag rifle. He was comparing to his 30/06!!

He was shooting Hornady 44 Mag 240 gr XTP.

 

[Axis II]

I guess ill just have to deal with it. I have one hole fever after learning to reload now every rifle shoots one ragged hole. I guess its still minute of deer so I should be happy.

 

[Load Master]

I guess ill just have to deal with it. I have one hole fever after learning to reload now every rifle shoots one ragged hole. I guess its still minute of deer so I should be happy.

Have you tried ladder testing? You are at the high end of the charge, most of my best groups are at something less than max charge. If you have time it would be worth trying some different charge levels.

I should mention that my buddy's Ruger 44 mag carbine is still one of my favorite rifles. I've tried to buy it from him, but to date he isn't willing to part with it.

 

[mdi]

Don't give up yet. Tweek your loads and try different combinations. Your Handi should be able to give you 3"-4" groups @100. Jes keep fiddlin'. It took me a while and a lot of practice (I'm the worst part of the accuracy aspects) to get good groups from my Puma .44 Mag...

 

[Curator]

Ohihunter,

Your results are not unusual shooting .44 Mag in a Handi Rifle. To begin with the Handi barrels have a "coned" chamber throat instead of a chamber end and rifling leade. Chamber is coned fro the aproximate end of the cast to the rifling. You can get better accuracy by seating bullets out to touch the rifling when chambered. My Handi .44 Mag needed the use of .445 Supermag brass to get the bullets to touch the rifling. Once they did, clover leaf groups at 100 yards are possible. Also, keep in mind that the rifling twist of these barrels is 1 in 38" and they don't shoot longish, heavy bullets well. Round-nose, flat point, .432" 240 grains or less work great. Gas-check if cast!

 

[Axis II]

I didn't get how they started throwing all over at 100yards when 50 was touching. I started getting better groups at 50 as I went up close to 24gr but I will play with them again and see if I can get something better.

 

[WVRJ]

What Curator said,plus eliminate the crimp.Just do enough to get rid of the case bell.Try and seat the bullets out to the rifling and pay no mind to the crimp groove.

 

[RealGun]

What Curator said,plus eliminate the crimp.Just do enough to get rid of the case bell.Try and seat the bullets out to the rifling and pay no mind to the crimp groove.

I am always skeptical of the no-crimp crowd. This is not a target rifle. It seems to me that if many of the rounds are grouping really well, there is a variance in the ammo that crimp does not cover up one way or the other. Making sure the case length (and then the crimp) is a consistent length is a good place to start in my opinion.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

I didn't get how they started throwing all over at 100yards when 50 was touching. I started getting better groups at 50 as I went up close to 24gr but I will play with them again and see if I can get something better.

Don't take this wrong but are you sure it's not you instead if the ammo that isn't up to par? If that load us very accyrate @50 yards it should be good @100 yards too. Not always but most times.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

What Curator said,plus eliminate the crimp.Just do enough to get rid of the case bell.Try and seat the bullets out to the rifling and pay no mind to the crimp groove.

IMO that is not a good idea. The powder being used needs time to burn and a crimp is how it's done. I do agree the crimp should be uniform.

 

[Axis II]

its not me throwing shots because I shot my 45-70 and a few others and I could hang with the best of them. I will be going home tonight and loading some up and trim all to the same length and see if I can play around with it and see. it could just be a crappy shooter at 100yards. could be me too but I had no issue shooting the thumpers.

 

[murf]

aim small, hit small. are you shooting a scope, or iron sights?

murf

 

[Axis II]

aim small, hit small. are you shooting a scope, or iron sights?

murf

scope. at 50yards I can put 3 touching at 100 it opens up to minute of deer.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

Could be the bullet even though the XTP is usually accurate. When not loading lead bullets I shoot Nosler 158gr JHP bullets in my .357 Magnum levergun. They make them for the .44 Magnum too in both 240gr JHP & JSP. They are very accurate bullets for me @over 100 yards.
http://www.nosler.com/sporting-handgun-revolver-bullet/

 

[Axis II]

Could be the bullet even though the XTP is usually accurate. When not loading lead bullets I shoot Nosler 158gr JHP bullets in my .357 Magnum levergun. They make them for the .44 Magnum too in both 240gr JHP & JSP. They are very accurate bullets for me @over 100 yards.
http://www.nosler.com/sporting-handgun-revolver-bullet/

getting too close to gun season for that but I will try them and others this winter. I've shot this thing with the same load at 100yards and can never get it to group decent enough for my linking. I'm sure my brother will be able to drop a deer with it the way its shooting but I like them a lot tighter. I am going to load up some more and see if I can keep from getting PO and see what it can do.

 

[the Black Spot]

I have owned probably 6 handi rifles. When shooting off the bench try to rest your rifle close to the action as possible. If you rest it on the screw that holds the forearm on it can throw the bullet. One gun i had shot great when i put a rubber washer tween forearm and barrel(screw went through center of the washer).
Best i got from 44 mag handi and xtp where 2.5" at 100 yd with open sights.

 

[Axis II]

I'm greeting 2.5-3 inch groups at 100yards I will try the bag closer and the washer.

 

[Steve51]

I have used IMR 4227 with the Hornady 204 gr. XTP and had excellent accuracy from my Henry Big Boy. I was using 22.0 grains of powder. Might try dropping powder charge back a little. Just my thought on the subject.

 

[Steelworker]

I have a handi rifle in 44 also. My best accuracy was at a lower powder charge....right at 21.0 grains of imr4227.

 

[buck460XVR]

I have owned probably 6 handi rifles. When shooting off the bench try to rest your rifle close to the action as possible. If you rest it on the screw that holds the forearm on it can throw the bullet.

I was also gonna say it might have to do with how the gun is being rested. Most of the time when using just bags, I rest my arm on them supporting the rifle as I would when shooting freehand. As for no crimp on a slow burning magnum handgun powder in straight wall case.......you're just asking for inconsistency. 3" groups @ 100 yards with a handgun caliber carbine is about average. I can do a little better than that with my 77/44 but it's probably the gun and not the load.

 

[Axis II]

im going to start from min-max again and shoot it at 100yards and see what happens. I will also adjust the bags to sit farther back and see if that helps. thanks for the help guys. I wasn't sure if it was my reloads or the gun or me.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

Since you are going to use this rifle for hunting why bother playing around with where you rest the rifle on the bags. Put up a deer target 100 yards out and take 5 shots with the rifle in hunting positions. When all 5 hit the kill circle on the target you can stop obsessing over groups. It's not a target rifle, it's a hunting rifle.

 

[Axis II]

Since you are going to use this rifle for hunting why bother playing around with where you rest the rifle on the bags. Put up a deer target 100 yards out and take 5 shots with the rifle in hunting positions. When all 5 hit the kill circle on the target you can stop obsessing over groups. It's not a target rifle, it's a hunting rifle.

I blame you guys! LOL. just joking. ever since I started reloading 223 and got tips from you guys and get all shots touching ive become obsessed that everything must do this.

I use a adjustable shooting rail on my treestand and its pretty solid so shooting off the bench is somewhat the same.