9mm carbine suggestions? $1,000 budget.

Status
Not open for further replies.
bullseyebob47

bullseyebob47

Member
Joined
Sep 2, 2013
Messages
249
Location
Louisiana
i would like one that takes glock mags but reliability is my #1 concern.

i want it to shoot 15 cent steel case ammo, would forgive a malfunction once in a while using those.

im looking at beretta storm and just right carbine right now.

**btw, whats the life expectancy of a 9mm carbine vs. ar15?
 
Reliability is hard to judge, most people who have a particular brand tend to like it, and the people who review firearms are often hesitant to trash its reliability (or don't shoot enough to judge reliability). If reliability were top priority I would probably stick with something that was designed for (and used by) military and police. This would include the CX Storm and Scorpion EVO. Do any of the others have history in service?

I like that the CX Storm is significantly shorter, lighter, and less expensive than the Scorpion. I hate how ugly the CX Storm is though :) I'll eventually buy one or the other, unless there is some other battle proven 9mm carbine that I'm not considering.
 
bullseyebob47 said:
**btw, whats the life expectancy of a 9mm carbine vs. ar15?
Click to expand...

Good question, I'd like to know that as well as which one is more reliable. I'm no firearms expert, but my guess is that a blowback design should be more tolerant of neglect (e.g. not oiling and cleaning) than the AR style. It also seems like longevity would be helped by the lower pressures and velocities of handugn rounds. Is it even possible to "shoot out" a 9mm barrel?
 
The hi-point ain't bad at all, especially for what it costs. I'd take it over most other blowback pistol carbines -scorpion evo included (I really wanted to like the Evo, but don't. It's an uncomfortable pig, the ambidextrous safety is in exactly the wrong place). The beretta storm ain't bad either, but I don't know what else it offers. Everything else seems like it began life as an open bolt SMG, and was neutered into a closed bolt pistol, or carbine with an extra long barrel.

If you really want glock mags, I'd look at one of the PSA glock AR lowers, and whatever upper suited you best. However, it may take a year for PSA to have the configuration you want. You can also build up a pistol while you wait for a stamp. Personally I'd prefer a pistol caliber SBR if I was getting a carbine. No need for all that weight forward.

Another option is SBRing a glock pistol and getting a conversion stick for it. I like the FAB more than the Roni. Mags and reliability will not be an issue. Glock 17 + stamp + converter would likely still be in your budget.

I assume the SIG MPX and various roller lock HK clones are all out of your budget.
 
Ed Ames said:
Sticking just to Glock magazine compatible: Sub2K, ASR, AR15 with a Glock mag adapter, Thureon GA.

Ignoring Glock mags: CZ Scorpion EVO
Click to expand...

Didn't you forget the Just Rite (sp?) carbine? Or were you considering it to be essentially an AR variant?

If you really want glock mags, I'd look at one of the PSA glock AR lowers, and whatever upper suited you best.
Click to expand...

I bought a PSA pistol lower and swapped out the tube, then bought a 16" upper when they had them in stock. I wish I had filed a Form 1 on it before 41F and swapped in a 8" barrel. There's just no need for a full rifle length barrel.
 
Elkins45 said:
Didn't you forget the Just Rite (sp?) carbine?
Click to expand...

I should have said that that was a list of guns the OP may not have considered, but met the overall criteria and are (from what I've seen) reasonable choices. I figured the JR was already in the running since the OP mentioned it, and the High-Point was mentioned by someone else.

bullseyebob47 said:
btw, whats the life expectancy of a 9mm carbine vs. ar15?
Click to expand...

In principle a decent 9mm carbine should last longer as they are simpler and less stressed. For a real answer you'll need to buy a pallet of ammo and report back. :)
 
I own piles of high end firearms. I snubbed the Hi-Point Carbines. A top gun smith at D&I Guns in Morgan, Ut. told me he had one. I bought a .40 S&W Hi-point Carbine $249 dollars, it functions flawlessly and is very accurate. The little "Orphan" is fun to shoot.:)
 
**btw, whats the life expectancy of a 9mm carbine vs. ar15?
Click to expand...

I have read some comments about the blowback action putting significantly more stress on the hammer and hammer pins than a gas gun. Some of the research I did made me think that broken hammer pins and elongated holes were potential issues with 9mm guns.

I know my PSA gun had a bad habit of making these
with the stock spring and buffer. I mounted an A2 stock on mine and poured a rifle length buffer full of lead to give it a little more resistance to premature opening. This really works against the idea of a light, handy carbine---my 9mm AR weighs more than my .223 AR, which sort of defeats the purpose.
 
Dog Soldier said:
I own piles of high end firearms. I snubbed the Hi-Point Carbines. A top gun smith at D&I Guns in Morgan, Ut. told me he had one. I bought a .40 S&W Hi-point Carbine $249 dollars, it functions flawlessly and is very accurate. The little "Orphan" is fun to shoot.:)
Click to expand...

IMO the ONLY downside to the Hi-Point carbine is that it doesn't share magazines with Glock, Beretta, M&P, etc. I traded mine for a Marlin Camp Carbine before they were discontinued, but I didn't trade it because it wasn't a great gun. I traded it because of magazine capacity.
 
Elkins45 said:
IMO the ONLY downside to the Hi-Point carbine is that it doesn't share magazines with Glock, Beretta, M&P, etc. I traded mine for a Marlin Camp Carbine before they were discontinued, but I didn't trade it because it wasn't a great gun. I traded it because of magazine capacity.
Click to expand...
Well you can use the 15 round 1911 magazines. It takes a few minutes to open up the latch port in the Mag. The "Red Ball". 20 round Hi-Point Mags work just fine.

http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/20...dball-hi-point-9mm-carbine-20-round-magazine/
 
I really wanted a CZ Scorpion last year, but I couldn't pass up a Hi Point I found for $225 so I went that route. So far it's been dead reliable, my only complaint is the 10 round mags but I haven't bought any of those Red Ball mags that came out last year yet. Apparently those are as reliable as Hi Point factory mags.

Since then, a buddy of mine picked up a Scorpion pistol. As a handgun, it was almost painful to shoot due to the ambi-safety location. I'm not sure if a carbine would change the ergo's enough to be comfortable, but I expected more from CZ.
 
I Have a second hand Hi-point 995 and id put it up against any other carbine for performance. Fit and finish arnt great, but for 250 bucks or so you get something that goes BANG and hits what your shooting at.
Only down side is no flush fitting hi cap mags, i cant stand mags sticking down below grips, Not that it would matter for me as im limited to 10 rounds anyway....probably what makes the hipoints so popular here, havent seen any of the other common PCCs at the range yet.


Elkins45 said:
I have read some comments about the blowback action putting significantly more stress on the hammer and hammer pins than a gas gun. Some of the research I did made me think that broken hammer pins and elongated holes were potential issues with 9mm guns.

I know my PSA gun had a bad habit of making these
with the stock spring and buffer. I mounted an A2 stock on mine and poured a rifle length buffer full of lead to give it a little more resistance to premature opening. This really works against the idea of a light, handy carbine---my 9mm AR weighs more than my .223 AR, which sort of defeats the purpose.
Click to expand...
I was under the impression that blowback ARs had specific bolts and buffers, specifically with increased weight to keep the action closed longer so bulges in the case (and other early opening related problems) like that didnt happen? I know the 995s got a heck of alot of mass to move. It also has a relatively light recoil, and striker spring.
I think that might increase its reliability a bit as well, I made a ton of 147grn powder puff loads that wont cycle my Witness P/S with a 10lb spring in it, I have to drop to an 8 to run them. The highpoint cycles them fine but you can literally feel that big block of steel sliding back and forth. switch to hornady Critical defense 124s or my own hotter handloads, and recoil impulse goes up, but case come out looking fine.
 
Reading the DIYs on a local board, getting a 9mm AR running right seems to be a guessing game. "Let's try this bolt and that buffer. That doesn't work, how about that bolt and this buffer. Or this bolt and this buffer because that bolt and that buffer sure don't run."

And one factory Colt here is not very flexible on ammo. It is not usable with the owner's 147 gr subsonics. Which aggravates him because he has a silencer for it. Wonder if he has tried factory subsonics.
 
Last edited:
LoonWulf said:
I was under the impression that blowback ARs had specific bolts and buffers, specifically with increased weight to keep the action closed longer so bulges in the case (and other early opening related problems) like that didnt happen?
Click to expand...

This gun came with the heavier, steel buffer and a special 9mm bolt. It didn't seem to be enough, and those weren't nuclear loads I was shooting. Maybe I just got a weak spring?
 
Something that needs to be understood when assembling an AR15 9mm is that the 9mm case is about half the length of a .223/5.56 case, so standard buffers are going to be too short which allows the buffer to move further into the buffer tube. This will end up causing more recoil and problems for the bolt hold open feature (breaking bolt hold latches). Manufactures make a longer buffer to accomodate the shorter 9mm case, which will prevent overtravel of the buffer. There have been many who use a stack of quarters to get the right needed length at the back of the buffer tube behind the spring to take up that difference in cartridge length, which seemingly works fine.

One also must be aware of the need for more mass on a blow back design, 9mm BCG's are weighted heavier than standard .223/5.56 BCG's and people are running at a bear minimum H3 buffers for their 9mm AR's, and most use an even heavier 9mm specific buffer which weights range from 6-8 oz., adding more weight to the buffer helps alleviate stress on the locking and unlocking of the bolt and increases dwell time to allow for the pressures of the cartridge to reduce before unlocking the bolt, which will provide longevity to the bolt lugs.

Just wanted to state that the AR15 9mm is a different beast than just assembling another .223/5.56 AR. Do your research first and expect some find tuning for different cartridge weights and power.
 
Last edited:
Dog Soldier said:
I own piles of high end firearms. I snubbed the Hi-Point Carbines. A top gun smith at D&I Guns in Morgan, Ut. told me he had one. I bought a .40 S&W Hi-point Carbine $249 dollars, it functions flawlessly and is very accurate. The little "Orphan" is fun to shoot.:)
Click to expand...

I also own a Hi-Point carbine, but it's a 9mm. Like it since it operates fine, and does what it's intended. Can't complain about the price.

But, I 'd like to be able to get some stock Hi-Point manufactured (not after market), mags with greater than 10 round capacity, with no "work" involved.

Any suggestions ?:scrutiny:
 
Maybe sending them your needs would help. We must remember the Hi-Point Carbine was born from gun control. The large cap AR15 in .223 was being Banned in many places.
The Hi-Point with a limited capacity of 10, filled that void. It was only chambered in pistol calibers. :)
 
You can build an AR pattern on a PSA or QC10 lower for about that price if you don't go nuts on fancy stocks, handguards, etc.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

socalbeachbum
  • Locked
9mm carbine selection need help
2 3
Replies
68
Views
6K
Chuck R.
Chuck R.
G
  • Locked
Pistol Caliber Carbine: What are my options?
2
Replies
26
Views
2K
MrDig
MrDig
bullseyebob47
  • Locked
hi point 9mm carbine questions.
2
Replies
37
Views
4K
webrx
webrx
WestKentucky
  • Locked
m1 carbine 9mm or another 9mm carbine?
Replies
14
Views
2K
Stumper
Stumper
M
  • Locked
AR-15 on a shoe-string budget
2
Replies
47
Views
3K
jmr40
jmr40
Back
Top