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A teacher raised an interesting statement today...

Discussion in 'General Gun Discussions' started by natedog, Sep 5, 2003.

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  1. natedog

    natedog Member

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    My forensics teacher today was talking about self defense and philosophy. He said that if you have a gun for self defense, and plan ahead for defending yourself, he proclaimed that that is pre-meditated murder. Your thoughts?
     
  2. Mark Tyson

    Mark Tyson Member

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    No, because it lacks malice.
     
  3. duckfoot

    duckfoot member

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  4. SDC

    SDC Member

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    That's ludicrous; it's pre-meditated SELF-DEFENCE, and if the other party didn't wish to be defended from, all he'd have to do is not do anything worth being defended against (if you see my meaning).
     
  5. natedog

    natedog Member

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    My thoughts exactly. My, my, that was fast.
     
  6. critter

    critter Member

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    Ignorence is NOT confined to the student body in many if not most schools nowadays!
     
  7. Autolite

    Autolite Member

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    He is absolutely right ...

    Of course, this line of reasoning would also apply to all police and military personnel who have been hired and trained by the state to carry out government sanctioned 'pre-meditated murder'. Interesting point of view isn't it ???
     
  8. tiberius

    tiberius Member

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    He's an idiot. Its still early in the semester....change classes.
     
  9. Silver Bullet

    Silver Bullet Member

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    I can remember when teachers were role models. Guess that gives away my age.
     
  10. PlayTheAces

    PlayTheAces Member

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    So just what exactly is this guy advocating? Is he putting forward a premise that people have no right to self defense? Is he suggesting shooting for the kneecaps? What, precisely, is his major maladjustment?
     
  11. 4v50 Gary

    4v50 Gary Moderator Staff Member

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    Well if that isn't a harsh and strict interpretation of the Code of Hammurabi. Even the English Common Law allows for self defense (and I'm sure Hammurabi would agree).

    General murder is the slaying of another human with malice aforethought. Gee, unless I'm mistaken, self defense isn't malice aforethought.
     
  12. boing

    boing Member

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    And if you decide to be defenseless, knowing that you could be killed as a result, shouldn't you be committed to a mental institution for suicidal tendencies?
     
  13. Baba Louie

    Baba Louie Member

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    Pre-meditated "justfiable homicide" is more like it and a "more" correct answer.

    A flippant answer might be, "some people just need killin".

    Murder is a considered to be an offense against the peace and tranquility of the community. Defending your life could be so construed, but if your P's & Q's are aligned, most DA/Grand Juries will give you a clean bill.

    That's a good thing.

    Adios
     
  14. Don Gwinn

    Don Gwinn Moderator Emeritus

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    My thoughts, in no particular order:

    1. If I'd been there, I'd have felt compelled to raise my hand and ask exactly how he figures such a thing. This has gotten me in trouble before, but I can't seem to help it.

    2. If this guy is teaching criminal forensics (studying physical evidence, etc.) watch him carefully. He may know what he's talking about, but he's not off to a good start.

    3. If this guy is teaching forensics as in debate and logic, either get out of that class or resign yourself to a long semester. This man will do damage to his students.
     
  15. mete

    mete Member

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    He has a basic misunderstanding between 'killing' and 'murder'. Unfortunately this is common since most translations of the ten commandments are wrong. The original is 'thou shalt not murder". Killing is acceptable in the bible and in the courts. Our supreme court has stated that you have a right to use lethal force to prevent death or serious injury. It's sad when people permit themselves to be murdered without any attempt to prevent that murder.
     
  16. BerettaNut92

    BerettaNut92 Member

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    Great, so now we have this guy AND that CSI show making experts out of everybody.

    Can I ask where you're going to school?
     
  17. Henry Bowman

    Henry Bowman Senior Member

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    Maybe he's just yanking you chain to see who will bite.

    (Sorry about the mixed metaphor.)
     
  18. Andrew Wyatt

    Andrew Wyatt Member

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    Sounds like Bakersfield College, which is populated by the largest supply of leftists i've ever seen in one place.
     
  19. cool45auto

    cool45auto Member

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    Never before did a "smiley" say so much: :barf:
     
  20. Waitone

    Waitone Member

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    I've been frustrated lately because I see so many idiots who are able to get their pontifications published and make money at the same time. In frustration I demanded to know how I can be an idiot and get paid for it.

    Weeeellll, seems to me I don't have to limit myself to journalism. Seems I can become a forensics instructor, be an idiot, and get paid for it.

    OK! I'm off to implement Plan B.
     
  21. JohnKSa

    JohnKSa Member

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    A well educated person in a crime-fighting related profession who doesn't know what murder is...

    I don't know whether to laugh or cry.
     
  22. Standing Wolf

    Standing Wolf Member in memoriam

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    I think you need a forensics teacher with more than half a brain.

    I shoot to live, not kill.
     
  23. Zundfolge

    Zundfolge Member

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    Killing is not always murder.


    Self defense is one of those cases where killing is not murder.



    Therefore your teacher is wrong.

    :evil:
     
  24. Duncan Idaho

    Duncan Idaho member

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    Your teacher's village called...they want their idiot back. :rolleyes: :scrutiny: :uhoh: :barf:

    The fundamental principle of forensics is discernment. If one cannot discern between moral (right action) killing i.e. defensive killing, and immoral (wrong action) killing i.e. pre-meditated, unprovoked murder, then one has no business teaching.

    Call him on it. If he did it to test the class, fine. If he believes it, then he is a certifiable moron. You should then take immediate action to leave him and his BS behind.
     
  25. goon

    goon Member

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    In that case, every officer involved shooting amounts to murder/attempted murder.
    Don't the police carry loaded weapons and practice using them regularly?
    Why doesn't it bother him that the government is training law enforcement officers to murder citizens without even allowing them to have their say in a court of law?
    Ask him about that one.:neener:
    Check and mate.

    Also, what about the criminal?
    By attacking you, isn't the criminal acutally trying to commit suicide?
     
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