Accidental vs. Negligent

[heavyshooter]

Some discharges are accidental. Some (MOST!!!) discharges are negligent.

Unlike most High Roaders, I have been in the presence of a poorly designed or malfunctioning firearm. It has resulted in an AD (it wasn't me of course ). 9 out of 10 discharges are ND's because 9 out of 10 guns require the pulling of the trigger. But there is still the occasional AD. This is why there is more than one rule of gun safety.

For example, if my gun has a drop safety on it and it fires after I drop it, that is and AD. If I inadvertently pull the trigger a second time because of a light trigger pull combined with heavy recoil, that is an ND.

Heavy

 

[Brass Rain]

Well, if a person is holstering their handgun and a stray loop of thread from a shirt or something manages to loop inside the trigger, puling it... well that's an accident. I'd like to think any unintentional firing of the gun with one's finger on the trigger is negligence, and anything causing it to fire without pulling the trigger is accidental.

But I'm no expert of course.

And come to think of it, one hell of a thread and a real push would be required for my example to work, but I'll bet it's happened.

 

[Erik M]

accidental would be dropping a firearm causing a discharge, a slamfire, or something u did not intend to happen through a mechanical failure or human error.

Neglegent would be if an individual was 'playing' with a loaded gun and fired it because they assumed it wasnt loaded.

 

[Finney]

I had a bulleye gun (1911) that would fire when you released the slide if you did not hold the trigger back.
Would that be a accident or negligence?

 

[Blackbeard]

'Accident' does not discount negligence. Some accidents are caused by negligence, but they're still accidents. 'Accident' merely speaks to intent, not fault. If you get into a car crash with some driver who was doing her makeup and steering with her feet, would you say you got into a 'negligent'? No, it's still an accident, and one that was caused by her negligence.

 

[NinjaFeint]

EddieNFL-

Let's say something awful happens involving shooting something I didn't intend to shoot.

Cops come, start asking what happened.

I am in the habit of calling these events "negligent discharges" so I tell the cop "I had a negligent discharge."

Cop writes in report "subject admitted he was negligent."

Prosecutor reads police report and sees where I admitted to a criminal act. Now I am facing trial on felony charges.

Lawyer hired to investigate the incident reads police report in which I admitted being negligent and now files massive lawsuit knowing he can tell the jury I admitted being negligent, thus making me totally liable for all damages.

No thank you.

Yes, absolutely, most ADS are the result of some negligence. But using that word is a dangerous thing as it means you assume full legal responsibility with no hope of explaining what really happened.

So, if you don't mean to do it, you aren't accountable?

Eh, just blame the gun. Works for the left.

It all comes back to taking responsibility for what happens with your firearms. The cop will ask for a description of the incident and this is what will hold weight, not what you categorize it as but what they determine it is.

Tell the cop it was whatever you want but don't kid yourself that it wasn't negligent and don't kid yourself you saying it was an accident makes you not liable.

 

[NinjaFeint]

I had a bulleye gun (1911) that would fire when you released the slide if you did not hold the trigger back.
Would that be a accident or negligence?

If you know it does this and did not have it changed then failed to hold the trigger back, it would be negligent. If you hold the trigger back then there would be no discharge, so you would be negligent in not doing so.

I make it a rule with any newly acquired semi-auto to have the first time I drop the slide on a live round be with the gun pointed safely down range. I know you can check the functions of the gun other ways but I would rather err on the side of safety.

 

[Double Naught Spy]

If you shoot yourself and your wife while she is on the phone with the MIL, you can be darned sure to be reminded that it was negligent for the rest of your life...

Blotter: Single bullet wounds man and wife
10:29 AM CST on Thursday, January 14, 2010

By Donna Fielder / Staff Writer
Denton police officers responding to a report of a shooting in the 500 block of South Carroll Boulevard about 6:15 p.m. Saturday found a man and woman both injured by the same bullet.

The man explained that he planned to go shooting with some friends the next day and was oiling his 9mm pistol. He unloaded and then loaded it, he said. His wife was talking on her cellphone to her mother, who had just sent a package of presents to them.

The man said his wife wanted him to try on a sweater her mother had sent. He laid down the pistol and tried on the sweater.

By the time he had picked the gun back up, he had forgotten he reloaded it, he said. Believing it was unloaded, he pulled the trigger.

The bullet first hit his finger, which was over the barrel. Then it struck his wife in the buttocks.

Both were taken by ambulance to a hospital emergency room with injuries that were not life-threatening.

http://www.dentonrc.com/sharedcontent/dws/drc/localnews/stories/DRC_Blotter_0114.7883dfdb.html

 

[EddieNFL]

For example, if my gun has a drop safety on it and it fires after I drop it, that is and AD.

Either the gunsmith or manufacturer was negligent. The owner, as well, if he was aware of the problem.

 

[orionengnr]

I believe it has been laid out pretty clearly.

If the firearm malfunctioned, it was an accidental discharge.
If some dummy pressed the trigger when he shouldn't have, it was negligent.

I don't know why this is so difficult to understand.

Or perhaps I do...the inability/unwillingness of so many people to take responsibility for their own actions has become anethma in our society.

Too bad that several generations have been raised this way.

 

[EddieNFL]

If the firearm malfunctioned, it was an accidental discharge.

Guns rarely discharge by themselves. With very rare exceptions, a human is a fault; poor maintenance, home 'smithing, etc...