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Alabama - Six arrested in 'militia' weapons raids; nearby school shut

Discussion in 'Legal' started by jrou111, Apr 27, 2007.

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  1. LawBot5000

    LawBot5000 Member

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    This sounds like a dramatic take on a few counts of what amounts to tax evasion. Nothing these guys had was illegal. They just didnt pay the tax on it. Yeah, a crime, but they even admit these guys werent doing anything malicious.

    If they were selling DDs to undercover agents, that would probably be at the top of every press release. I've seen far too many "big ATF cases" completely fail (like 80% receiver guy) to trust them anymore. It seems like most of their raids are founded on charges they know to be BS so they can go on a fishing expedition.

    These lightly supported fishing expeditions are only slightly less harmful than the writs of assistance that we abolished with the 4th amendment. Someone should do a statistical study of the frequency with which crimes are put in affidavits and the frequency with which those crimes end up in charges and convictions. I dont think it would be too difficult to make a case that a significant portion of US laws are not enforced per se but used as fodder for search warrants.
     
  2. Geister

    Geister Member

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    I agree with LawBot. In this instance, the federal government initiated force, not this militia.

    I can see where you're coming from, Archie, but the fact is the federal government per capita has used a hell of a lot more firepower against innocents than normal people have. I'm more concerned with what a fed will do with such firepower. We've already seen Waco and Ruby Ridge.
     
  3. jrfoxx

    jrfoxx Member

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    What's up with this line? I thought you could make a firearm (non-full auto)without any licensing as long as YOU made the gun FOR YOURSELF, and never transferred/sold it (I beleive your name and/or address and possibly a serial number on the gun is required)? Am I wrong on that, or is this likely just a poorly phrased and/or confused sentence from the roporter? If I'm right about the manufacturing a gun thing, there would be no such law as "conspiracy to make a firearm", just failing to mark it properly, or manufacturing without a license (if you tried to sell/transfer it).
     
  4. WeedWhacker

    WeedWhacker Member

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    Tell that to Wayne Fincher. :(

    -edit
    Coulda sworn you didn't have "except for full auto" there. Still doesn't matter, tho: shall not be infringed.
     
  5. crazed_ss

    crazed_ss Member

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    Meh.. I dont see a problem here.. these guys certainly dont sound on the up and up and the choosing sides comment makes it even more distrubing. What are they planning to do? Blow up some brown people?

    Is it ever OK for the cops to arrest someone on weapons charges?
     
  6. cassandrasdaddy

    cassandrasdaddy Member

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    as a matter of fact

    these fine americans were planning on doing just that
    jail gonna be a fun place for em.....
     
  7. Reyn

    Reyn Member

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    ATF: Alabamians plotted to machine-gun Mexicans
    Judge denies bond for 5 in militia arsenal case; agent testifies about attack plan


    By Jay Reeves
    Associated Press Writer

    BIRMINGHAM — Five members of a self-styled militia were denied bond Tuesday after a federal agent testified they planned a machine-gun attack on Mexicans, but a judge approved bond for a sixth man accused of having weapons and explosives components in his home.

    Law enforcement authorities, meanwhile, fanned out looking for additional munitions that could be linked to the group.

    U.S. Magistrate Judge Robert Armstrong said he could not grant bond to the five because of the agent's testimony and the large amount of weapons — including about 200 homemade hand grenades — that were seized in raids in Northeast Alabama on Friday.

    "I'm going to be worried if I let these individuals go at this time," he said.

    Adam Nesmith, an agent with the federal Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives, testified that the five — Raymond Kirk Dillard, 46; Adam Lynn Cunningham, 41; Bonnell Hughes, 57; Randall Garrett Cole, 22; and James Ray McElroy, 20 — planned an attack on Mexicans in Remlap, a small town just north of Birmingham, and actually went there on a reconnaissance mission April 20, but he provided no other details.

    Nesmith said Dillard told a confidential informant that the group, which calls itself the Alabama Free Militia, viewed government agents as "the enemy" and had a standing order to open fire if anyone saw government agents approaching.

    Armstrong said bond was denied Dillard because he already was a fugitive after failing to report for probation on a weapons case out of Mobile.

    The judge approved a $10,000 bond for the sixth defendant, 30-year-old Michael Wayne Bobo, at a later hearing. Bobo, who was kept in custody at least until Wednesday, was charged with being a drug user in possession of a firearm. The other five were charged with conspiring to make a firearm.

    ATF agent Larry Alt testified that investigators who searched Bobo's home found two rooms loaded with guns and possible explosives components, including fireworks, ball bearings, primers, mouse traps, light bulbs and fertilizer. The man lived in two upstairs rooms in his parents' home in Trusville, Alt testified.

    Bobby Bobo, the defendant's father, said he "knew about some of the things, and I was concerned." But he said he was less worried after a relative in the Army looked at the cache and said there was nothing illegal.

    Testimony showed that agents had secretly made recordings of the younger Bobo meeting with Dillard and McElroy in April and talking about illegal immigrants, anti-government leanings and weapons. But there was no direct mention of Bobo being in the Free Militia, evidence showed.

    Attorneys for the five did not directly address the charges during the hearing.

    In questioning Nesmith, however, they did attempt to show that their clients were not directly linked to all of the weapons seized.

    Authorities said agents during the raids last week recovered 130 homemade hand grenades, a grenade launcher, about 70 hand grenades rigged to be fired from a rifle, a machine gun, a short-barrel shotgun and 2,500 rounds of ammunition in the raids.

    A lawyer for Dillard, Scott Boudreaux, has said the case had been overblown by authorities. He said his client began stockpiling items partly because of the scare of the Y2K computer glitch in 2000.

    The six appeared in court as DeKalb County sheriff's deputies and federal agents searching for explosives returned to a rural area in Northeast Alabama near Collinsville, where authorities arrested some of the militia members last week and seized weapons.

    Stanna Guice, a spokeswoman for the sheriff's department, said authorities received information that explosives could be hidden in a cave in the area, so officers on foot and on horseback converged in a field and worked outward to search for any possible cache.

    ATF agent David Hyche said specialists were being brought in to assist with the search because of the size of the cave.

    .






    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
     
  8. .45&TKD

    .45&TKD Member

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    With only 2,500 rounds, I can't help but think this is overblown.
     
  9. pcosmar

    pcosmar member

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    Better check your home to make sure you don't have any "Bomb making materials".
     
  10. Geister

    Geister Member

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    You do realize that during the confrontations at Lexington and Concorde, the British were attempting to do just that, right?

    Governments around the world have killed more people than private citizens have.
     
  11. crazed_ss

    crazed_ss Member

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    Yea dude, but when people are illegally making grenades and planning to murder others, dont you think it's prudent to take their guns away?
     
  12. Fn-P9

    Fn-P9 Member

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    Crazed SS If I carry my gun with my (concealed) to the gas station, one could say I am secretly planning on murdering someone, just give me a reason. I have also been known to put a bit of acetylene in a Styrofoam cup and torch that off. I am defiantly anti-government and should be jailed. o yeah turn sarcasm on.

    Others have said if you have an illegal gun you should be punished. So when they take handguns away, we should all goto rifles, no questions asked?

    This is all a control issue. Who is in control of what. Guess who wants to control who and what.
     
  13. crazed_ss

    crazed_ss Member

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    I dunno.. have you discussed plans to shoot up the gas station? If yes, then I think the someone needs to come and take your gun away.
     
  14. pcosmar

    pcosmar member

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    Yeah, we all know the police and their "informants" would never lie.

    Ruby Ridge
    Waco
    Atlanta
     
  15. cassandrasdaddy

    cassandrasdaddy Member

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    hmmmm

    i believe they have tape of these brave patriots planning to gun down illegals. and i'm sure these genius champions of freedom have it all worked out how to dicern whos legal whose not. wanna guess these fellows were just gonna gun down brown folks? and gotta love the usual suspects who line up shoulder to shoulder with em. at least theres no shame in your games
    theres or the usual suspects

    that tape will bury em
     
  16. hammer4nc

    hammer4nc Member

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    I've been following this story pretty closely, all I've seen reported is the third hand testimony of a federal agent quoting an unnamed confidential informant, as to the conversations and illegal intents of the suspects. Hmmmm.

    cassandra, please provide a link citation for your claim of a tape (video or audio?). Thanks. Or, do you have some inside, classified, super-secret source that you can't disclose? :neener:

    Or, why would you just make stuff up?
     
  17. dralarms

    dralarms Member

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    Sounds like "white supremacy" garbage to me. I feel that they should be sent back to where ever they came from and return the legal way, but by no means do they deserve to be shot, beaten or crap like that (unless they are caught in the act of a violent crime)
     
  18. only1asterisk

    only1asterisk member

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    I remember a thread from years ago in which some of speculated on what the oft repeated "bomb making supplies" in our homes might be. These guys seem below par.

    David
     
  19. pcosmar

    pcosmar member

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    They said there is a recording, Ok maybe so.
    I could make the same tape or one much like it in any(English speaking) bar in this country. It's just beer talking.

    Again we have three different stories, or the story keeps changing.
    It just makes me guestion the story.
     
  20. only1asterisk

    only1asterisk member

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    It comes from a newspaper. That is enough for me to question the story.

    David
     
  21. ConstitutionCowboy

    ConstitutionCowboy member

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    ...In Defiance To Unconstitutional Law...

    There was a time when the Second Amendment was honored and none of these arms were "illegal". No one tried to overthrow the government back then, either. (Don't try to say, "What about the Civil War?", because that wasn't anyone trying to overthrow the United States.) These supposed militia men did no harm, threatened no harm as far as has been proven, and appear to be armed in their own defense - armed only IN DEFIANCE TO UNCONSTITUTIONAL LAW. We all should have the courage and foresight to do the same.

    No one is going to overthrow those in our government who abide the Constitution, honor our rights and freedoms, and serve only to do the work the Constitution lays out for them for which they are amply paid. In fact, we the people are armed to protect them from foreign invasion as much as we are armed to protect ourselves from foreign invasion - and as much to protect ourselves from them should they covet dominion as if they were a foreign invader. Makes me wonder why some of the people in our government wish to disarm us. Aren't you curious as well?

    Woody

    Look at your rights and freedoms as what would be required to survive and be free as if there were no government. If that doesn't convince you to take a stand and protect your inalienable rights and freedoms, nothing will. If that doesn't convince you to maintain your personal sovereignty, you are already someone else's subject. If you don't secure your rights and freedoms to maintain your personal sovereignty now, it'll be too late to come to me for help when they come for you. I will already be dead because I had to stand alone. B.E.Wood
     
  22. cassandrasdaddy

    cassandrasdaddy Member

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    jeepers

    i guess i stomped some other fellers toes . he must still be on campus but now he nows that his powers will be leaving him when he leave campus too.
    darned shame though if while following closely he missed this.
    http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/0501weapons-raid0501-ON.html

    heck i'm an old fart and did a google search of alabama free militia mexicans and viola i thought all those young guys had better computer skills than us old guys this line was the one

    "Testimony showed that agents had secretly recorded the younger Bobo meeting with Dillard and McElroy in April and talking about illegal immigrants, anti-government leanings and weapons. But there was no direct mention of Bobo being in the Free Militia, evidence showed."

    ya see in my old age i don't run as fast or see as good som i have to follow more closely than when i was young. and the other thing that occurs in senility is that i realize i don't know near as much as i did fresh outa school so i try to stay quiet so the guys who really do know everything can school me. plus i hate coming off as a putz;)
     
  23. cassandrasdaddy

    cassandrasdaddy Member

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    hey and i never heard the i was stockpiling because of y2k as a defense before i did learn something new course whether it works or not is another thing.
     
  24. pcosmar

    pcosmar member

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    And I am wondering if someone got busted for drugs and then made a snitch deal.
    I wonder how many of those plants belonged to young Bobo.
    I wonder how many of those "bombs" were party poppers.
    I wonder If young Bobo was wearing the wire, and steering the conversation.
    I wonder why a big deal is being made over a minor bust.

    Oh yeah, there were "Evil Militia" out to over throw the Government.

    Yes, I have a enquiring mind, I'ld like to know.
     
  25. cassandrasdaddy

    cassandrasdaddy Member

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    again

    AN ARTIST'S CONCEPT
    "There is a principle which is a bar against all information, which is proof against all arguments and which can not fail to keep a man in everlasting ignorance-that principle is contempt prior to investigation."
    --HERBERT SPENCER


    you might be right about young bobo wouldn't be the first time.

    why they make it a big deal?!! you kidding? these fine patriots wanted to go gin folks down becuase they don't like mexicans? you wanna make these dimwits poster children for gun rights? we need to chlorinate our own gene pool or not be shocked when we suffer the fallout these guys bring down
     
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