almost drew my gun yesterday

Status
Not open for further replies.

uspJ

Member
Joined
Dec 26, 2009
Messages
603
Location
Georgia
i didn't want to hijack touro1979's thread.

i was on my way out to a family cookout yesterday evening, my cousin was riding with me and asked if we could stop by the package store on the way. we pulled in to the package store and i told him i'd run in and get the beer. on my way in an older man approached me asking for money, i told him i couldn't help him, he asked again more forcefully not demanding but being aggressive in his tone. i told him i had nothing for him and went inside and made my purchase. on the way out he got loud and started yelling about how i was lowdown and acting like a punk for not giving him money. i tried to ignore him and walk to my car and he got between me and my car and tried to walk up to me like he wanted to fight.

i took a couple of steps back and yelled at him to stay back and not come any closer. he didn't listen and started toward me again, thats when i dropped the beer and got in a defensive stance and kept telling him to stay back. he paused when i showed him that i wasn't going to give him money or be intimidated. i told him again to move away from my car and that i didn't want any trouble. some guy came out the store yelling at me that the guy i was facing was his uncle and that he (the guy from inside the store) was gonna kick my butt for disrespecting his uncle.

i immediately moved away from both of them. i could see my cousin sitting in my car watching the whole thing with his jaw agape. i told both the guys that i didn't want any trouble and that i just wanted to leave and for the older guy to step away from my car so i could leave. the younger guy told me he didn't care what i wanted. the whole time he's yelling at me he's pointing his finger at me in the shape of a gun.

the owner of the liquor store came out and told all of us that he wanted us to leave and that he was going to call the police. i told the owner i was trying to leave and that the other guys were threatening me. the owner said he was going back in to call the poice. when he went back inside the younger of the two guys started walking toward me again and was flexing his fist. i pulled my shirt up and put my hand on my pistol and told him not to come any closer. he stopped in his tracks and had this look of shock on his face, he yelled at his uncle to get in the car and they both took off.

my cousin and i stayed and waited for the police to show up. when they got there i told them that i was armed. they asked for my gun and to see my permit. they then had me sit in the back of the car while they talked to the owner of the store and my cousin. one of the officers took my statement and description of the two men and their car and told me that i wouldn't be charged with anything. they returned my gun to me and told me that i was lucky that the guys backed down and left and that it was a good thing that i was armed.

sorry for the long post, but i wanted to share this with you guys. i also wanted to encourage anyone here that doesn't carry to start, if i hadn't had my gun i would probably have been hurt.
 
Last edited:
i honestly thought i was going to get charged when they told me get in the back of the car. i thought i was gonna get charged with brandishing or something similar since neither of the guys ever showed signs of a weapon. the officers were very profesional and afterward they told me i wouldn't have been charged even if i had drawn my gun because both men had made threatening gestures and kept advancing on me. the owner of the package store told them that the older guy had been there before and was told to leave because he was bothering customers.
 
I would've shot them as soon as they advanced after I gave them clear instructions, given that you had TWO guys after your ONE person.

You're going to get stuck with the business end of a knife being so kindhearted, giving them an infinite number of chances. You and everybody else who thinks this got handled in the safest way are asking for it.
 
The law here in Utah just got clarified, so that merely showing a gun or motioning to it in defensive posture is not in and of itself brandishing.

There were some key words you said that show you did it right. You said more than once that you backed up. You tried to de-escalate the situation. I think you did it perfectly right, the police did it exactly like they were supposed to. I'm going to guess that it won't be the first or the last time the police have dealt with the family. Now it will be on the record for the next time they shove someone around, that THEY are the ones who have a history of pushing people around.
 
Thanks for sharing. In California, we're not so fortunate as to have the right to carry a gun. Nice to read about good outcomes in a free state.
 
I would've shot them as soon as they advanced after I gave them clear instructions, given that you had TWO guys after your ONE person
.

True, and I don't disagree but... the legal problems would be very much deeper if he had shot, justified or not.

If it looked to me like someone was pulling a knife, yeah, bang, end of game.

Until then, I think he did just fine other than mayby getting his butt in the car and getting out of there quicker
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Thank goodness we no longer have to attempt to escape in Michigan. Doing so will just get you shot-in-the-back. You did well. Glad it turned out well for you.

Geno
 
The law here in Utah just got clarified, so that merely showing a gun or motioning to it in defensive posture is not in and of itself brandishing.

There were some key words you said that show you did it right. You said more than once that you backed up. You tried to de-escalate the situation. I think you did it perfectly right, the police did it exactly like they were supposed to. I'm going to guess that it won't be the first or the last time the police have dealt with the family. Now it will be on the record for the next time they shove someone around, that THEY are the ones who have a history of pushing people around.

i live in georgia and there is no duty to retreat statue here.

i kept trying to keep distance between us, but i was also trying to stay close enough that i could see my cousin. he was still in the car and i wanted to make sure he was out of the equation. i didn't put my hand on my gun untill the younger guy got about 8 feet from me, i was backpeddling for everything i was worth while going for my gun trying to keep him from closing distance.

I would've shot them as soon as they advanced after I gave them clear instructions, given that you had TWO guys after your ONE person.

You're going to get stuck with the business end of a knife being so kindhearted, giving them an infinite number of chances. You and everybody else who thinks this got handled in the safest way are asking for it.

i kept watching their hands, especially the guy gesturing. if he had put his hands near his pockets, beltline or behind him i would have drawn and been ready to fire. i don't think of myself as kindhearted for making sure i didn't need to shoot someone. the reason i didn't draw before was as soon as i pulled up my shirt and grabbed the gun he stopped, if he had continued his advance i would have drawn, if he continued after that i would have fired.
 
A guy asking for money and then getting abusive when you don't give it is not unusual. What was weird in your case was his nephew, apparently with money to go shopping in the store, treating you as "disrespecting" his uncle for declining to give money. I wonder if they were both unbalanced or whether this is some sort of strategy to gouge money from people by intimidation. Anyway, you handled it very well and I found reading your post very instructive. Thanks for sharing the experience.
 
Multiple opponents, even if displaying no visible weapons, represent a "disparity of force" to your one and would justify a display of your handgun, ready to use. It would not - or should not - be "brandishing" as you are not using it in a threatening manner, but to stop a potential threat.
 
And this is yet another example clarifying the statistic that the defensive use of a concealed firearm to prevent a crime only requires shots to be fired less than 10 percent of the time. In the overwhelming majority of cases, the mere presence of the firearm is enough to resolve the situation in favor of the armed citizen.

but... the legal s**t would be very much deeper if he had shot, justified or not.

Old Shooter is right. All that happened here is the cops showed up and took a statement. Had the OP actually fired his weapon, he would have been in a far more complicated situation. This situation as described might have been a good time to have some mace onhand. Guy isn't letting you get to your car, let him talk to Mr OC.
 
Stand your ground laws don't change whether or not you should do everything you can to avoid shooting someone. It still adds to the totality of the circumstances. All they do is add a layer of protection.

agreed.

i was trying everything i could to keep from escalating the situation.
 
I would've shot them as soon as they advanced after I gave them clear instructions, given that you had TWO guys after your ONE person.

It's a disparity, for sure, but not necessarily one justifying deadly force. If they had still not backed down once they became aware that the OP was armed, that changes things. Now they are demonstrating that they are not reasonable at any level, fearless to the point of being downright stupid, and aggressive in the extreme. That combination proves a dangerous individual, not just a bully.


i kept watching their hands, especially the guy gesturing. if he had put his hands near his pockets, beltline or behind him i would have drawn and been ready to fire. i don't think of myself as kindhearted for making sure i didn't need to shoot someone. the reason i didn't draw before was as soon as i pulled up my shirt and grabbed the gun he stopped, if he had continued his advance i would have drawn, if he continued after that i would have fired.

Logic and the outcome of the situation prove that this was the right line of thinking and the right course of action. Well done.
 
i took a couple of steps back and yelled at him to stay back and not come any closer. he didn't listen and started toward me again, thats when i dropped the beer and got in a defensive stance and kept telling him to stay back. he paused when i showed him that i wasn't going to give him money or be intimidated. i told him again to move away from my car and that i didn't want any trouble. some guy came out the store yelling at me that the guy i was facing was his uncle and that he (the guy from inside the store) was gonna kick my butt for disrespecting his uncle.
I just love this. You were "disrespecting" his uncle. Typical lowlife talk, especially ironic since none of those knuckleheads have any idea what respect is. That's right, his uncle accosted you, demanded money, then became aggressive when you didn't cave to his demands. Somehow, YOU were the one being disrespectful. The logic employed by such people is nothing short of amazing.
 
We probably all have run scenarios in our heads as to how a confrontation might present itself and how we'll respond, hopefully with the correct amount of restraint.

One constant we can be sure of is that it will never happen the way we anticipate.
 
uspJ said:
i was trying everything i could to keep from escalating the situation.
You win every gunfight you don't attend; well done. Now... you did remember to pick the beer up, right?
 
Interesting. You did everything a reasonable person would do, yet they kept escalating the conflict. I don't think you could have played it any better than you did.
 
You did everything a reasonable person would do, yet they kept escalating the conflict. I don't think you could have played it any better than you did.

I agree.

You reacted to each escalation without going overboard, well done.
 
I'm sure that if you brandished your gun like you described in California, you would have been arrested.

It is illegal to respond to a "fist-fight" with deadly force in California, meaning that you can't pull a gun out when some jerk just wants to punch your lights out!

The reason I post this is because I live in California and I have a CCW permit, so I always have to think about what sort of zany B.S. I'm gonna get in trouble for if I ever have to use my firearms in self-defense, since it all would settle on what a "reasonable person" would believe.

The below can be found on page 27 of the following:

http://ag.ca.gov/firearms/forms/pdf/Cfl2007.pdf

"An assault with fists does not justify use of a deadly weapon in self-defense unless the person being assaulted believes, and a reasonable person in the same or similar circumstances would also believe, that the assault is likely to inflict great bodily injury."
 
Oh man, you dropped the beer! :)

Good job.

mindset, skillset, toolset.
Good example for that recipe.
 
Wishin wrote
Good job. Sounds like you were on Ponce de leon avenue.

The scary thing is I can think of a lot of places around Atlanta where something like this might happen. Thanks to section 8 housing the hood is spread out everywhere now. As for Ponce I actually used to frequent some bars in that area about 20 years ago or a little longer. I was young, very drunk, and very stupid. You know what they say about fools rushing in where angels fear to tread. It was educational though.
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top