Lets bring this post back to what I intended it to be. It is not about 40 vs other calibers in terms of ballistics or stopping power. More or less it is about the of has anyone else had accuracy or function problems solely with the 40 S&W round.
Anyone else have problems with 40 S&W round?
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ljnowell
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Um, g21? Its been around a long time.
I wonder how many of the people here insisting the .40 is better than a .45 have a vested interest in the .40 round? Own multiple perhaps?
dwhite
Member
40 S&W accuracy
In my S&W Sigma with factory trigger if I do my part I can keep 10 shots in 2 inches at 15 yards off-hand consistently. I've only had 1 malfunction in about 2000 rounds of mostly my own reloads.This is comparable to what I can do with my Ruger Security-Six shooting off-hand.
All the Best,
D. White
In my S&W Sigma with factory trigger if I do my part I can keep 10 shots in 2 inches at 15 yards off-hand consistently. I've only had 1 malfunction in about 2000 rounds of mostly my own reloads.This is comparable to what I can do with my Ruger Security-Six shooting off-hand.
All the Best,
D. White
Buckhannon
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Smooth Squeeze
I have a Glock 22 RTF2 and a Glock 27 (mighty mimi) both 40 cal. These weapons are a pleasure to shoot and I seem to have a really good pattern @ 7,15 and 25 yards. I am sure that if you practice and breath out on your shots you will find an improvement in your groupings. Have a good 4th and God Bless America......
I have a Glock 22 RTF2 and a Glock 27 (mighty mimi) both 40 cal. These weapons are a pleasure to shoot and I seem to have a really good pattern @ 7,15 and 25 yards. I am sure that if you practice and breath out on your shots you will find an improvement in your groupings. Have a good 4th and God Bless America......
The accuracy problem isn't the cartridge, but the gun. Most 40's are made for combat/duty. Combat/duty guns usually have more generous tolerences, also some do not have full chamber support, like Glocks. I have a S&W performance center shorty forty that will drill ragged holes with most ammo at 25 yards for 5 or 10 shots. I also had a browning Hi-power 40 that was a tack driver. My S/A XDm 40 and P99 40 are also quite accurate. Functioning hasn't been a problem with any.
Most third Gen smith's I've owned were 3 1/2 inch grouping guns at 25 yards for 5 shots, as well as the Taurus, Glocks, Rugers i've owned in 40 cal. The 2 Sigs
( P229 P239) I have can do about 2 1/2 for 5 shots at 25 yards. Many 9mm guns I have owned do about 3 1/2 for 5 at 25 yards, my most accurate 9mm guns owned, 3 Hi-Powers, CZ PCR, CZ75, Sig P2022.
Most third Gen smith's I've owned were 3 1/2 inch grouping guns at 25 yards for 5 shots, as well as the Taurus, Glocks, Rugers i've owned in 40 cal. The 2 Sigs
( P229 P239) I have can do about 2 1/2 for 5 shots at 25 yards. Many 9mm guns I have owned do about 3 1/2 for 5 at 25 yards, my most accurate 9mm guns owned, 3 Hi-Powers, CZ PCR, CZ75, Sig P2022.
outerlimit
Member
On average a 230gr. .45acp +P is going to do more damage than a 165-180gr. .40S&W against an unarmored human target or most animals. The 230gr. .45acp has more momentum and more frontal area as well. It is simply more efficient and deadly. It's more likely to break a rib, breastplate or other bone than a lighter weight cartridge that is moving faster.
It's just plain going to do more damage than a .40S&W shot per shot, there's no way around it.
That said, I have no problem carrying 9x19mm. The .40S&W gained a bad reputation for accuracy early on when some guns were not made to proper specs. I see no reason why this cartridge would not be just as accurate as any other in modern guns.
It sounds like something is going on in regards to configuration. Perhaps the gun you're shooting does not like your particular load or bullet weight. Maybe it is user error. Hard to say without a lot of information.
It's just plain going to do more damage than a .40S&W shot per shot, there's no way around it.
That said, I have no problem carrying 9x19mm. The .40S&W gained a bad reputation for accuracy early on when some guns were not made to proper specs. I see no reason why this cartridge would not be just as accurate as any other in modern guns.
It sounds like something is going on in regards to configuration. Perhaps the gun you're shooting does not like your particular load or bullet weight. Maybe it is user error. Hard to say without a lot of information.
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headbangerJD
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My first ever gun was a Kahr P40, bought this year. At first, my aim was horrible due to my lack of experience and the snappiness of the 40s&w round. A few months have since passed, and I can now say that I am a pretty good shot w/ my compact 40. You just have to get used to the round I guess...
about 4 years ago
The Indiana state polcie bought 1200 glock 22 and had so many issues that glock finally stepped in and took um allback and reissued G17's which t hey carry and love to this day.
Not sure what thier 40 cal issues were but they were serious enough to loose faith in the G22's
The Indiana state polcie bought 1200 glock 22 and had so many issues that glock finally stepped in and took um allback and reissued G17's which t hey carry and love to this day.
Not sure what thier 40 cal issues were but they were serious enough to loose faith in the G22's
sohcgt2
Member
I shoot a variety of different pistols and revolvers and am most accurate with my little p22 shooting .22lr hollowpoints and least accurate with my S&W 460. My Glock 22 (40SW) is slightly less accurate in my hands than my Glock 21 (45ACP). I don't think the problem is the round as much as the recoil. I can shoot 200 rounds of 45 in a short period with no problem, but if I try that with 40SW my hands begin to shake and I have to take a break. If you like the ballistics of the 40SW why not try a steel frame platform to help harness the recoil and reduce the shooting fatigue.
Zerodefect
member
I agree with most of the above.
Each round deos have some differences that show up in certain lesser than normal circumstances.
Based on my extremely unscientific shoot things for fun:
.45 may outperform .40 when shooting a naked guy. But,
.40 catches up when you throw in a leather jacket (or three), or maybe your attacker is attacking you with a king size mattress or a couch.
.40 is small enough to fit in a 9mm sized gun and still have very good ammo capacity
nearly .45 performance plus the capacity of a 9mm, whats not to like? (Other than the recoil of both combined)
Since .40 is a hair slimmer, its easier to feed. The .45 is at the practical limit. Short and fat is not a recipe for an easy to feed round. (Unless you mean "round" as in Oprah.)
I have noticed some brands of .40 to be inaccurate. I don't know why, but every once in a while I get a box of target ammo thats all over the place.
In autos:
10mm>.40>.357>9mm
My point is .45acp/gap can fall behind .357 or ahead of .40 depending on what exactly your target is wearing. It seems to have an odd personality compared to the rest, which seem to fall predictably in line.
.40 deos seem to beat up a gun more than 9mm and .45, but a good gun shouldn't flinch with decent maintenance.
Each round deos have some differences that show up in certain lesser than normal circumstances.
Based on my extremely unscientific shoot things for fun:
.45 may outperform .40 when shooting a naked guy. But,
.40 catches up when you throw in a leather jacket (or three), or maybe your attacker is attacking you with a king size mattress or a couch.
.40 is small enough to fit in a 9mm sized gun and still have very good ammo capacity
nearly .45 performance plus the capacity of a 9mm, whats not to like? (Other than the recoil of both combined
)Since .40 is a hair slimmer, its easier to feed. The .45 is at the practical limit. Short and fat is not a recipe for an easy to feed round. (Unless you mean "round" as in Oprah.)
I have noticed some brands of .40 to be inaccurate. I don't know why, but every once in a while I get a box of target ammo thats all over the place.
In autos:
10mm>.40>.357>9mm
My point is .45acp/gap can fall behind .357 or ahead of .40 depending on what exactly your target is wearing. It seems to have an odd personality compared to the rest, which seem to fall predictably in line.
.40 deos seem to beat up a gun more than 9mm and .45, but a good gun shouldn't flinch with decent maintenance.
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outerlimit
Member
There seems to be some myth that .45acp doesn't penetrate as evidenced by the post above. This simply isn't true.
bestseller92
Member
I love the .40. The 155 grain Winchester Ranger JHP at 1220 fps out of my Glock 22 is serious stuff, and totally reliable.
CountGlockula
Member
I own only Glocks in .40S&W and no problems.
Last Friday I was hitting steel plates at 100 yards with my Glock model 35.
Last Friday I was hitting steel plates at 100 yards with my Glock model 35.
easyg
Member
You're just psyching yourself out.
The problem is purely in your head.
There's just not that much difference in the recoil.
Totally unproven and technically wrong anyway.....people always forget SD when express their momentum pet theories....and more frontal area means more drag which equal less penetration...
There is no "nearly 45 performance"....the 2 rounds are basically identical when it comes to power and effectiveness....so it's better to say "45 level performance in almost a 9 mm package"
As JonB said, if I really want more serius "thump" than a .40 in an autoloader I'll get a 10 mm!!!
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ljnowell wrote:
Actually, I think it is the other way around. The .45 has a longer history and many more units sold than the .40. The .40 is often shunned by .45 owners with little logical reasoning. One could contend that they feel threatened by a new round that brings .45 power in a small readily concealable package with increased capacity.
I have shot all of them (except the 10mm), and I appreciate the .40 the most of all the semi-auto rounds. Honestly, I think the .40 really divides the handgun market into old timers and young guns. Old timers are already heavily invested in 9mm and .45, whereas newcomers to the handgun market seem more inclined to pick up the .40. Pretty telling that when those who come into the market without the bias of the last 100 years of cartridge loyalty seem to make the .40 a top selection. The benefits of the .40 just can't be overlooked when you are objective.
Actually, I think it is the other way around. The .45 has a longer history and many more units sold than the .40. The .40 is often shunned by .45 owners with little logical reasoning. One could contend that they feel threatened by a new round that brings .45 power in a small readily concealable package with increased capacity.
I have shot all of them (except the 10mm), and I appreciate the .40 the most of all the semi-auto rounds. Honestly, I think the .40 really divides the handgun market into old timers and young guns. Old timers are already heavily invested in 9mm and .45, whereas newcomers to the handgun market seem more inclined to pick up the .40. Pretty telling that when those who come into the market without the bias of the last 100 years of cartridge loyalty seem to make the .40 a top selection. The benefits of the .40 just can't be overlooked when you are objective.
Hard to argue with that reasoning. I tend to agree. When looking at SD rounds, I rank them as follows, from least effective to most effective. Bear in mind that I don't just consider the round, but also the package from which it is fired:
.380, .38+p, 9mm+p, .45, .40, .357sig, .357 mag, 10mm, .44 mag
One could swap my .40 and .45 ranking, but the differences are so negligible, that I give the edge to the .40 if for no other reason than the form factor. That will also be up for debate for 1911 fans, but you can get 1911 slimness in a bulletproof design with higher round counts using the .40 platform.
Makotoseven
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if you want to shoot .40 ammo get a px4 beretta. i love mine to death. it'll pump all 14+1 rounds exactly where you want em (if you can shoot straight) and the rotating barrel means the recoil is practically nothing.
plus its plastic framed with a metal slide so you can still beat the badguy to death with if if you need
plus its plastic framed with a metal slide so you can still beat the badguy to death with if if you need
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