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Armed neighbors erroneously detain would-be suspects

Discussion in 'Strategies, Tactics and Training' started by k-frame, Apr 23, 2012.

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  1. X-Rap

    X-Rap Member

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    Good job on the media getting the racial side thrown in there too.
    Those two bumpkins have no idea what is about to happen to them for their poor judgement, not to mention the deputy that put the cuffs on the oldsters.
    I can imagine walking over to a neighbors house armed discreetly but upon finding an older couple with a plausible reason why not introduce yourself and bid them well and move on? Much more to this story to come IMO.
     
  2. Cosmoline

    Cosmoline Member

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    Even if they went in expecting gang bangers (which itself is incredibly stupid), they found a little old couple who look about as dangerous as doormice. But nevertheless felt the need to hold them at gunpoint in their own home.

    The fools could be looking at very serious felony home invasion charges.
     
  3. IdahoSkies

    IdahoSkies Member

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    I for see very few neighborhood BBQs on this street.
     
  4. Kleanbore

    Kleanbore Moderator Staff Member

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    I do not think that Canoles and son will be anyone's "neighbors" for quite a while.

    They were lucky, though, in the sense that they were not shot in justified self defense by their victims, or shot by an armed citizen...

    in addition, of course, to being lucky in being charged only with aggravated assault, false imprisonment and criminal trespass; had things turned out a little differently, they could have been charged with murder or attempted murder.
     
    Last edited: Apr 24, 2012
  5. R.W.Dale

    R.W.Dale Member

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    Yeah till you're the one staring down the barrel of a semiautomatic rifle held by a trigger happy 20 something Zimmerman who'd just got done playing modern warfare.
     
  6. k-frame

    k-frame Member

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    Where??? I've read the stories on this situation and as far as I can see race isn't mentioned.
     
  7. X-Rap

    X-Rap Member

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    I am not even saying there may not indeed be some racial component with the Canoles but at this point in the story the reporter is clearly attempting to fan some racial flames since the quotes from the story have exactly 0 to do with the crime.
     
  8. k-frame

    k-frame Member

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    State-sponsored terrorism in Zaire is the fellow's context; so when armed neighbors accost him and his wife it seems reasonable that he would flash back to those experiences. So that context is VERY relevant as story background, just as if the Kalonji's were white and had been mugged or attacked earlier in their lives.
     
  9. saltydog452

    saltydog452 Member

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    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 24, 2012
  10. Sam1911

    Sam1911 Moderator Emeritus

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    I can't see anything inappropriate or over-stated about explaining their backgrounds. Reporters want to give some context to the situation -- mention something about the people involved. They always do that, even if it's merely, "Mrs. Soandso, mother of two..."

    In this case these people have a very interesting and unique background. If you were to know ONE major thing about them, that would probably be it. Seems reasonable for the reporter to mention it.
     
  11. JRH6856

    JRH6856 Member

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    And the context for the Canoles' would be what? "They were armed with AR 15s and exercising their 2nd amendment rights"?
     
  12. Sam1911

    Sam1911 Moderator Emeritus

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    Naaw, I think the statements they gave provide all the context. For better or worse, when you say certain things to the press, the reporter may decide s/he really can't expand on the image you painted of yourself.
     
  13. dev_null

    dev_null Member

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    Whether or not their hearts were in the right place in wanting to look out for others, it's obvious their heads weren't.
     
  14. saltydog452

    saltydog452 Member

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    I guess I noticed the 'staring down the barrel' and 'semi-automatic rifle' and thee implication that the responding neighbors were playing 'modern warfare' roles.

    Those words seem likely to come from Katie Curic and newsprint from the 'Post'. Not exactly un-biased reporting of the situtation don'tcha think?

    salty
     
  15. JustinJ

    JustinJ Member

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    That's like using a case in which a person with a CC permit shoots without sufficient cause to argue against CC permits all together. The fact that this yahoo father detained people illegaly doesnt mean all citizens arrests are illegal. Detaining a criminal who is obviously commiting a felony is nothing like this scenario. I'm not arguing wether or not it's wise to ever perform a citizens arrest but this case does not prove that it isn't.
     
  16. Kleanbore

    Kleanbore Moderator Staff Member

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    However, it does prove very conclusively indeed that attempting to effect a citizen's arrest when one does not know both all of the facts and the law in the jurisdiction is not wise.

    Several of the risks we always talk about when we discuss the subject materialized here.

    Some did not; the Canoles were not shot in self defense by their victims, or by an armed citizen or arriving first responders; nor did they end up shooting anyone.

    And some have not yet materialized; I'm not sure whether a civil suit would likely net the victims very much, but I imagine that one will be pursued.

    Citizens' arrests have very little upside and considerable--almost unlimited--downside. I cannot imagine trying one myself.
     
  17. stumpers

    stumpers Member

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    aggravated assault, false imprisonment and criminal trespass

    This article has a paragraph on the charges against the Canoleses

    http://content.usatoday.com/communi...-new-homeowners-changing-locks/1#.T5cbgO0s3ww

    From the USA Today article:

    Robert Canoles, 45, and his 18-year-old son Branden have been charged in Newton County with aggravated assault, false imprisonment and criminal trespass, the newspaper says.
     
  18. Matthew Courtney

    Matthew Courtney Member

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    Anyone know what time of day the original confrontation occurred? What contitutes reasonable at 3 AM may not at 3 PM. This goes more toward the responding deputies' actions than the neighbors'.
     
  19. mgkdrgn

    mgkdrgn Member

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    Lets see ... just how many AARP husband/wife home robbing teams are there ... and how many of them are robbing =emtpy= houses?

    Morons ... they deserve what ever they get slapped with.
     
  20. mgkdrgn

    mgkdrgn Member

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  21. k-frame

    k-frame Member

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    Apparently the sheriff's office was called around 9:15 pm. (The sun was fully down by 9 pm.) This all took place on Thursday, April 26.

    http://newsfeedresearcher.com/data/articles_n17/kalonjis-newton-county.html

     
  22. saltydog452

    saltydog452 Member

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    drgn,

    Your Police Dept may be well staffed and respond immedialely to 'phone calls of suspicious activity.

    Here, if there isn't blood on the ground, response time could be measured by a very slow clock.

    Not the fault of the PD. Just there isn't funding to respond . Given that notion, people need to get involved in their neighborhood.

    Sometimes the pendulum can, and does, swing too far. In both directions.

    salty
     
  23. Matthew Courtney

    Matthew Courtney Member

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  24. JRH6856

    JRH6856 Member

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    It can be real hard to make a CA stick when the subject doesn't want to cooperate. What happens when you say, "You stay right there, the police are on the way." and he says, "I'm unarmed, I'm leaving, and you'll have to shoot me in the back to stop me. Explain it to the cops when they get here."?
     
  25. billdeserthills

    billdeserthills Member

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    Good Post,
    I'll hafta remember that one for later
     
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