Best caliber for cats?

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What an ass hat that dude is. I don't have a problem with protection of bird species within reasonable limits, but the d***head was not legally empowered to do what he did - whether or not the cat was legally considered feral. Nowhere on my Texas hunting license does it say anything about how many cats I can bag this season.

It doesn't mention bobcats, foxes, or coyotes, but I hunt those. You might take a look at the resident trapper's license in addition to the hunting license so that you can get a more accurate picture of what can be hunted in Texas.

A feral cat is sorta like a cheap bobcat. At least with the bobcat, I can get some $ for the pelt. A stray cat that walks on my truck, pisses on lawn furniture, aggravates my dogs, and could decide to take a nap in the engine compartment of one of my vehicles (imagine the damage if you start it up while Sylvester is snoozing) won't be doing it for long. Since it is illegal to discharge firearms in city limits except for self defense, other methods will be used to,*relocate* the kitty.

I tried trapping one. Took it 40 miles from my house and let it go. A week later the little fuzzball was back.

At work, we had 2 kittens get into one of our big 6 million BTU ovens. One actually survived a 15 minute, 600 degree cook cycle. For a minute. Until one of my employees saw it smoking, felt bad, and sprayed it with cool water. I suspect the shock killed the little bugger instantly.

The guy in the story was a moron because he didn't remain covert.
 
"At work, we had 2 kittens get into one of our big 6 million BTU ovens. One actually survived a 15 minute, 600 degree cook cycle. For a minute. Until one of my employees saw it smoking, felt bad, and sprayed it with cool water. I suspect the shock killed the little bugger instantly."

Well that is just terrible. It obviously wasn't intentional but what a way to go.
 
Extinction?

But for some humans, defense of an endangered species is also natural.
Sorry, what?

Natural?

I think we have drifted a long way in our definition of "natural."

Defense of endangered species is quite contrived, and very much an exercise of intellect.

Now, if I'm a governing body, and I've declared something "protected" or "endangered" and I might also consider just what measures are appropriate to the protection of such a species.

I might prohibit people from doing them harm, but would I then also encourage direct action against their natural predators?

I like cats. We have three. The darned things bring birds they've caught into our house every few weeks. Feathers everywhere.

It's not likely that I would contemplate shooting a cat engaged in the very natural activity of hunting birds. But then, I have no stake in the continued survival of said birds. I'm not raising them to sell for food or pets. The birds are wild (natural, if you prefer) and, even if they're endangered, I'm not doing the species any favors by eliminating its natural predators.

Now, if I were entrusted with actively protecting the birds, as pets, "livestock," a cultural icon, or whatever, then I would treat cats as I would treat coyotes preying on my sheep.

Our hero, in this instance, was not (if I understand it correctly) entrusted with the protection of these birds. He may have felt he was acting in the spirit of a declaration protecting them but, without specific license or assignment, it's not actually his job.

I guess the question will come down to whether the cat was owned or could be classified as a pest.

If I had a pet dog that was eating the chickens, I'd put it down. If I had a cat that was doing the same, I'd do the same. Neither of them is feral, but eliminating the chicken killer is still necessary if I want to raise chickens.

And, incidentally, I've been through this as a kid, where we had to halt a pet's predation of the chickens. That's not fun, but certainly an educational part of growing up.

All things considered, I think the shooter goofed.

I'm not mourning the puddy tat, and I'm not fanatical about birds.

I think, if he wanted it to be his job to protect a protected species, he needed to cover himself with a legal dispensation of some kind. An open letter from the sheriff saying, "yes, shoot any cats or other predators that threaten these birds." Maybe a statement from Fish & Game, stating that he had their proxy to do the deed.

Failure to do that and yet engaging in "enforcement" of rules not his to enforce may land him in jail.

Which really is too bad, as I don't think anything beyond a fine is warranted.

But I'm not in charge there.

All I have is an opinion.
 
Feral cats, dogs, whatever are fair game, no closed season, no bag or possession limits. They are considered vermin, just like rats and digger squirrels or prairie dogs. If your pampered pet goes out at night and doesn't come back until after dawn you might want to be a bit more careful about letting it out. We have livestock around here and that livestock is the difference of paying the mortgage or not, eating regularly or not, sending the kids to college or not, get the picture?:banghead:
 
Had a neighbor once who's dog would come over and kill my cats. She said since my cats were seen stalking wild birds she fed they were fair game for her dog. He actually would chase them right in to the back porch that was left open for their use. I chased him off the porch with a Ka-Bar once...which the neighbor witnessed. Funny how that dog didn't come over anymore after that. :rolleyes:
 
Arfin,

I think you missed something in the article, which is why I support his elimination of the animal. Aside form that, your logic is impeccable.

It said he runs a bed and breakfast which caters to a large number of "birders" every year. This animal was endangering his livelihood. Though he may be framing it as "protecting an endangered species," he was protecting his business. I think he made that claim because it would sit better in the media, but I find his actions more than justifiable to the end of protecting his business.

Now, I am a dog person but had it been a dog in a similar situation, I would mourn the fact that the poor dog was not adopted and taken somewhere (ok, so I'm not mourning the cat) BUT I WOULD STILL SUPPORT HIS ACTION.

It's not this guy's responsibility to make sure every pest is given a good home- Would you like to adopt this raccoon that's been attacking my trash?

DISCLAIMER: I do not have a raccoon attacking my trash, nor will I be killing any pest animals anytime soon. Do not interpret my rhetorical comment as a true offer. Any requests for raccoon delivery will be met with ridicule and scorn. Not valid in NH, UT or CA.
 
Here's the list of animals that can be hunted in Texas. Cats aren't on it.
That's the list of game animals that can be hunted in Texas. There's a completely different category for non game animals that includes vermin and feral animals.

I'm wondering why this guy didn't also get rung up for discharging a firearm in a public location not specifically desginated for that purpose.
 
He took the law into his own hands and I'm sure he'll pay the price.

He killed a cat. That's not quite the same thing as going vigilante.

According to PA game law, it's perfectly legal to shoot a dog that is endangering a big game animal:
Sec. 2384. Declaring dogs public nuisances.

Any dog pursuing or following upon the track of any big game animal in such close pursuit as to endanger the big game animal or to be in the act of attacking the big game animal at any time is hereby declared to be a public nuisance and may be destroyed as provided in this title.

Cross References. Section 2384 is referred to in section 2385 of this title; section 5511 of Title 18 (Crimes and Offenses).

Sec. 2385. Destruction of dogs declared public nuisances.

(a) General rule. - A dog declared a public nuisance pursuant to section 2384 (relating to declaring dogs public nuisances) may be killed by any commission officer at any time or by any person when the dog is found to be in the act of attacking a big game animal.

(b) Reports after killing dog. - Any person who kills a licensed dog pursuant to subsection (a) and section 2384 shall notify the owner or a commission officer within 48 hours after the dog was killed. The person who killed the dog or the commission officer who receives the report shall disclose to the owner of the dog the time, place, circumstances relating to the death of the dog and the location of the dog's remains. All equipment found on the dog, including collar, name tag, license tag or any other personal property, shall be returned to the owner of the dog within ten days after conclusion of any prosecution or immediately if no prosecution is contemplated.

(c) Inapplicability of certain laws. -

(1) The provisions of 18 Pa.C.S.(tab)5511 (relating to cruelty to animals) shall not apply to any person killing any dog pursuant to subsection (a).

(2) The provisions of 42 Pa.C.S. Ch. 85 (relating to matters affecting government units) shall not apply to any agency, commission or department or any officers charged by law with enforcing the provisions of this title.

Cross References. Section 2385 is referred to in section 5511 of Title 18 (Crimes and Offenses).


Pennsylvania law doesn't even mention cats. Shooting a feral cat is only against the law here if you are in violation of some ordinance against discharge of a firearm in that area.
 
Protecting His Livelihood

I think you're right here.

His strategy may prove his undoing.

Still, considering that his business actually encourages preservation of said endangered species (heck, especially if he contributes cash to same) his position would be considerably improved by having some sort of formal proxy.

I guess we'll see.
 
Nice Use of Court Time....

I'll leave it to the rest of you to debate whether it was OK to kill a cat that was living somewhere other than in a home, and did not seem to have a REAL owner.

But, it's sure nice to see that this is what takes up our court dockets, when we have so many issues with illegal immigrants, gang bangers, and other criminals...

Michael
 
As far as I'm concerned any non-native animal, running around without a collar or leash, outside of it's own yard, is fair game. People who object to them getting shot (whether they actually own them or not) are free to keep them safely inside/fenced/penned/corralled.
 
I hope they put that idiot in jail. Not to mention he killed an animal following it's natural instincts but think about what could of happened if he missed and had hit a human.
I have a few cats so I am a little passionate about this. If someone came shooting at my animals there would be return fire.
 
MDHunter

That seems a false bit of logic there. One can't ignore "little" laws broken (Assuming there was one) just because "bigger" laws are being broken. Who should arbitrate if a law is important enough to warrant court time?
 
To Clarify...

That seems a false bit of logic there. One can't ignore "little" laws broken (Assuming there was one) just because "bigger" laws are being broken. Who should arbitrate if a law is important enough to warrant court time?

Phoglund, good point. I should have been clearer and said that I wish that offenses like this could be handled in a speedy process that didn't involve docket time, but that may be unrealistic. Maybe a fine or something like that.

Michael
 
Well, clearly .22LR is insufficient to ensure a clean, humane kill. .22 Magnum, perhaps? Possibly even .223, with a specialized varmint hunting bullet?

Good Lord Almighty, people get so worked up about certain "fuzzy" animals. People who eat cows will freak out over the idea of eating a horse, and people who would shoot a deer or a groundhog as a pest will have a cow (ha!) over shooting a cat.
 
Jail?

I hope they put that idiot in jail. Not to mention he killed an animal following it's natural instincts but think about what could of happened if he missed and had hit a human. I have a few cats so I am a little passionate about this. If someone came shooting at my animals there would be return fire.

From the article it sounds like he didn't come shooting at anyone's animals, it was under a bridge. Jail? So we can pay taxes to keep this guy in prison, for shooting a stray or feral cat? Come on.
 
Here's the list of animals that can be hunted in Texas. Cats aren't on it.

Feral Cats are considered VARMITS and there is no closed season on VARMITS.

Personally I would use my 30 Caliber M-1. Or I would borrow my friends AR-50
 
Oh..and in the photo of a cat that accompanies the article, am I the only one that saw the picture of the little kitty peeking up over the edge of the cement and immediately thought of the scene from about a jillion war movies where somebody decides to poke his head up and take a look around?
 
I hope they put that idiot in jail. Not to mention he killed an animal following it's natural instincts but think about what could of happened if he missed and had hit a human.

Yeah, hypothetical arguments are fun. What if he was driving his car, missed his turn and ran over a bunch of orphan toddlers. Oh wait, that had nothing to do with the original post either.

I have a few cats so I am a little passionate about this. If someone came shooting at my animals there would be return fire.

Passionate to the point of lunacy. You'd be tried and probably convicted of attempted murder. In jail you'd likely face possibility of anal rape from a big guy named Tyrone and some of his close associates. All over a dead cat. I urge you engage your frontal lobe next time and to think your position through to its natural end game and then determine if the risk/reward ratio is worth it.

-T
 
Feral cats can carry diseases that can be hazardous to humans. Around here I have neighbors that don't have their cats (or dogs either for that matter) fixed and let them run and breed indiscriminately. If I find them on my property I will shoot them with whatever I have at hand! I don't necessarily hate cats and I love dogs. But thats the only way they can be controlled.
 
For some reason I am picturing the whole cat killing episode as being remarkably similar to last fifteen minutes of Apocalypse Now.
 
Feral cats are a major threat to endangered species. Far as I'm concerned, they should be treated just as any other invasive pest.

If you don't want your cat shot, don't let it out to run wild and keep a collar on it. Its called being a responsible pet owner. Try it sometime.
 
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