Can you help me plead my case?

[19-3Ben]

Hey guys. I really really REALLY want to get into reloading. The wife and I are in a disagreement over it. While neither of us have the power to "forbid" the other from doing anything, I would rather convince her to approve of it, than simply say "well screw it, I'm doing it with or without you." You know, "Happy wife, happy life," and all that stuff.

Her main arguments against it are "I don't want you to blow your fingers off", and the cost of the equipment necessary.

I know the safety concern is kind of irrational, but hey, I didn't marry her so that I could keep everything in my life perfectly rational.

The cost issue is where I could really use the help. I know it saves money in the long run because of the dramatically reduced cost of loading your own vs. factory fresh prices. The question is, how much money is saved?

So to load FMJ or copper washed .38 and .357mag, what is it running you guys these days per load.

I also would be loading for .380 ACP and .45ACP, so I'd appreciate the same info for those.

Once you factor in cost of bullets, powder, and primers how much is it really costing? I already have a decent amount of brass saved up for all these loads. I'd love to be able to give her good "metrics" to demonstrate just how many rounds I'd need to shoot before breaking even, and just how much I'll be saving per 50rnd box that I'd shoot.

Thanks so much in advance.

 

[SuedePflow]

Here's my example from the last time I did a load of 1000 rounds of .38 special.

Costs per round:

primer: $ .03
powder: $ .012
bullet: $ .088

So exactly thirteen cents per round. This is using CCI500 primers, Unique powder, and Xtreme's RNFP 158gr. plated bullet.

Prior to handloading, I was paying on average of $.40/rd for .38 special, so the savings from my first batch of 1000 rounds paid for half of my equipment.

 

[mljdeckard]

You don't spend less. You shoot more.

I would suggest getting her into a reloading class with you to let her see how it works.

 

[Reefinmike]

yup, she is crazy . My go-to cheap 357 round is a 125gr plated xtreme bullet(~.08ea after 10%off), tula SRP(.028ea after ship+hazmat) and 7.5gr HP-38(.019/charge). This comes out to 12.7 cents a round,$6.36 a box. Last time I checked, they are asking $25/box for remington or winchester 357 ammo. As you see your real cost is in the bullet. I wasnt reloading for 6 months before I dove into casting. all it cost me was $20 for a propane burner(to clean up lead), $50 for a lead pot and $20 for a mold. I save up any scrap brass, copper and copper bullet jackets to bring in to the scrap yard to trade for any hard lead they have. the rest of the lead I just take a scoop of range berm ore and melt it down.

Using lead cast, I have my 380, 38 and 45 loads down to $2 a box or under... and this is using components bought within the last year. Now I can shoot literally ten times as much for the same price of factory ammo.

 

[Schwing]

I recently did a cost workup on my reloads. I use lead bullets.

9MM $14 per 100
.38 $18 per 100
.357 $20 per 100
.44 $21 per 100

I base this on only reusing brass 4 times (you should get much more than that) and round all components up to the nearest .01. Your numbers are going to vary some depending on powder/primer/bullet brands etc.

To me, it is not a hard sell. Even buying a relatively expensive press, you are going to break even in the first few thousand rounds. I bought a lee press and, reloading .357 and .44, I broke even much sooner.

Having said that, I can almost guarantee you that you won't save any money. You will just shoot more.

 

[trixter]

I load my 45's for $04.2 per round, but I cast my own boolits, and the lead doesn't cost me anything.

 

[wlkjr]

I figure the break even point is about 10,000 rounds for 9mm but I also reload 10mm so that makes it much less. Sounds like a lot but my wife has started shooting also and we practice a lot and also shoot GSSF. I think less than a year since we started reloading will pay for the whole setup which is a nice Dillon XL650 with all the goodies.

 

[LiveLife]

"Happy wife, happy life"

Didn't you know? The 11th commandment is "Thou shall make your wife happy"

Her main arguments against it are "I don't want you to blow your fingers off"

She is just concerned about you (and you are lucky to have a wife like her). Have your wife read some of the "How do I get started with reloading" threads and other "new to reloading" threads and she'll probably be more inclined to let you reload. Tell her or type out an agreement that states you'll follow safe reloading practices as outlined in, say Lyman #49 reloading handbook/other reference books and will have all the reloading steps verified by THR forum for safety.

Heck, have her read this thread and PM me her concerns and I will let my wife answer her questions about whether reloading can be approached safely by someone who never reloaded before.

So to load FMJ or copper washed .38/.357, .380ACP and .45ACP, what is it running you guys these days per load.

I use this reloading calculator to calculate reloading cost and buying components in bulk/using jacketed/plated bullets, I can usually reload 9mm for under $7/50 and 45ACP for under $9/50 provided I already have brass (PM me and I could help you out with 380/38Spl/45ACP brass). I used the following cost of components:

Powder - $160 / 8 lbs (example powder charge 4.5 - 5.0 range of W231/HP-38)
Primer - $30 / 1000
Bullets - $80 - $130 / 1000 (plated cost slightly more for jacketed - RMR reloading plated bullet prices used)

Press kit like the Lee Classic Turret kit can be purchased for around $200 and you could be reloading with about $500-$600 initial budget to include components. The initial cost of reloading equipment/components can be recaptured with the first 1000-1500 rounds compared to shooting factory ammunition depending on the caliber.

Here's cost break down for LCT kit set up from Graf & Sons which has free shipping and $7.95 processing fee per order:

$200 - Lee Classic Turret kit - http://www.grafs.com/retail/catalog/product/productId/23840
$65 - Berry's tumbler kit with media and media separator ($85 for kit with better media separator which I recommend)
$24 - Calipers - http://www.grafs.com/retail/catalog/product/productId/5376
$23 - Bullet puller - http://www.grafs.com/retail/catalog/product/productId/20528

 

[RmB]

As at least one other said, you don't save money. You shoot more. Because you will say (example) "Oh I'm spending half as much to shoot the same as I used to. Guess I should shoot twice as much and I'll be spending the same as normal."

 

[rockhopper46038]

First, it won't save you any money. You'll just get to shoot a heckuva lot more for the same cost.

But...

You can get a full reloading kit from Lee that would be perfectly acceptable to start loading on, and that will include everything you need except components for less than $150. You can actually do it for cheaper, but the Lee Classic Turret kit is a good deal, as is.

SuedePflow's numbers are pretty close to mine. Figure a little bit more for .45ACP, but if you are using salvaged brass and lead cast bullets, the difference is pretty negligible.

My last run, using salvaged brass, would have been:

9mm
Brass free
Primer .028
124gr lead cast bullet .032
Powder (Clays) .009
So $3.50/box
Expect to pay $40/1000 for 9mm brass

.45ACP
Brass free
Primer .028
200gr LCSW. .039
Powder (Clays) .011
So $4.00/50
Expect $50/1000 if you need to buy the brass

Hope that helps...

ETA: Ugh. I type slow on my phone.

 

[cowtownup]

Don't count on saving one single dime by reloading.. Its an addiction just like crack cocaine... You will reload about 50 rounds of 9mm and you will want to reload more. Before you know it, you are sitting on 5000 rounds of 9mm. You will have multiple pounds of powder on hand and thousands of primers waiting to be used. You will have multiple coffee cans marked with different calibers and full of brass.. You could very well end up wanting to reload more than you want to shoot... Trust me, it can happen..

However, it is very rewarding journey and well worth it IMO. I find the repetitive motion of the press very relaxing. I hope you and your wife can come to some type of agreement.

Supplies are very hard to get at this time so you may want to secure some powder and primers prior to getting the equipment. When starting a new caliber you always have to figure in the cost of getting your brass supply built up. After that you will really see the savings and you won't think twice about sending 300-400 rounds downrange. You will find yourself chasing down every piece of brass that flies out of your gun on your hands and knees.. LOL..

 

[Comrade Mike]

Surprisingly enough my girlfriend watched me reload for about half an hour and then wanted to learn how to do it! She helps me clean primer pockets and resize all the .38 she shoots out of my (feels like her's now) model 10.

 

[Rule3]

Yes, you can save money if you limit your shooting to what you currently shoot now.

The big question is how much ammo do you shoot? Also does your Wife like to shoot (that will make a big difference!)

My Wife does not but she has her hobbies. Been married a long time.

Better to seek forgiveness than ask for permission!

Impossible to say what it costs per round as you need to amortize your initial cost of equipment which can vary a lot. So it depends on your budget. You have $1000 to spend on a press or $300?? You need 100 rounds a week or 1000?

Components cost more now than those who stockpiled a year ago.

 

[nix4me]

I'm in the 12-step reloading addiction program. I'm on step 1 again. Can't seem to admit there is a problem. Good thing is, my wife think's it is interesting and is always asking me questions. My daughter thinks it's cool and she helps me.

I agree on the coffee can and cardboard boxes full of bullets and brass. I have them everywhere.

I recommend you start with a simple single stage press kit so the initial outlay is small. Then load a few and build trust as you go. Take one of those coffee cans and shove $1's an $5's in it for a few years. Then one day you will have enough to go all in on a progressive press and really have some fun!

 

[lightman]

Most of the cost calculations above cover handgun ammo. The payback may be quicker if you load any obsolete calibers, Match ammo or any belted magnums. Weatherby ammo costs $60-80 a box, and 7mm STW cost as much or more. Black Hills Match or Federal Gold Medal Match is expensive, too!

For about $100-110 you can buy a 308 die set and enough components to load 100 308 match loads. Probably about the same to load 100 rounds of 300WM. This is if you have the once fired brass.

As far as safety goes, I don't know of anyone personally that has been injured in a handloading accident. This covers my loading career that started in the late 60's and about a dozen friends that reload, some for longer than I have.

I agree that very few people who reload save money, they just get to shoot more for their dollar, possibly have better ammo, and usually don't see the shortages on ammo that we have been seeing. There have been shortages on components, but most of us keep a decent stock to work with.

Good Luck in getting your wife on board with this. Maybe our comments have helped, and maybe you can find some other threads that she can read. Most of us would welcome a PM from her, asking about our hobby, or asking our Wives opinions. Lightman

 

[cfullgraf]

The cost per reloaded round of ammunition will always be less than factory. What you do with the savings is up to you.

Some folks shoot up the savings, others spend it on bobbles for the significant other.

I enjoy reloading and have to temper my enthusiasm so that the basement is not filled with loaded rounds. On the other hand, I do shoot as much as I like but I do not just blow rounds down range just because I have them loaded up.

Powders are propellants not explosives. Primers are very safe if kept in their original packaging and by following safe handling practices when priming cases.

Buy or borrow from the library either "ABCs or Reloading" and/or Lyman's Reloading Manual #49. Both have excellent sections on how to reload and safety practices.

The Lyman manual also has reloading data which will be useful to have when you start reloading.

 

[gahunter12]

I load .38spl, .40s&w, .45acp, .223, 300wm, 7mm RM.

38spl
CCI SP Primers= $25.00/1k ($35 av now) I'm still loading on the 60k from 2012 @ $119/5k
W231 powder = $9.25/1k ($136/ 8lb 2012)
Extreme 158 SWC= $75/k ( I place bulk orders of 25k for the dist discount)
Total= $10.92/100 rounds

45acp
CCI LPP=$28/1k ( from 2012 stock)
WST= 10.92/1k (I use more WST than anything. I have 24lb left from 2012)
XTreme 230gr RN= $98/1k (again I buy 25k at a time with another reloader)
Total= 13.69/100

These prices are low now days since primers are up, and powder is up in some areas. I went through the shortage in 2008, and promised to not let it happen again. Last year I only purchased 8k primers, and 8lb of H4831 for my hunting rounds all year. I stopped in a LGS Saturday, and they had Titegroup for $18.99, HP38 for $20.99, and H335 for $20.99 per lb. that's the best price I have seen since Dec 2012. I think things are coming down a little. We buy our bullets at a huge discount since we buy 25k+. They usually ship via freight line, and drop it in my garage. You will save money per round, but will spend the same, and be able to shoot more.

 

[jmorris]

Tell her since you don't have anything to do at the house you are going to hang out with the guys at the bar....

Ok, don't do that. Start by getting some books, to show that you are studying the subject, the Internet doesn't count because you can't leave it on the table to show her that you are not just "jumping in". You may have to listen to some conversations about getting nails done, new purses and shoes, while you sneek in information that you have learned.

Be rational and don't go into anything that concerns "feelings", stick with facts.

As others noted, rarely do people save enough money to buy a cup of coffee but they do shoot more than they would otherwise.

If she ever asks what you may want as a gift for Christmas, birthday, fathers day, have some reloading gear in mind, after all that is when she is looking to make you happy.

Good luck.

 

[HexHead]

My wife was absolutely against my reloading inside our home in my office. She was mostly worried about "lead dust" or powder in the air and being breathed in. I started reloading at my friend's reloading shop, and had her come down once with me, to sit with me and watch me load 100 rounds. Once she saw the realities as opposed to her imagination, it overcame her objections. She even helped me assemble my bench, writing "I love you" under the top before we screwed it down.

 

[gahunter12]

Oh yea get her in to shooting with you. My wife knows the money I spend up front saves over the long run, and she always has ammo on the shelf! Her only complaint is the time I spend in my shop reloading sometimes. I have learned to help the kids knock out home work, and spend about 2 hours in the shop after they go to bed.

 

[4895]

I would speculate you will spend about $700 to start reloading.

While that sounds like a lot of money, and it is, it is probably less than what 500 rounds of each caliber you mention costs from the factory.

That's 2000 rounds of ammunition at .35 cents each...average price. It is hard to buy factory ammo that cheap these days.

Oh...and by the way, you now own the equipment to load more for as little as .15 cents each.

If you shoot more than 500 rounds a year, it isn't a bad investment. If you don't shoot that much, it is going to be an expensive, yet rewarding hobby.

 

[splattergun]

Ask her when the last time she saw any news report of someone blowing their fingers off while reloading. nuff said. It can happen, but if you're careful and smart (and your OP indicates you are, because you know better than to tick off SWMBO) you will avoid such unpleasantness as fragged fingers.

Initial capital outlay can be rather steep, but there are certainly economical choices as well. Strongly suggest you read the stickies for new reloaders at the top of this reloading forum and arm yourself with knowledge before reengaging this battle.

My GF helps me reload her .38, 12 ga, 6.5x55, and .38 SW, And I help her shoot 'em.

Good luck, friend!

 

[Bearhands]

Show her this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nwr0FyJOk-4 (no fingers lost)

and show her how you can do the same safely... Start with the Lee Classic Loader for about 30 bucks for the equipment...plus the supplies.... she might just change her tune when she sees the procedure and savings?

 

[Queen_of_Thunder]

People get upset when I point out that they need to account for their time in calculating the cost of reloading along with all of the equipment, space and utilities. But I've put pen to paper to figure out some basic costs. Since you are new you are using todays prices.

For shipping costs I used zip code 06001

I've chosen W231 for the powder. $177.50 which includes hazmat and shipping charges

13,000 CCI small pistol primers @$579.69 which includes hazmat and shipping charges

Montana Gold 9mm 115gr FMJ by the case of 4,000.

I picked Montana Gold because they have free shipping at the moment so we can save a nice chunk of change on shipping.

The number of rounds you will reload will be 13,000. Why 13,000 because a 8lb jug can load 13,023 rounds at 4.3 grains per case if there is 100 percent usage of the powder.


So at this point the cost of bullets,powder and primers is 15 cents per round.

Now to the cases. For 13,000 rounds of ammo and using each case 5 times you will need 2600 cases. AT $167.99 per 1,000 plus shipping the cost of 2600 rounds of new brass will be $471.95 which gives an average cost per case of 3.563 cents.


So we have 15 cents for bullets,primer and powder and an average per case cost of 3.563 cents.

So the total cost per round is 18.563 cents per round. Now you have to amortize a new reloading setup and ancillary equipment for your new space plus your time then add that to your per round cost and you will have a close approximation of tyour cost per round to reload.


I see reloading as a way to customize a load for the gun I shoot. I also see having factory ammo on hand and a reloading capability as the only means to keep shooting during crises like we have been in.

 

[Queen_of_Thunder]

First, it won't save you any money. You'll just get to shoot a heckuva lot more for the same cost.

But...

You can get a full reloading kit from Lee that would be perfectly acceptable to start loading on, and that will include everything you need except components for less than $150. You can actually do it for cheaper, but the Lee Classic Turret kit is a good deal, as is.

SuedePflow's numbers are pretty close to mine. Figure a little bit more for .45ACP, but if you are using salvaged brass and lead cast bullets, the difference is pretty negligible.

My last run, using salvaged brass, would have been:

9mm
Brass free
Primer .028
124gr lead cast bullet .032
Powder (Clays) .009
So $3.50/box
Expect to pay $40/1000 for 9mm brass

.45ACP
Brass free
Primer .028
200gr LCSW. .039
Powder (Clays) .011
So $4.00/50
Expect $50/1000 if you need to buy the brass

Hope that helps...

ETA: Ugh. I type slow on my phone.

You haven't bought brass in awhile have you.


Midway pricing.

9mm Starline brass per thousand is $167.99 plus shipping

45acp Starline brass per thousand is $181.99 plus shipping