Can you really justify a .380 over 9mm pocket pistol

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if truly serious about utter hopeless repetition, there is no shortage of video games at wallyworld
in choice of platform
cheap
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Oldfool I think part of that makes sense to me ... but I'm guessing at it.

If anyone has visited gun forums for a couple months this subject is beat to death and sure is tiring. When I first started to view forums I hit the search engines, learned who I trusted, and gave up on caliber wars. Why am I here? Hoping for a new view and I can scan the posts in a heartbeat and eliminate most of them in the first few words.
 
David E said:
Nope, it's the entire problem.

Most folks that carry a .380 or smaller do not recognize, much less accept, the limitations of the caliber and/or platform.
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nope
only half the problem
the other half being people incapable of recognizing what the limitations are not

which is why the above gent posted what he did re: same old same old
none of which is what OP asked
all of which is why 380acp topic always goes south

PS
none of my business of course, but you so thoroughly despise 380 acp as a carry caliber, why do you own one ?
"just because" was always good enough for me
just wondering why "just because" is good enough for you ???
all things considered, I would not have thunk it a good enough reason
(but I do sleep a little easier at night, knowing you do not care what I carry)
 
North Bender said:
Oldfool I think part of that makes sense to me ... but I'm guessing at it.

If anyone has visited gun forums for a couple months this subject is beat to death and sure is tiring. When I first started to view forums I hit the search engines, learned who I trusted, and gave up on caliber wars. Why am I here? Hoping for a new view and I can scan the posts in a heartbeat and eliminate most of them in the first few words.
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understood
but it gets even worse after a couple years vs. a couple months
unless you have become a peevish old fart, you need a little more time and practice at filtering out us peevish old farts, that's all
couple more weeks on line will probably suffice

(but stay tuned and you might learn how to talk a guy into a trade of an $800 380acp for a $400 9mm ????)
 
David E
Member



Join Date: August 3, 2008
Posts: 2,811 Quote:
Nothin' wrong with the .380 as long as its limitations are understood

And therein lies the problem.......
__________________

Quote:
FACT: Any gun with you beats any gun not.

FACT: I don't care what gun you carry.

-Me
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And this guy is amazing. Continues to argue that he doesn't care what you carry while denigrating calibers. It's like the channel that posts "The Truth".
 
The OP was about carrying a .380 the same size and weight of a 9mm or .40

A question that always gets interesting answers. Some of which claim the .380/.32 are "just as effective" as a 9mm/.40/.45. It isn't.

I recently posted a poll asking if people that carry a .380/.32 modify their tactics or training when they do. Of 61 respondents, 8 of them never practice because they already "know" they're "very good," and only 22 of them do specific drills, based on the low power of the cartridge.

In the thread, folks made posts that they would still aim COM, regardless of gun or caliber. That is the point I was addressing. A .32/.380 is not a 9mm or .45. Expecting it to do the same job with the same tactics is optimistic.

http://thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=526568

Do I care what gun you carry or how (or if) you train with it? Nope.

I recognize that if you carry a gun at all, you're ahead of most other people.......and that just might be enough.
 
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http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=529967&page=2
yup, no doubt about
you cannot very well argue with scientific polls, not when coupled with sophisticated statistical analysis and interpretation of of same

(and just in case anybody was still wondering, yes, store bought 9mm ammo really is cheaper than store bought 380acp.... but we could maybe take a poll on that, too, in case anybody missed OP, and has doubts about it)
 
You dont have to justify your personal choice to anyone. Maybe you could just say its more convienent to carry it and it will still do the job intended. I mean can you justify carrying a 9mm over a 44 magnum with a 9 1/2 inch barrel? Is this really that important of a choice for the purpose ? its not like a 380 is a cap gun.
 
The only real justification for a .380 is summer pocket carry, which is plenty good justification in itself. If you're carrying a larger .380, then you should really get a 9mm.

If you want to carry a .380 in a size that would serve for a 9mm, then it's simply personal preference (which is fine), but there's no real justification for it.
 
The OP was about carrying a .380 the same size and weight of a 9mm or .40
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David E

My problem is not carrying a 380 but carrying a 380 in a firearm that can easily handle a more powerful round.
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Guillermo

It seems pretty clear to me that David E and I have no problem with carrying a tiny 380 (like an LCP) if that is all that you can carry.

I used the example of a Bersa 380. Easily big enough to fire a more effective round.

There is NO justification for carrying a Desert Eagle 22lr or a Bersa 380.

A Seecamp...yes.
 
The biggest disadvantage to a .380 over a 9mm I have found is finding the d*** ammunition at reasonable prices or at all. Today at Cabellas they wanted 34 dollars for fifty FMJ, at least they had some. If you want 9mm everyone has it and at much more reasonable prices. (50% higher since the election) Most places usually have ten different kinds and manufacturers to choose from. With the .380 its an empty spot on the shelf or one brand if your lucky.
 
IMHO, my LCP is just fine. Half the battle is being able to place the shots where they need to be to stop the threat. I practice (dry fire almost daily) and live fire at least monthly. I suspect a few 380 rounds appropriately placed (center mass) will end the threat as well as a few rounds of higher caliber haphazardly placed. Shot placement.
 
I did

I did and it was an easy choice for me. When I was allowed to legally conceal carry way back when (as a cop, in Illinois, as our recent Governors, Legislatures and Illinois State Police refuse to trust honest citizens to conceal carry), 9mm's were all large things. About the smallest was the Smith & Wesson M39. So PPK's and other small .380's and J-frames were in vogue for those who carried small guns.

I had a Mauser HSc that I was pretty proficient with and was very content carrying that. It's all what you are confident with.

The Doc is out now. :cool:
 
Countless times, it's been as small as a 22LR.
MCGunner, it's not about "choosing to carry an inferior caliber". After all, of you're carrying a 9x19 (and a subcompact at that), aren't you also doing just that?
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That particular gun performs for me almost as well as a full size duty gun. It's a little slower to acquire sights, but point shoot range no slower. It shoots 3.5" at 25 yards accurate. That's accurate enough for field carry, hiking. I could take a BG out from cover at 50 yards, probably could make a hit at 100, done it with my snub .38 many times at the range. The 9x19 puts up equal ballistics to a .357 magnum 125 grain JHP fired from a 2" barrel. We're talkin' 410 ft lbs here and a heavier bullet than the .380 to boot. I have no doubt that it'll perform as well as my .45ACP despite the howls from the Jeff Cooper crowd. :rolleyes: In my collection of carries, only my 3" Taurus 66 .357 magnum belt carry shooting a very accurate 140 grain speer JHP to 1330 fps beats it by much ballistically. It's in another class from the .380, 90 grain XTP at 900 fps, that's for sure! 9x19 is a duty round, not a pocket gun round for blow backs.

I've shot that Kel Tec in IDPA and done well with it, though I preferred my Ruger P guns. I ran fast sharpshooter scores with it where the bigger guns got me slow expert scores. Such shooting is what gave me confidence in the gun. I don't have that sort of confidence in my .380.

That little nine is like having a high cap duty gun in my pocket. I'm going to keep on carrying it vs lesser, yes, I said LESSER calibers and even belt guns in bigger calibers. It's always there, comfortably and out of sight in the pocket, while my .45 and my .357 stays at home in 100 degree 70 percent humidity summers down here. And, BTW, summer is 9 months long on the gulf coast of Texas.
 
Anyone who complains about the size/weight of a PF-9 needs to go to the gym, lift some 2 1/2 pound weights, and grow a pair do some regular home exercises. The difference between a Ruger LCP (unloaded) and a PF-9 (unloaded) is 3.3 OUNCES.

3.3 ounces is roughly 16 sheets of printer paper. I can't possibly imagine that bothering someone and there is no way you can convince me that 14.5 oz (fully loaded) is a problem. You'd have better luck trying to convince me to buy another Pontiac (please see my signature).

EDIT: Here is just what the PF-9 "Prints" on you. Half-way down the page is a front pocket and a little lower is the rear pocket. Unless your wearing spandex. Then I can see a problem.
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I totally agree with this post. I've sat around and compared even my slightly thicker P11 to a LCP and, well, where's the big deal? If I need a smaller gun than the P11, I'll just drop back to my NAA mini revolvers cause I ain't gonna make an LCP work, either, if I can't make the P11 work.

BTW, any pocket bulges aren't a problem in Texas by Texas law and the general public has no clue, anyway.

Oh, BTW, if I'm not mistaken, Pontiac is dead. :D
 
MCgunner said:
I totally agree with this post. I've sat around and compared even my slightly thicker P11 to a LCP and, well, where's the big deal?
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Actually it was/is a big deal for me. The PF9 I used to own was not slightly larger than my P-3AT it was a lot larger when it came to pocket carry.
PF9_3AT.jpg
 
Funny, I've actually put a PT145 in MY pocket and it held it, though it filled the pocket. I shop for pants with such pockets. But, then, I'm not a slave of fashion, either, and I never had an office job. But, that's why they make P3ATs, for the fashion conscious and the CEO.

I often carry my .38 special in a pocket, about J frame size......

attachment.php
 
MCgunner said:
Funny, I've actually put a PT145 in MY pocket and it held it, though it filled the pocket. I shop for pants with such pockets. But, then, I'm not a slave of fashion, either, and I never had an office job. But, that's why they make P3ATs, for the fashion conscious and the CEO.

I often carry my .38 special in a pocket, about J frame size......
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You don't know me or anything about me so why do you feel it necessary to be sarcastic and imply I'm a slave to fashion? If you think I'm a slave to fashion then it's only logical for me to think you must be a slave to your PF9.

I live in a hotter climate than you, am retired, have been around well over three quarters of a century and the last thing I worry about is fashion.

If you want to dress around your guns that's fine and it doesn't bother me but personally I dress for comfort first and than carry what fits my comfortable clothes.
 
You don't know me or anything about me so why do you feel it necessary to be sarcastic and imply I'm a slave to fashion?
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Not specific to you, just that I have had guys tell me "I don't shop for pants to fit the gun. I shop for guns to fit my pants." I don't know, I just don't relate to that and, well, sounds like they are slaves to fashion if they're taking an attitude like that.

I find baggy jeans like carpenters or Wrangler Cargos to be comfortable and it's just as hot and humid here as Florida, not as HOT as Aridzona (love that state), but a lot more humid and humidity is miserable. I don't wear shorts, though, but there are cargo shorts, even, if I did. Just that I ride motorcycles a lot, near daily, and I don't ride in shorts. I've always been into motorcycles, well, since I was 13, and motorcycles and shorts don't go together, nor do chicken legs. :D

I used to wade fish in shorts, until I met mister man-o-war once. That ended that.
 
Oh, BTW, I do like this P11 a lot. I shoot it well and it's just so effective. That's why I'd rather dress for the gun rather than carrying a less effective, less shootable gun. I do have other guns I like, though, in lesser calibers. That .38 is one I carry when I'm out on the water, stainless ultralite. I also have a flat, but heavy and PPK sized 9x18 P64 Radom that's accurate as hell and I shoot it well. I just don't meld with that .380 on the range. I'm not as effective with it. With the 9x18 (glorified .380 in ballistics) at least I can hit what I'm shooting at. That's really most of the battle. The .380, well, I'll hit somewhere close, hopefully. More the gun that the caliber, I reckon.
 
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