What does your wife carry?
Pocket carry .380 or 9mm?
- Thread starter Johnny Lightning
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What does your wife carry?
larryh1108
Member
Just to clarify, you'd rather she carried nothing instead of a .380? Is this case, that's the question. I know you can "help her see the light" so to speak but the real answer is assuming she won't carry if she can't carry a .380.
Well there might be smaller 380s, but this is what I was talking about:
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Warp,
It was a hypothetical question. I have not been married for some time now but would not be comfortable with my wife carrying something I did not feel was adequate to protect her, or me. It so happens, I do believe that .380 is adequate for civilian self defense. It is the ease with which "we" can justify our loved ones carrying a caliber we would not be comfortable carrying ourselves that gives me pause. I'm certainly not wishing to "go to the mat" over it, just making an obsrvation that nothing in this discussion has altered in the least. "What's good for the goose is good for the gander" is a very appropriate saying in this case. There are not separate gender-based standards for self-defense that I can see. Discomfort with my wife carrying an inadequate caliber is not a de facto endorsement of carrying nothing. As I said, it's just an observation of comments and attitudes I often read on these forums, nothing more. I do not know the statistics of numbers of men being attacked versus women. I only know that general trends of predation favor attacks on weaker and more vulnerable prey versus stronger prey, i.e., predators don't usually pick the most dangerous prey on purpose. I certainly wasn't intending to hijack the thread and I'm sorry if I have done so.
It was a hypothetical question. I have not been married for some time now but would not be comfortable with my wife carrying something I did not feel was adequate to protect her, or me. It so happens, I do believe that .380 is adequate for civilian self defense. It is the ease with which "we" can justify our loved ones carrying a caliber we would not be comfortable carrying ourselves that gives me pause. I'm certainly not wishing to "go to the mat" over it, just making an obsrvation that nothing in this discussion has altered in the least. "What's good for the goose is good for the gander" is a very appropriate saying in this case. There are not separate gender-based standards for self-defense that I can see. Discomfort with my wife carrying an inadequate caliber is not a de facto endorsement of carrying nothing. As I said, it's just an observation of comments and attitudes I often read on these forums, nothing more. I do not know the statistics of numbers of men being attacked versus women. I only know that general trends of predation favor attacks on weaker and more vulnerable prey versus stronger prey, i.e., predators don't usually pick the most dangerous prey on purpose. I certainly wasn't intending to hijack the thread and I'm sorry if I have done so.
I'll leave the caliber statements as is.
But as for the part in bold...males are more likely to be attacked because they are more likely to be involved in/be victims of 'social violence'. Not all attackers are acting as predators.
I am sure some of this depends on who you ask/who you talk to, and their vocabulary.
BUT an interesting read on the subject is Facing Violence by Rory Miller.
http://www.amazon.com/Facing-Violen...=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1337916758&sr=1-1
engineer88
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You caliber folks would hate me. My pocket gun is a Keltec P32 99% of the time. The other 1% it is a PF9, so I put in for 9mm on the vote. I personally feel that even the 32 is enough if people will stop thinking in one shot stop mode. If ever needed that thing will get unloaded, at least 3-4 rounds as a bare minimum, but maybe all 9 (mine has plus one extension).
That said my pocket gun is my BUG to what rides IWB which is usually a Glock 36 or 19, or a Ruger SP101 or Smith 638 depending on my mood.
If my dress only permits one gun carry I do favor my airweight jframes over the little automatics any day of the week. That said my little P32 has been flawless across 700+ rounds, all of which have been after carrying for weeks or months without cleaning. I just go to the range with a box of 50,pull it out of my pocket, lint and all, shoot up the carry ammo, plus a box and never a hiccup. Then I take it home, clean it, oil it, and reload for another month or so of living in my pocket. I could not say that for my pocket 380 which I now no longer own. As a few have stated above in this thread, the most important thing about a handgun is that it be reliable. Murphy's law is a mug. I have found the P32's to be more reliable (I have two I like 'em so much) especially the chrome models, than the 380's which really push the limit in the size of these little pocket cannons. YMMV, so always take the time to personally prove out your weapons whichever way you go.
P.S. The PF9 has been flawless acroos over 1,100+ rounds or it would be gone too.
That said my pocket gun is my BUG to what rides IWB which is usually a Glock 36 or 19, or a Ruger SP101 or Smith 638 depending on my mood.
If my dress only permits one gun carry I do favor my airweight jframes over the little automatics any day of the week. That said my little P32 has been flawless across 700+ rounds, all of which have been after carrying for weeks or months without cleaning. I just go to the range with a box of 50,pull it out of my pocket, lint and all, shoot up the carry ammo, plus a box and never a hiccup. Then I take it home, clean it, oil it, and reload for another month or so of living in my pocket. I could not say that for my pocket 380 which I now no longer own. As a few have stated above in this thread, the most important thing about a handgun is that it be reliable. Murphy's law is a mug. I have found the P32's to be more reliable (I have two I like 'em so much) especially the chrome models, than the 380's which really push the limit in the size of these little pocket cannons. YMMV, so always take the time to personally prove out your weapons whichever way you go.
P.S. The PF9 has been flawless acroos over 1,100+ rounds or it would be gone too.
I went to a LGS yesterday and compared a few guns. The KT 380 was marginally smaller than the Diamondback 9mm but not enough of a difference to avoid the DB IF you feel that 9mm is far superior to 380. I have experience with the 380 and the DB and in MY limited experience with a friend's guns the KT is more reliable.
I believe that the 9mm is a more powerful round and is therefore "better" in a one shot scenario. I also believe that the psychological aspect of a BG seeing a gun is critical in virtually all attacks so a 380 is just as effective as a 9mm. A sub-compact 9mm will have more felt recoil than a 380 which will have an effect on follow up shots.
So, assuming you can get your gun out of your pocket before the bad guy is on top of you, in MOST instances the BG will stop the attack when he sees the gun and virtually every one of them will cease the attack if they are shot, even shot at and missed. In the VAST majority of cases a .22 will be just as effective as any other caliber in making the BG stop. This is of course thrown out the window in the event of a drug crazed, 285 pound BG that does not stop until he is dead. In that case I suggest a concealed 12 g shotgun with #1 buckshot.
There is NO WAY that most of us can be prepared for every eventuality when we go into a convenience store. 3 crooks with AK 47s will trump any handgun we carry(unless we are Dirty Harry). I believe we should carry the gun that we are comfortable with and practice with that gun until we can be adequately prepared. A pistol for SD is a compromise in itself. Soldiers in war zones may carry a sidearm but it is not their primary weapon.
I pocket carry a PF9 as it is the gun I own that I feel comfortable carrying. If I find a 380 that I like better then I would not hesitate in making the change purely because of the caliber. If you look hard enough you will probably find a study that "proves" a .22 pistol is better than a 12 g shotgun for defense.
I believe that the 9mm is a more powerful round and is therefore "better" in a one shot scenario. I also believe that the psychological aspect of a BG seeing a gun is critical in virtually all attacks so a 380 is just as effective as a 9mm. A sub-compact 9mm will have more felt recoil than a 380 which will have an effect on follow up shots.
So, assuming you can get your gun out of your pocket before the bad guy is on top of you, in MOST instances the BG will stop the attack when he sees the gun and virtually every one of them will cease the attack if they are shot, even shot at and missed. In the VAST majority of cases a .22 will be just as effective as any other caliber in making the BG stop. This is of course thrown out the window in the event of a drug crazed, 285 pound BG that does not stop until he is dead. In that case I suggest a concealed 12 g shotgun with #1 buckshot.
There is NO WAY that most of us can be prepared for every eventuality when we go into a convenience store. 3 crooks with AK 47s will trump any handgun we carry(unless we are Dirty Harry). I believe we should carry the gun that we are comfortable with and practice with that gun until we can be adequately prepared. A pistol for SD is a compromise in itself. Soldiers in war zones may carry a sidearm but it is not their primary weapon.
I pocket carry a PF9 as it is the gun I own that I feel comfortable carrying. If I find a 380 that I like better then I would not hesitate in making the change purely because of the caliber. If you look hard enough you will probably find a study that "proves" a .22 pistol is better than a 12 g shotgun for defense.
I don't think most people can "pocket carry" even a Kahr CM9/PM9 or Kel Tec PF-9 which I consider to be too big for me, in the front pocket, that is. Of course, anyone can "pocket carry" in cargo shorts. I think that is a separate story. In dress slacks, even my LCP seems bulgy. But it is at least reasonable. As a result I pocket carry an LCP.
I pocket carry my Kel Tec P-11 when wearing dress slacks. It might bulge a little bit, but it's a lot less conspicuous than having a bulge somewhere else.
I pocket carry a Ruger LCP 90% of the time. I also have a M&P Shield 9mm for IWB. In hot summer weather, I can accept the tradeoff is caliber size vs comfort. Body size also has a lot to do with it. A smaller guy might find a bigger gun more difficult to conceal.
meanmrmustard
Member
My truck gun is a .357 sig. I pocket carry a .22. with a laser. No joke.
As for which of the two listed in OP? The 9.
This is only because I have never personally shot a reliable .380. Not saying they don't exist, just that I've not been privy to one.
As for which of the two listed in OP? The 9.
This is only because I have never personally shot a reliable .380. Not saying they don't exist, just that I've not been privy to one.
I pocket carry as a BUG and for the rare occasion at work I can't carry my EDC Glock 23. For the past few years I've been looking for things in the gun that make sense for me personally in a pocket blaster.
1. Is it small enough to carry in the front pocket and be able to pull it out quickly without having to position it just right to get it out in a fight? While I can fit a Shield in my pocket it is just to tall to draw reliably on a consistent basis.
2. Can I shoot it comfortably and train with it at the range? For me this means to realistically shoot 150-200 rounds in one range session without even thinking about how much it hurts my hand to shoot.
3. Is it reliable?
4. Do all of this and be able to have it in a minimum .380 cal but preferably a 9mm.
I've gone through Kel Tec's P32, P380, PF9 / Ruger's LCP / Sig P232 / S&W's BG380 / Diamondback's DB9 / and have tried and shot several others. I finally rested on a Kahr CM9. The gun has been everything I have been looking for in a what I consider a true pocket 9. YMMV
1. Is it small enough to carry in the front pocket and be able to pull it out quickly without having to position it just right to get it out in a fight? While I can fit a Shield in my pocket it is just to tall to draw reliably on a consistent basis.
2. Can I shoot it comfortably and train with it at the range? For me this means to realistically shoot 150-200 rounds in one range session without even thinking about how much it hurts my hand to shoot.
3. Is it reliable?
4. Do all of this and be able to have it in a minimum .380 cal but preferably a 9mm.
I've gone through Kel Tec's P32, P380, PF9 / Ruger's LCP / Sig P232 / S&W's BG380 / Diamondback's DB9 / and have tried and shot several others. I finally rested on a Kahr CM9. The gun has been everything I have been looking for in a what I consider a true pocket 9. YMMV
Look at the Diamondback DB9 which is just a just as big as my S&W Bodyguard 380 which is just as big as an Ruger LCP. However the Diamondback DB9 is of course 9mm
However you have to remember you are shooting a 9mm cartridge from an 11 ounce gun !!! Yes 11 ounces empty, 15 ounces fully loaded 6+1. God Bless 
boricua9mm
Member
For me, it's 9mm in the front pants pocket with a good leather gun belt. For the past 7 years, that gun has been a Glock 26 with a standard, flat baseplate mag riding inside a Desantis Nemesis pocket holster.
When I can't carry a real gun, I carry a Seecamp .32 in a Bear Creek pocket holster.
When I can't carry a real gun, I carry a Seecamp .32 in a Bear Creek pocket holster.
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papaairbear
Member
I pocket carry a Kahr P380 in a leather holster made by Uncle George http://www.unclegeorgeswalletholsters.com/Pages/default.aspx
I think the .380 is going to do the job for me if worse comes to worse and I can't avoid or escape an armed confrontation. At the ranges these things occur, the Gold Dots I have loaded and practiced with will do the job, the holster prints a bit in my jeans but it looks like a wallet or a phone and nobody has noticed it.
I think the .380 is going to do the job for me if worse comes to worse and I can't avoid or escape an armed confrontation. At the ranges these things occur, the Gold Dots I have loaded and practiced with will do the job, the holster prints a bit in my jeans but it looks like a wallet or a phone and nobody has noticed it.
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