Colt Working to Bring New DA Revolver(s) to Market

[Cincinnatus]

Nothing personal, but short of a press release from Colt stating they are coming, it's just the same internet rumor from a guy with simply a first name. You have zero credibility as a semi-annonomous poster on an open forum. Short of listing your full name as well as your significance as a decision maker with Colt, your word is as believable as the people that post they heard it will happen in 2115. I'm not trying to be insulting to you personally, simply that a guy named Denis posting on an Internet forum is as reliable as a guy posting he knows the world will end tomorrow, or that I can sell you the secrets to becoming a Millionaire for $49.99.

Sure, neither you nor myself know what Mr. Dennis's credentials are, but Grant Cunningham, the source of this information, has just about the strongest credentials that you can find when it comes to revolvers and has quite literally written the book on revolver shooting fundamentals, defensive revolver shooting, revolver smithing, etc.

Actually Grant himself has very recently joked, same as many of you here, about how bored he is getting bored with these same old rumors about Colt DA revolvers coming back. So for him to all of a sudden do a 180 would require some pretty concrete information in my opinion.

Dennis is obviously familiar with Grant and therefore I think we can safely assume that he isn't just some random guy who doesn't have any clue about the subject.

I can certainly understand the skepticism given the nature of these rumors recently. I suppose in the end only time will tell.

 

[Cincinnatus]

Thanks for the welcome.

It is true that the old Colt actions were very expensive to produce, and that is why it was stated that the Python will not be coming back. However, this is why Colt developed the Mark III and Mark V pistols with a completely different action that was much cheaper/easier to produce. I believe that the King Cobra and Anaconda utilized this same action which is why I believe they are more likely candidates for resurrection.

Also regarding the revolver market in general, I would agree with some of the comments made here that the two largest competitors will be S&W and Ruger. Although I'm sure there are some out there that run like clockwork, in general Taurus simply is not making revolvers to the same quality standard as Smith and Wesson, Ruger, and Colt's last designs. Ruger generally makes a very robust and functional revolver and will continue to do well, however I feel that both the exterior and interior fit and finish of Ruger does not quite match S&W. And when looking at S&W, even some of there more recent revolver offerings have left me a bit unimpressed. For example the re-introduced Model 66 has a quality level nowhere near as good as the original examples.

I think that Colt could definitly find some market share if they play to their strength and focus on quality, even if they are still at a somewhat higher price point than their compeitors. Just look at their 1911 offerings. I would argue that the 1911 market is even more crowded than that of revolvers right now, and yet even with a price point higher than many of their competitors (for example Springfield) it seems as though their sales are still hanging in there.

 

[Dain Bramage]

More? How much more? Less? What?

As you say, we don't march in lockstep. That number will have to be decided by each of us.

I personally think the Colt name still has enough cachet to support a premium above S&W and Ruger. They definitely won't win the low price knife-fight with Taurus or Charter Arms.

They need to come up with an exceptionally well-functioning DA revolver right out the gate. Probably something based on their last coil-spring design, but updated for modern machining methods.

I think going for a classic design, like the Python, would be a mistake. It would always come up short in comparison with legacy guns, either on price point or quality.

 

[Old Fuff]

I would part with good amount of cash for top opening Schofield type revolver with Webley-Scott type auto-ejector system and holstering fins.

Well I'm sure that some would go along with you. The trouble is that the total number wouldn't produce enough sales to pay for the necessary new tooling.

 

[Old Fuff]

However, this is why Colt developed the Mark III and Mark V pistols with a completely different action that was much cheaper/easier to produce. I believe that the King Cobra and Anaconda utilized this same action which is why I believe they are more likely candidates for resurrection.

These revolvers that mostly date from the middle 1980's to the mid-1990's were less expensive to produce then earlier ones that dated back to around 1908. However they still weren't inexpensive to make, and Colt found themselves with yet another non-competitive line. If they were duplicated now they would cost more (like everything else) then they did then. Today they can't be "resurrected" without being completely retooled, and that would be costly unless consumer demand was sizeable.

Also the total market for mid/large frame revolvers chambered to use magnum cartridges has substantially shrunk. They have been replaced with Polymer-constructed/high-cap magazine pistols; as law enforcement changed directions and many other buyers followed they’re example.

Unless the new offering(s) were total junk, which is unlikely, early sales might be encouraging, but to succeed Colt must have a sustained market over a long term; or sell an ordinary product at custom gun prices.

 

[SEE IT LIKE A NATIVE]

Unless they are planning an eight to ten shot .22 with an alloy or polymer frame and 4inch barrel , my revolver needs have been filled by my Rugers ! Kevin

 

[Barry the Bear]

Its all he said she said until that damn pony speaks for itself. No one besides the current incarnation of Colt can say what theyre doing right now not even Samuel himself .

 

[Old Fuff]

No one besides the current incarnation of Colt can say what theyre doing right now not even Samuel himself .

When I see him I'll ask Sam....

 

[MikeJackmin]

I'd love to see what they come up with and I'll wish them the best of luck, but I'll be honest and say that I can't imagine any product they could reasonably offer that I'd be likely to buy.

Whatever they do (if anything) at this point Colt has to start from scratch. It’s clean-piece-of-paper time, with all that implies in design, development, tooling, and marketing costs – and the total could be considerable. Smith & Wesson, Ruger and Taurus have gone through this and amortized the costs over past sales.

That's the killer, right there.

Any given revolver that they make - if it was made with no more, and no less, than the level of workmanship we currently see from S&W - would be significantly more expensive than the comparable S&W offering. A medium-frame 357? A snub? A big 44? In each case, their guns would cost more, for the same level of finish and fit.

Unless they can bring some sort of real innovation to the table, they have no competitive advantage here at all.

 

[Barry the Bear]

When I see him I'll ask Sam....

Haha you know what I mean

 

[Old Fuff]

Unless they can bring some sort of real innovation to the table, they have no competitive advantage here at all.

In the past, (and the Old Fuff has a long memory), they have moved toward a higher-end/carriage trade product - and charged for it. All this on the presumption that if it says "COLT" people will buy it.

Sometimes this worked, and sometimes it didn’t, but if enough people didn’t that was the end of it. Colt’s number crunchers’ are an unforgiving bunch.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

IMO anything with the Colt name on it will cost way too much just like everything they sell even when that product does not deliver a level of quality worthy of that price.

 

[Vodoun da Vinci]

I dunno....I have 3 Colt pieces and all of them are extraordinary and well worth the price asked for them. I guess that perspective (value) is relative to a lot of folks. I'd personally pay premium $ for another new Colt piece.

But that's just me. A new DS especially in stainless I'd pay an awful lot of money for.

VooDoo

 

[jimbo555]

The products Colt is putting out now look like high quality to me. I agree a stainless D.S. would be great even an updated design. Just a 6 shot concealable snubby would be something!

 

[Old Fuff]

If I was going to play pick & choose I’d place the 6-shot/.38 Special/2” snubby at the top of the page too. However if it were priced at a noticeable difference above what I could buy an excellent + original Detective Special for I’d think twice. Also there is a question: Just how big is the 6-shot market over present 5-shot offerings from others if the former is more expensive?

In past years Colt’s advertising made a big issue over their 6th-shot. But S&W’s little J-frames still sold circles around them.

Frankly, Colt doesn’t give a hoot about what members of various gun-related forums want. What counts is how much penetration can they make into the overall market. This is a much harder nut to crack given the degree that they’re competitors are entrenched. Also if they were successful wouldn’t those companies react with something to counter it?

Look up Smith & Wesson’s model 73, built on the C-frame. (.38 Special/6-shot/snubby; Intended to counter Colt’s D-frame revolvers). Ultimately they never bothered to put it into production.

 

[Jim K]

When I worked in a gun shop, I had a customer who repeatedly touted the small Colts over S&W's. His oft-repeated line was "You can't carry a five-shot revolver, what if there are six of 'em?"

I finally got tired of that line and responded, "What if there are seven of 'em?"

He just stood there. The idea that there could always be more of "'em" than he had shots had never occurred to him.

Jim

 

[Old Fuff]

His oft-repeated line was "You can't carry a five-shot revolver, what if there are six of 'em?"

Personally, if they're a lot less then five of 'um I will be gone in quick order...

 

[MCgunner]

Wondering how much of the price will be for the gun and how much will be for the name?

 

[brutus51]

I really like the sound of a stainless DS especially if it had a transfer bar so all 6 rounds could be carried. I think, the recent concealed carry situation would make it their best seller. The one I would jump hoops to get my hands on would be a .45 Colt Anaconda with .451/.452" throats. I've wanted one of these ever since they first came out but could never find an example with throats smaller than .454 and that was just one chamber in the cylinder another chamber went to .456.

 

[Jaymo]

I'd like a New Service in any caliber starting with 4.
I'd be fine with it using Mk 3 or 5 lockwork.
I'd like a new Trooper.
I'd like a King Cobra.
I'd like any new D frame.
A Diamondback with Mk 3 or 5 lockwork wouldn't hurt my feelings, either.
Especially since I can't seem to get my hands on a 2" Smith 15.
The Anaconda would be fine, too.
I just don't really NEED another .44 mag revolver.
Not that it would stop me from getting one, mind you.

I'd even be happy with the Python being resurrected with Mk 3 lockwork and a factory action job. Very happy.

I'd be really happy with a King Cobra, minus that stupid cobra head on the barrel.

Dick Special or Magnum Carry, or SF-VI would make me happy.

 

[Old Fuff]

I really like the sound of a stainless DS especially if it had a transfer bar so all 6 rounds could be carried.

Since about 1908 Colt double-action / hand ejector revolvers (including all of the Detective Specials) have had not one, but two, independent mechanical safeties that made them 100% safe to carry fully loaded.

Post 1970 models had a single transfer bar safety, but were still safe to carry with the hammer resting down on a loaded chamber.

If it is unaltered, in good mechanical condition, there is no good reason to not carry Colt double-action / hand ejector's full loaded - regardless of what model they are.

 

[AbitNutz]

Unless it's the revolver Colt should have made 40 to 50 years ago, a Pythonized New Service Shooting Master in 41 and 44 mag...I'm not interested.

Ok, going back to my old curmudgeon corner....

 

[RugRev]

I would like to see a gun the size of the D frame with the new lockwork and able to take .357 e.g. .357 Diamondback, Mag Carry. A 5" bbl Anaconda like model in .44 mag/.45 Colt would be nice, too. I think the D frame size would fill a void in the market as there would be nothing quite that size.

Another option would be to come out with a frame size able to take 7 shot cylinder in .357 and 5 shot in .44 Special/.44 Mag and maybe .45 Colt.

 

[4v50 Gary]

I can see them bringing back a MK III Trooper type action. It's easier to build and service than the "V" spring Python/Diamondback action.

There's only a handful of gunsmiths and armorers who know how to work on the latter. Now imagine trying to train a workforce of assemblers to build them. That's even worse.

 

[Peter M. Eick]

That is kind of what I thought they would do. The MKIII is a decent design and if they execute it well they probably can go head to head with S&W and Ruger for a chunk of the quality revolver market.

What would be curious if they can adjust the MKIII action design to a cosmetically look alike to the Python/Diamondback/Detective Special trio.

That would be an interesting chain of events and would probably result in a sale to me for a shooter quality Diamondback/Python that I would not have to worry about beating it out of time.

I just did not like the styling of the MKIII.