Connecticut gun owners line-up to register firearms

[19-3Ben]

^^^^ bingo.

So sad, but unfortunately absolutely spot on.

As for how it hits you when you live in a state where that happens, i completely agree. After the Aurora CO shooting, it was terrible, but it was something that happened somewhere else. The Newtown shooting was different. The morning of the shooting, before they had even announced how many dead, or had even sorted out exactly what happened, I already called my wife and told her that since she had been planning to get her CCW, she should schedule the class immediately, as I didn't know if legislation would be rammed through to kill our CCW laws. It was obvious to us, that very morning, that we would experience major changes for the worse in this state.
I hate being right sometimes.

 

[GetmeoutaCT]

Yes, it's coming back to me now. I get CNN updates on my e-mail, and that whole day was just one after another, starting with "shooting reported at Sandy Hook school in Newtown, CT - at least one adult injured." It got worse and worse, one update after another, until the final one hit with a thud about 2:30 - "Twenty first-graders and six adult educators killed at Sandy Hook."

I just stared at the screen in horror, with two thoughts, the first being "those poor families, two weeks before Christmas, times twenty - that's a lot of presents under trees that will never be opened." The second, God forgive me, was "I'll be lucky to be able to buy a flintlock before 2013 is over."

 

[monotonous_iterancy]

Not everyone lives in big blue cities/towns. Some shoot 'em on their property, keep 'em in their safe, some move later on, some give 'em to relatives . . . etc How many people in this country collect things just to have 'em? Figurines, plates, stamps, coins, knives, paintings . . .etc

Well, he was talking about Chicago specifically. What's the point of flouting the registration? I mean, why keep a gun if you can't use it, can't practice with it, and can't even talk about it?

Even in Europe it seems to be this way. Someone linked an article in this thread that had a chart on the amount of unregistered guns in European countries. Germany has over 7 million registered, on the books guns. It also has 20 million unregistered guns. 20 million. I find it interesting the idea that there might be hidden gun cultures that we never hear about. Who are these people, and why do they have them? I mean, do you sense a strong gun culture in Europe, besides Switzerland? No. Same with France. Almost 3 million registered guns, and 15 million unregistered.

However, some countries, like Sweden and Finland have the exact opposite. Far more registered guns than unregistered.

 

[RussB]

If the guns are unregistered, how does anyone know they exist and report of their numbers?

 

[GetmeoutaCT]

The Dept. of Public Safety (or whatever they call themselves these days) has a record of each purchase. All they need to do is sort by rifle type and check against assault rifle registrations.

 

[monotonous_iterancy]

The Dept. of Public Safety (or whatever they call themselves these days) has a record of each purchase. All they need to do is sort by rifle type and check against assault rifle registrations.

What's up with this "record of purchase"? Is that just a CT thing?

 

[barnbwt]

There is a very valid point raised in this lawsuit that legislative due process was not followed, the bill was forced through as an "emergency" measure, with no imminent danger or emergency evident. Many gun owners here in CT were unaware of what it all meant until after it was all over (shame on them) and are now being educated

Lot of that going around lately. The laws passed in both CO and NY were also approved under ...less than savory procedures. In a year or so (I really hope it works faster than it usually does in this circumstance since it's obvious the system of law in these places is breaking down when stuff like this isn't stopped cold) I think we'll have quite a few gun rights cases before important courts, and they will finally get to decide whether we still have the 2nd amendment rights they once said we did. Too many fundamental angles of this issue (possession, manufacture, taxation) are coming to a head for little piecemeal decisions to stave off actual judgment for very long.

Recent legal history suggests that a substantial ruling now may actually end up being fairly liberal as far as personal gun rights (as in the definition of the word, not the caricature ), or at least not completely moronic. Personally, I wouldn't even rule a neutering of the NFA/GCA off the table these days, if only because it's really hard to logically justify their legal authority in our system (and the High Court already seriously damaged their credibility with the recent ACA fiasco)

Always a bit of the dice roll where the courts are concerned, though it would be nice to finally get some clarity on the issue.

TCB

 

[Onward Allusion]

GetmeoutaCT
The Dept. of Public Safety (or whatever they call themselves these days) has a record of each purchase. All they need to do is sort by rifle type and check against assault rifle registrations.

2 things...

#1 - Holy Crap! Isn't this ^^^ registration already?
#2 - If they already have a registry, then why the narrower registry? I guess it does capture the magazines with this iteration.

Sounds to me like the State guberment have plans.

 

[GetmeoutaCT]

Yes, it's a CT thing (and I'm sure in other states as well). There is a 5 1/2 by 8 1/2 inch form (I forget it's abbreviation at the moment) that is generated for each firearm sale, that goes to the state gendarmes.

So, yes, all firearms (or purchases, technically), are "registered."

As I said earlier, I think the purpose of the new "registration" is political; i.e., they can say to their base that they did something. Given the number of firearms owners in this state, if they started confiscation, I think there would be a voter revolt in the next election, and they know it.

 

[DaBruins]

It's called a DPS-3 form, issued by the Dept. of Public Safety, and it records all ffl sales and transfers of all firearms in the state.

Since the state already has the information on file, I think the next step will be a tax on all the newly registered firearms and hi-cap magazines. The registration is now an admission of ownership, and the only way to avoid the tax is to prove you no longer own these items. Another requirement of the new gun law mandates gun owners that do not possess a cc permit apply for a certificate to purchase ammo, for a fee of $35, which is valid for 5 yr period and renewable for another $35 fee.

According to an article in the Hartford Courant this morning, there had been approx. 30,000 rifles registered by the deadline, but the state estimates there are as many as 250,000 rifles that meet the new assault rifle guidelines (1 cosmetic feature), and only 17,000 hi-cap mags have been declared.

As a sick side note, CT bills itself as The Constitution State! Go figure.....

 

[RussB]

The Dept. of Public Safety (or whatever they call themselves these days) has a record of each purchase. All they need to do is sort by rifle type and check against assault rifle registrations.

Resources...The state of CT likely does not have the resources to sift through all the DPS-3-C forms on file, which would be in the millions

By giving them these new "assault weapon declaration" forms they can now target those particular weapons and their owners


RE: DPS-3-C forms

There are 4 copies made at the point of purchase,

1 copy remains on record at the FFL dealer for 30 years,
1 copy goes to the state Dept of Public Safety
1 copy goes to your local police dept
1 copy goes to the buyer


I live in a town that used to have a resident state trooper, but hasn't for 5+ years...I wonder where all the local PD forms go?

 

[Onward Allusion]

They may not have the resources at the State level, but what is going to prevent them from scanning all of them and electronically sending all of them to some off-shore IT sweatshop for data entry. You do know that they do that with other data, right?

 

[RussB]

They may not have the resources at the State level, but what is going to prevent them from scanning all of them and electronically sending all of them to some off-shore IT sweatshop for data entry. You do know that they do that with other data, right?

Are you suggesting that you KNOW the state of CT does that?


I have heard that the CT DPS is many months behind (8+ months from an FFL) on processing the DPS-3-C forms...there's my vague and useless factoid entry in this thread

 

[itsa pain]

That's not true. I can be classed as a liberal gun owner and I don't trust the government. In fact I doubt anyone trusts the governmnt regradless of which side of the fence they come down on. To be successful we must stay focused on gun rights as straying into other issues will undemine our objective.

How can you be a liberal and not trust the govt? It does not make no sense liberals derive all their power from judges and govt programs etc.

 

[itsa pain]

Interesting reading the first part of this thread, with certain people basically calling those who registered their guns cowards.

The way I see it, people have 4 options:

1. Get rid of guns that need to be registered.

2. Register your guns

3. Refuse to register your guns. Stop practicing with them, and if you ever have to use them in your home, rely on Shoot, Shovel, and Shut up.

4. Refuse to register your guns. Go down to the police station and start shooting. Alternatively, drive down to the state legislature and start shooting.



Number one is out. Number three is seriously unwise.

That leaves 2 and 4. Start the revolution, or register your guns.

Seems to me that every time someone has tried to do something like number 4, the gun community is the first ones to denounce that person or group as terrorists, criminals, racists, child molesters, and whatever else. I have not seen any support from the gun community at large for any person or group that has tried to act in a military fashion against the government.

So all I have to say is this: If you want to call someone a coward for registering their guns, you'd better start supporting people like David Koresh, Timothy McVeigh, and Christopher Dorner. If you feel that that is not appropriate, then shut your mouth about the people who choose to register their guns for now.

Where do you get off telling people to shut their mouths?? Why are you telling people if they think like that they support dorner mc veigh? I think people should not register and I support Thomas Jefferson Patrick Henry Sam Adams. So you are really saying is what all the rabid antis say which is anyone against gun laws supports terrorism and murder.

 

[GetmeoutaCT]

Are you suggesting that you KNOW the state of CT does that?


I have heard that the CT DPS is many months behind (8+ months from an FFL) on processing the DPS-3-C forms...there's my vague and useless factoid entry in this thread

I have heard that too, and that is the abrreviation; thanks.

 

[Onward Allusion]

Are you suggesting that you KNOW the state of CT does that?

I have heard that the CT DPS is many months behind (8+ months from an FFL) on processing the DPS-3-C forms...there's my vague and useless factoid entry in this thread

CT and most States outsource at least some of their IT services. Proof of the CT DSP doing this? No. Not at this time. However, take a look at the attached PDF. It's a SOW for scanning paper docs relating to Obamacare for the State of CT - SIGNED. No tinfoil here.

Also, I ran across this interesting article on the subject though. As an aside, I've actually worked with the leadership at Cognizant and it IS an accurate article.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/adam-andrzejewski/implementing-obamacare-by_b_3861333.html

Think about this . . .If bureaucrats can outsource Obamacare (HIPAA and all that crap) implementation, how easy would it be to outsource information processing on those evil gun owners and tax the hell out of them or <gasp> confiscate the weapons? No tinfoil here, just them facts.

 

[RussB]

That is very interesting! And disturbing

 

[Gaucho Gringo]

It is rather sad that the areas that were the birthplace of liberty are now the places of tyranny. America is dying.

 

[Ignition Override]

mon. iterancy:
To add to your comments about various regulations in Europe: You might also remember that in the Czech Republik one can even acquire a CCW permit, in addition to owning and using the VZ-58 etc.
"Bohemus" can clarify this. As for nearby countries in what most refer to as eastern Europe, I have no idea.

Does the overall topic here provide a little more incentive for American pro-2nd Amendment people to buy from private sellers at gun shows, or via Armslist etc?
Once more states seriously discuss making this more difficult, or impossible, imagine the price jumps.

Do federal or state govts. already have access to insurance company databases which store homeowners' policies?

 

[goon]

Don't get me wrong here - I hate registration. It could very well turn into confiscation, even if it was never intended to. I entirely oppose it.

Having said that, here in PA, we've had handgun registration for years. Every handgun I've ever bought had to be transferred through a dealer and a form filled out that's sent to the state police. The PA state police could easily track every handgun I've ever bought or sold in this state, which incidentally, is every handgun I've ever owned. A handful of S&W revolvers of various vintages, several 1911's, a couple Glocks, a couple SIGS, a couple Rugers... the list goes on. And the police know about every single one of them.

And I feel that the danger of the state police showing up right now and demanding I turn one of my handguns over is just about zero.

I say fight it as much as you can, comply when you have to, but don't panic.

 

[Leanwolf]

Here are some people who lined up per the Government's orders.

After the war, someone there said, "We never thought it could happen here. Not in the land of Beethoven."



Of course, that could never happen here, not in the land of Jefferson.

Could it??

L.W.

 

[monotonous_iterancy]

Don't get me wrong here - I hate registration. It could very well turn into confiscation, even if it was never intended to. I entirely oppose it.

Having said that, here in PA, we've had handgun registration for years. Every handgun I've ever bought had to be transferred through a dealer and a form filled out that's sent to the state police. The PA state police could easily track every handgun I've ever bought or sold in this state, which incidentally, is every handgun I've ever owned. A handful of S&W revolvers of various vintages, several 1911's, a couple Glocks, a couple SIGS, a couple Rugers... the list goes on. And the police know about every single one of them.

And I feel that the danger of the state police showing up right now and demanding I turn one of my handguns over is just about zero.

I say fight it as much as you can, comply when you have to, but don't panic.

The danger is not in the people who currently have the lists, the danger is in what could happen with those lists in the future. This can be illustrated historically, without hyperbole.

Leanwolf's post reminds me of a very detailed publication I read on gun control during the Nazi era. The reality is that Hitler didn't ban guns from everyone, in fact, he loosened gun laws for everyone, except for those he disliked. Those people he disarmed, and he used registration lists to do so.

The laws he he used to enforce the disarming of Jews and political opponents was created by the Wiemar republic in 1928 for the same purpose gun registration is proposed today - public safety.

So it's true, you probably have nothing to fear from registration today, but 50, 100 years? Who knows?
Here's the article, and I'll be upfront, it's very long, but very informative.

 

[justice06rr]

IMHO gun registration is unconstitutional, and forcing citizens to register their guns is a direct violation of one's rights.

Registration is just another form of control; and it does no universal good to the people.

I'm sure the felons and criminals are all lining up to register their guns too...

 

[itsa pain]

Don't get me wrong here - I hate registration. It could very well turn into confiscation, even if it was never intended to. I entirely oppose it.

Having said that, here in PA, we've had handgun registration for years. Every handgun I've ever bought had to be transferred through a dealer and a form filled out that's sent to the state police. The PA state police could easily track every handgun I've ever bought or sold in this state, which incidentally, is every handgun I've ever owned. A handful of S&W revolvers of various vintages, several 1911's, a couple Glocks, a couple SIGS, a couple Rugers... the list goes on. And the police know about every single one of them.

And I feel that the danger of the state police showing up right now and demanding I turn one of my handguns over is just about zero.

I say fight it as much as you can, comply when you have to, but don't panic.

That is why I would never buy a handgun except when I lived in Florida. I think the reason govt is not interested in seizing pistols is because they are mainly useless for offense and mostly everything else. They seem to after what can give them a hard time hi-cap mags 50 cals military style semi-autos high capacity shotguns etc. Oh and I forgot bayonets lol