Cost Effective source for lead casting?

[D.B. Cooper]

So, I've been looking at buying hardball casting lead ingots for making my own projectiles, and it looks like this is a financially losing proposition. At the cost of lead online, before any shipping charges, it works out to about 86¢ per projectile, based on 240 grn projectiles. ($25 per 6 lb ingot) I can buy pre made and lubed cast bullets for about 15¢ per projectile. (Hunter's Supply.)

Doesn't make sense.

I know my dad used to collect wheel weights from tire shops, for free, but I think those days are mostly gone now. (Few shops even use lead weights anymore; they're mostly magnesium now.)

Is there anyway to make this financially feasible, or are people just doing it for the fun of doing it?

 

[dgod]

I have nearly 200# of wheel weights, that I have added Tin to, they test Brinnel at 16-18. I got them from 2 of my local Wheel/Tire Stores,Cost $0.00.

I found some on THR that was a bargain, so I got 50# to add to the 150# I had. If you look, and are patient, you can find lead. I Did..

Good Luck

 

[armoredman]

I cheat - I have a Doe Run secondary smelter scant miles from my house, and can get certified bullet metal for about $2 a pound, picked up. Another option is to go to castboolits.gunloads.com and see who is selling lead. Wheelweight ain't the greatest, but it is the cheapest.
I have a buddy in construction who is always finding sheet lead from various demos, and then gets the tin and antimony from that same smelter to allow up his perfect mix.

 

[blue32]

Forget about wheel weights. Sifting range scrap in the dirt is how I got my lead. If you have to buy, go here:
https://www.rotometals.com/1-to-20-bullet-alloy-alloy-95-lead-5-tin/
1:20 alloy will cost you .11 / bullet.

I'd like to add that you probably don't need "hardball" for what I'm guessing is 44 spl/mag. bhn 11-14 will work fine.

 

[dgod]

Does Rotometals have a break/Discount for THR Members?

 

[edwardware]

It depends on where you live, and how you value your time.

First, you can buy ingots online (Castboolits, etc) for ~$1.20/# shipped. You can also buy cast and coated 9mm for $60/k shipped.

I've been casting and scrounging weights and berm scrap for about 3 years in Upstate SC. State law does not prohibit lead WW, so most of the tire shops use them. . . BUT some do not and some other states do ban them.

Over time I've noticed the output of a 5 gallon bucket from the tire shops change from 60# CO/40#SO/30#zinc-iron to about 50% zinc-iron. Additionally the trash in the buckets doesn't weight anything but you still have to sort it. That takes time, as does rendering it into ingots.

I did a time & cost analysis late last year with my last batch of weights as part of the analysis to justify a progressive press for pistol. Valuing my time at $20/hr, it costs me about $0.75-0.80/# to make the muffin ingots.

My conclusion is that it's time to stop scrounging, buy 0.356 and 0.452 projectiles, and use the lead I have on hand for revolver and rifle casting. I should have enough to outlast me; I've stored about 2k# of lead in 3 years.

 

[edwardware]

Forget about wheel weights. Sifting range scrap in the dirt is how I got my lead.

Agreed. While the alloy is softer, it's sufficient for most pistol bullets (but not high speed rifle) and much faster to produce.

It's also atrociously messy and smelly. Have you noticed that fragments of clay targets produce billowing clouds of greenish-yellow smoke? My neighbors love it!

 

[dgod]

I have cast bullets for years, I am about to venture into a new process. Cast/Loading for the 460 XVR, it is a 0.452 sized projectile, the firearm is capable of 2600 = 2700fps, I already have the 240gr HP Mold as well as the 265gr RN Mold. Would like to try 300gr +, I have identified several molds for 300gr+. I just need to identify Lead of acceptable hardness, to stand up to the speeds discussed, these can be either with or without Gas Checks.

Thanks in advance for Any/All help
dg

 

[edwardware]

. . . the firearm is capable of 2600 = 2700fps, . . . I just need to identify Lead of acceptable hardness, to stand up to the speeds discussed, these can be either with or without Gas Checks.

I have no experience with traditional grease-groove lube, but I've run powder coated and HiTek coated COWW alloy bullets to 2500fps with reasonable success. On that basis, I suggest playing with the new generation of coatings on a GC'd bullet to get a velocity boost.

 

[dgod]

I have no experience with traditional grease-groove lube, but I've run powder coated and HiTek coated COWW alloy bullets to 2500fps with reasonable success. On that basis, I suggest playing with the new generation of coatings on a GC'd bullet to get a velocity boost.

Thanks Edwardware, I have Zero experience with the Coated (powder nor Hi-Tek), I will look into it as a possible solution.

Thanks Again
dg

 

[edwardware]

@dgod: Harbor Freight's red powder coat and a toaster oven is where I started. Add a tupperware and airsoft pellets and use the shake'n'bake method.

 

[RealGun]

So, I've been looking at buying hardball casting lead ingots for making my own projectiles, and it looks like this is a financially losing proposition. At the cost of lead online, before any shipping charges, it works out to about 86¢ per projectile, based on 240 grn projectiles. ($25 per 6 lb ingot) I can buy pre made and lubed cast bullets for about 15¢ per projectile. (Hunter's Supply.)

Doesn't make sense.

I know my dad used to collect wheel weights from tire shops, for free, but I think those days are mostly gone now. (Few shops even use lead weights anymore; they're mostly magnesium now.)

Is there anyway to make this financially feasible, or are people just doing it for the fun of doing it?

My casting equipment and lead supply is only in case I cannot buy bullets (prepping). I have two 70ish pound shipments of Lyman #2 ingots from Missouri Bullet. Cost is not critical in this scenario. Shipping lead is not expensive when received by flat rate priority mail and under the 70 pound weight limit. If that post office deal ever changes, shipping lead and bullets becomes a much more expensive proposition.

 

[lightman]

Lead is still out there. You just have to look. Networking is a big help in finding it. Ask your friends, family members and co-workers to keep an eye out for you. Some scrap yards will still sell to the public. Run a "want to buy" ad on craig list. As mentioned, some of the members on the cast boolit site sell lead for around $1 a pound plus shipping.

I just bought 5600# of sorted wheel weights for 40 cents a pound. I was not even looking for lead at the time. I met FTF with a fellow caster to buy a bullet mold from him and he mentioned lead!

 

[edwardware]

I just bought 5600# of sorted wheel weights for 40 cents a pound.

Hot diggity! That'll keep you in lead for a while. . .

How did you move it?

 

[D.B. Cooper]

So, someone school me on mixing lead, tin, and antimony. I found a site that will ship lead in flat rate boxes, so I can buy it for about $4/lb delivered. But it's 99.9% pure, BH 5. So I'd have to find antimony and tin someplace to harden it.

 

[D.B. Cooper]

I don't think I'm going to go through the process of hunting down scrap lead or range scrap, etc. I can buy a 500 rd box of cast lead projectiles for about half a day's pay, so I think, for me at least, I would be better served to just budget that and buy the led projectiles-unless I can get it a lot cheaper.

 

[D.B. Cooper]

Forget about wheel weights. Sifting range scrap in the dirt is how I got my lead. If you have to buy, go here:
https://www.rotometals.com/1-to-20-bullet-alloy-alloy-95-lead-5-tin/
1:20 alloy will cost you .11 / bullet.

I'd like to add that you probably don't need "hardball" for what I'm guessing is 44 spl/mag. bhn 11-14 will work fine.

For the most part, yeah. 44 spl cowboy action loads. However, I also plan to load 44 magnum "bear loads" (comparable to HSM's bear loads) and hunting loads. So something about 300 grn bullet traveling about 1600 fps from a 20" barrel rifle.

 

[Arkansas Paul]

I can buy a 500 rd box of cast lead projectiles for about half a day's pay,

For a $30-$40 bucket of wheel weights you will produce 3k-4k .44 bullets, depending on your weight. If you're shooting mostly cowboy loads, I assume you're shooting lighter bullets so you would get more per pound obviously.
You will have more than a half a day in producing them, but you'll have a few thousand instead of a few hundred.

Casting and loading is a labor of love. Many of us enjoy it as much as shooting, I know I do. It is therapeutic for me.
If you're so worried about your time that you are factoring it in (it sounds like it but I'm not sure), then maybe buying them would be best for you.
And there's nothing wrong with that either. Different strokes for different folks. You have to figure out which is best for you.

Happy shooting.

 

[reddog81]

$4 per pound is scalper pricing. You can buy bullets for that price and not have to worry about spendfing $100's on a furnace, molds, sizing dies, etc. I just checked the swapping and selling section cast boolit forum and the first post selling lead I found was $75 for a 65 pound box.

I've got a few hundred pounds from a connection that has access to wheel weights but it's not a reliable source. All my other purchases have been through craigslist. I check it a couple of times a month. I had a source who was doing hospital demos and got 300 lbs. from them a few different times. I found another guy who was selling everything out of his machine shop and I got 200+ lbs from him. There's a small time metal scraper that I have bought some odds and ends from. Usually I pay $1.00 to $1.25 per pound. Buying ingots saves money and time not having to smelt down yourself.

I've bought antimony and tin from vendors on the cast boolit forum for reasonable prices.

 

[Englishmn]

If you know anyone who works in Telco line repair. A lot of old lead closures get replaced and can be aquired for a six pack or so.

 

[jmorris]

I recycle the bullets themselves.

 

[brewer12345]

I got into casting over the past year and right away decided not to smelt lead. I buy ingots and cast. If you look on eBay, castboolits and other places, you can find ingots delivered for around 1.20 a pound. Range lead ingots seem to be the most available and they average about 1 percent antimony and the balance lead. If you look on the lead and other alloys subforum of castboolits, there is a link to a downloadable spreadsheet that allows you to input different source materials.and dial up a desired alloy. If you use range lead, rotometals super hard alloy for antimony, and junk pewter from eBay or a thrift sho as a source of tin, you can dial up lyman 2 with 5% each of antimony and tin for about 1.60 a pound. Most of the time, handgun rounds going 1000 fps or less will be just fine with range lead plus 2% tin. Using junk pewter at $5 a pound, that would be $1.25 or so per pound alloy. I figure I pump out 38 special bullets for under 3 cents a piece.

But let's be honest. Unless you value your time at zero you are probably able to buy projectiles cheap enough to skip casting. There has to be some other motivation. I do it because I enjoy the satisfaction of making my own plus I am hedging the next panic.

 

[blue32]

OP, see attached for alloy calculator. This will allow you to mix and match for desired hardness.

 

[armoredman]

...Valuing my time at $20/hr, it costs me...

What do you charge yourself when you are on vacation? Do you cost out your sleep hours? I see this over and over and over and I have to say - if you are charging yourself for your time, it's NOT a hobby - it's a job. I cast, powder coat, reload, and go shooting on my time. That time WILL BE SPENT, whether I am at the computer watching Netflix, sleeping, bouncing around town, etc. I can't bank it. So I choose to take some of that time, for which I wasn't going to be paid, anyway, and spend it on casting/reloading/shooting.
It's a hobby, not a job. if you wanna get paid, go back to work.

 

[D.B. Cooper]

What do you charge yourself when you are on vacation? Do you cost out your sleep hours? I see this over and over and over and I have to say - if you are charging yourself for your time, it's NOT a hobby - it's a job. I cast, powder coat, reload, and go shooting on my time. That time WILL BE SPENT, whether I am at the computer watching Netflix, sleeping, bouncing around town, etc. I can't bank it. So I choose to take some of that time, for which I wasn't going to be paid, anyway, and spend it on casting/reloading/shooting.
It's a hobby, not a job. if you wanna get paid, go back to work.

Not so fast.

While you "see this over and over," I also see remarks like yours "over and over." Let's see: I can spend days digging in the dirt (a task I dislike when it's not food plot gardening) or driving around to every tire shop in town (a task I dislike even when I have to buy new tires), so that I can do the enjoyable part of casting bullets-the actual casting of the bullet. OR I can spend that time shooting. (Or doing anything OTHER than digging in the dirt for spent projectiles.) But each to his own I guess.