CajunBass
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I ain't sure, but I think this was posted very "tongue in cheek."
At least that's the way I read it.
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I ain't sure, but I think this was posted very "tongue in cheek."
At least that's the way I read it.
odessastraight
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Well, I reckon it's been said before...but... ""Badges? We don't need no stinking badges".
In NC (at least in my County) we get a little photo ID card to show a cop if ummmmmmm detained or something. I've been ummmmmm detained a few times (speeding, roadside checks, that kinda stuff) over the years and never have remembered (OK, bothered) to dig out the card to show it. Unless the cop asks me directly or begins to pat me down I don't figgure it's any of his business anyway.
In NC (at least in my County) we get a little photo ID card to show a cop if ummmmmmm detained or something. I've been ummmmmm detained a few times (speeding, roadside checks, that kinda stuff) over the years and never have remembered (OK, bothered) to dig out the card to show it. Unless the cop asks me directly or begins to pat me down I don't figgure it's any of his business anyway.
If you ever have to blast some Neanderthal having a badge to flash could keep the cops from blasting you before you can show them your postage stamp sized state concealed permit!
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Zen21Tao
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odessastraight
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Well, sholuld I unfortunately be forced to engage in such serious social interaction I would then make sure my Neanderthal blaster goes back concealed and await said cops with both hands open and in plain sight...and make sure to address said arriving cops as "officer" and "sir", a lot. I'm confident that this course of action is much better than flashing a stinking badge.
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=163198&highlight=badge
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=138536&highlight=badge
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=66727&highlight=badge
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=41929&highlight=badge
http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=211779&highlight=badge
http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=57962&highlight=badge
http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=56609&highlight=badge
http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=38744&highlight=badge
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=138536&highlight=badge
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=66727&highlight=badge
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=41929&highlight=badge
http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=211779&highlight=badge
http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=57962&highlight=badge
http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=56609&highlight=badge
http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=38744&highlight=badge
m1aman
Member
when the cops show up, drop your gun.
reach for a badge and you deserve to be shot.
reach for a badge and you deserve to be shot.
choochboost
Member
I have a friend who is an FBI agent who carries his badge next to his holster for that very reason as opposed to his back pocket.Wheeler said:
So Matt, are you going to provide this service for every repeat question? This one isn't nearly as common as some.Matt G said:
DoubleTapDrew
Member
I could just see someone yelling "CONCEALED WEAPON HOLDER DROP THE GUN!!!" as they flash their badge and pull out their tactical compensated .38 super race gun.
You could also have badges and shirts that say "I'm armed, shoot me first!" Being a licensed CCW holder doesn't give you any more rights than anyone else and you don't need a badge to show it.
You could also have badges and shirts that say "I'm armed, shoot me first!" Being a licensed CCW holder doesn't give you any more rights than anyone else and you don't need a badge to show it.
mustanger98
Member
I see a bunch of people getting wierd ideas of things to do or expect somebody else to do something wierd they shouldn't.
1- If such a badge became legally mandated, it would not be seen until after the fact of an unavoidable altercation and then it would be shown to responding cops as a safety precaution.
2- Badge or no badge, to my mind, if possible your CCW should be back in its holster before the cops show up. I think the citizen should co-operate with the cops, but present their side calmly and matter-of-factly as to what happened. We're all supposed to be on the same side.
3- This is being confused with Citizen's Arrest which is entirely another matter.
1- If such a badge became legally mandated, it would not be seen until after the fact of an unavoidable altercation and then it would be shown to responding cops as a safety precaution.
2- Badge or no badge, to my mind, if possible your CCW should be back in its holster before the cops show up. I think the citizen should co-operate with the cops, but present their side calmly and matter-of-factly as to what happened. We're all supposed to be on the same side.
3- This is being confused with Citizen's Arrest which is entirely another matter.
Valkman
Member
I've seen cops before reply to these threads and say they'd be very unhappy to see someone wearing a "wannabe" badge, which is all it is. That in itself is a good reason not to wear one, besides the fact it's just stupid anyway.
Yep!
Yep!
true believer
Member
choochboost
Member
I really don't see what the debate is about. A CCW badge you buy from some mall ninja outfit is not legal ID issued by a government agency. You can flash anything you want, but the only people who need to know why you're carrying are the cops, and even if you show them a badge you bought off the internet, they're still going to ask for a driver's license and your authentic state issued CCW permit. So then, of what benefit is a CCW badge? As Wheeler and I mentioned earlier, it could potentially settle those who see it next to your holster when your weapon is unintentionally exposed. But I'd just rather conceal my weapon responsibly.
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m1aman
Member
it lets everyone else you are an immature mall ninja and probably shouldn't even own a weapon.
mustanger98
Member
Take posts #36, #38, and #39 into account and they're the truth as the laws now stand.
I'm not advocating this one way or the other. Just looking at the situation. But I tend to agree that the ones from the mall ninja outfits are a joke... on anybody who'd buy one.
If they laws were changed and such a badge were legally mandated by the state legislatures, then the cops couldn't rightly look at it as a wannabe deal if it were used responsibly. Then the CCWer's ID would be in the badge wallet thing with the badge and the cops would see it at the same time. They'd probably still ask to see a driver's license, but at that point I think it wouldn't be as big a deal.
If those badges were legislated into a legal necessity, it'd probably mean the real deal wouldn't be made by the mall ninja outfit. I'd surmise there would be a badge number just like we have SS numbers or other ID numbers on driver's licenses and CCW permits. A phony (read: criminal faking documents) would probably be found out shortly depending on how dumb they are and how fast it'd take to straighten out a mix-up in the numbers.
I'm not advocating this one way or the other. Just looking at the situation. But I tend to agree that the ones from the mall ninja outfits are a joke... on anybody who'd buy one.
If they laws were changed and such a badge were legally mandated by the state legislatures, then the cops couldn't rightly look at it as a wannabe deal if it were used responsibly. Then the CCWer's ID would be in the badge wallet thing with the badge and the cops would see it at the same time. They'd probably still ask to see a driver's license, but at that point I think it wouldn't be as big a deal.
If those badges were legislated into a legal necessity, it'd probably mean the real deal wouldn't be made by the mall ninja outfit. I'd surmise there would be a badge number just like we have SS numbers or other ID numbers on driver's licenses and CCW permits. A phony (read: criminal faking documents) would probably be found out shortly depending on how dumb they are and how fast it'd take to straighten out a mix-up in the numbers.
DoubleTapDrew
Member
I agree but we already have such a thing to show to the responding cops as a safety precaution, a CHL (or CWP or whatever a given state chooses to call it). Someone doesn't need a badge as well unless they want people to think they are a LEO and play mall ninja.
Jamie C.
Member
I hope this never happens, 'cause that's all I'd need... one more damn fool thing to have to keep up with.
Between the gun, spare ammo, wallet, keys, light, knife, etc, I might as well go back to wearing a duty belt as it is.
J.C.
mustanger98
Member
Yeah, I know. I have a CCW permit too. Here in Georgia, we call it a "Georgia Firearms License".
One thing I wonder about is if somebody had to use their CCW weapon to defend themselves, how fast would the responding cops pick up on the CCW holder presenting just their license. I personally disagree with the badge thing if it's not legally mandated, which we all know it's not at this point. But I wonder what it'll take to get everybody on the same page.
From what I understand hearing from local lawyers, too much of this general issue of carrying defensive sidearms is left to officer discretion for us to have a really definitive answer. That's even having read the laws as they read on the books.
Mustanger 98,
Why would any legislature mandate that carry of a badge by a CCW holder? What possible purpose would it serve? Why do you want the state to mandate that you carry a badge?
A badge is just a piece of metal. It means absolutely nothing without some credentials to go with it. Several years ago, while on patrol, I checked a vehicle that was occupied by two federal agents about 1:30 am. Badges were displayed as I approached the vehicle. My answer was, "Those sure are pretty badges fellas, you got some ID to go with them?" A badge means nothing. Anyone can get any badge they want if they know where to go.
There is no need for a CCW holder to have a badge. The whole "It calms the sheeple." argument is a non-starter. In my experience, people who carry police equipment such as badges and handcuffs and aren't on their way to a Halloween party are posers and quite possibly dangerous.
A CCW permit is not a peace officers commission. It's a permit to carry a firearm on your person concealed. That's all it is.
There is another side to this whole issue. Your safety. Most experienced police officers do everything they can to lower their profile when they are off duty. I carry my badge and police ID in a separate wallet from my ATM, credit cards and cash. Why? Because there is a danger of you standing at the counter of the local stop and rob when the bad guys come in to rob it. You're paying for your soda or coffee and the bad guy sees your badge and shoots you dead from behind. If my badge is worn on my belt, I'm on duty working a plainclothes assignment. That means I also have my body armor on and am carrying other force options. To be mistaken for a cop is not a good thing.
CCW badge = the mark of a poser and wannabe....
Jeff
Why would any legislature mandate that carry of a badge by a CCW holder? What possible purpose would it serve? Why do you want the state to mandate that you carry a badge?
A badge is just a piece of metal. It means absolutely nothing without some credentials to go with it. Several years ago, while on patrol, I checked a vehicle that was occupied by two federal agents about 1:30 am. Badges were displayed as I approached the vehicle. My answer was, "Those sure are pretty badges fellas, you got some ID to go with them?" A badge means nothing. Anyone can get any badge they want if they know where to go.
There is no need for a CCW holder to have a badge. The whole "It calms the sheeple." argument is a non-starter. In my experience, people who carry police equipment such as badges and handcuffs and aren't on their way to a Halloween party are posers and quite possibly dangerous.
A CCW permit is not a peace officers commission. It's a permit to carry a firearm on your person concealed. That's all it is.
There is another side to this whole issue. Your safety. Most experienced police officers do everything they can to lower their profile when they are off duty. I carry my badge and police ID in a separate wallet from my ATM, credit cards and cash. Why? Because there is a danger of you standing at the counter of the local stop and rob when the bad guys come in to rob it. You're paying for your soda or coffee and the bad guy sees your badge and shoots you dead from behind. If my badge is worn on my belt, I'm on duty working a plainclothes assignment. That means I also have my body armor on and am carrying other force options. To be mistaken for a cop is not a good thing.
CCW badge = the mark of a poser and wannabe....
Jeff
mustanger98
Member
Jeff White:
I don't know why they would as legislatures seem to pass some really strange laws sometimes- some of which look like somebody got bored- but since it was brought up, I just try to take a more objective look at any given issue than it seems most other posters in such a thread as this seem to take.
Why would I want this enacted? I don't. I'm not one way or the other about it. You just made the mistake of thinking I do.
Right about it just being a piece of metal meaning nothing by itself. But there was a time, as I understand it, when even Wells Fargo agents had badges for whatever reason. Badges have been issued to a variety of people for a variety of reasons. Without credentials, like you said, it means nothing. That's why in another post I said if this were ever mandated the badge would be in the same wallet deal with the other CCW ID.
I don't recall seeing where anybody said it was a peace officer's commission. As I also said in another post, this issue is being confused with the issue of citizen's arrest which to my knowledge is legal. Oh, and before anybody says "the Georgia General Assembly changed the state constitution and outlawed it", I looked into that and it was the former Soviet Republic of Georgia and whatever they do don't count over here.
That part about a badge being carried in a separate wallet from personal business items and money- that's another thing I was getting at in another post. Now, whether anybody else- other than a cop- thought of that, I couldn't tell you. I agree about not wanting to be mistaken for a cop. I also know what you mean about having on the body armor and other force options.
All in all, I think we're closer to being on the same page as far as the downside to it. I just tend to try to look at both sides. I don't think that makes me a poser or wannabe. FWIW, my brother-in-law has been known to wear his black "SECURITY" cap out and around with us at times when he's not working security. It looks dopey. Contrast that with any badge being carried in a separate wallet and not shown unless absolutely necessary. I'd bet you don't show your badge off-duty unless you have to either. In that case, you're saying the same thing I am.
But here's another thing, if this thread hasn't degenerated so far as for it to be lost... I've noticed in several other threads where somebody CCW'd and got outted because some insipid twit opened their mouth about "you have a gun; do something" when it wasn't called for. This seems to be a problem in general, whether we're talking about a private citizen CCW'ing or maybe in an off duty cop's case, something happens and somebody hollers "you're a cop; do something" so it winds up just like if the wrong people saw your police badge in line at the stop and rob.
This thread's getting tiresome.
BTW, I noticed Jamie C.'s comment about...
I just mentioned my brother-in-law... his dad owns the security company and I'm thinking he's an ex-cop. He said he hates to wear a duty belt. After an 8hr shift in a squad car, according to him there's no way to get comfortable with that loaded-down belt on. Well, after a while, an old-timey cartridge belt and holster gets old too.
I don't know why they would as legislatures seem to pass some really strange laws sometimes- some of which look like somebody got bored- but since it was brought up, I just try to take a more objective look at any given issue than it seems most other posters in such a thread as this seem to take.
Why would I want this enacted? I don't. I'm not one way or the other about it. You just made the mistake of thinking I do.
Right about it just being a piece of metal meaning nothing by itself. But there was a time, as I understand it, when even Wells Fargo agents had badges for whatever reason. Badges have been issued to a variety of people for a variety of reasons. Without credentials, like you said, it means nothing. That's why in another post I said if this were ever mandated the badge would be in the same wallet deal with the other CCW ID.
I don't recall seeing where anybody said it was a peace officer's commission. As I also said in another post, this issue is being confused with the issue of citizen's arrest which to my knowledge is legal. Oh, and before anybody says "the Georgia General Assembly changed the state constitution and outlawed it", I looked into that and it was the former Soviet Republic of Georgia and whatever they do don't count over here.
That part about a badge being carried in a separate wallet from personal business items and money- that's another thing I was getting at in another post. Now, whether anybody else- other than a cop- thought of that, I couldn't tell you. I agree about not wanting to be mistaken for a cop. I also know what you mean about having on the body armor and other force options.
All in all, I think we're closer to being on the same page as far as the downside to it. I just tend to try to look at both sides. I don't think that makes me a poser or wannabe. FWIW, my brother-in-law has been known to wear his black "SECURITY" cap out and around with us at times when he's not working security. It looks dopey. Contrast that with any badge being carried in a separate wallet and not shown unless absolutely necessary. I'd bet you don't show your badge off-duty unless you have to either. In that case, you're saying the same thing I am.
But here's another thing, if this thread hasn't degenerated so far as for it to be lost... I've noticed in several other threads where somebody CCW'd and got outted because some insipid twit opened their mouth about "you have a gun; do something" when it wasn't called for. This seems to be a problem in general, whether we're talking about a private citizen CCW'ing or maybe in an off duty cop's case, something happens and somebody hollers "you're a cop; do something" so it winds up just like if the wrong people saw your police badge in line at the stop and rob.
This thread's getting tiresome.
BTW, I noticed Jamie C.'s comment about...
I just mentioned my brother-in-law... his dad owns the security company and I'm thinking he's an ex-cop. He said he hates to wear a duty belt. After an 8hr shift in a squad car, according to him there's no way to get comfortable with that loaded-down belt on. Well, after a while, an old-timey cartridge belt and holster gets old too.
I can see one reason, and only one reason to carry one of these.
That reason would be to cause a police officer to delay that second before shooting you because you're a non-uniform with a gun, pointing it at somebody else. That means you'd have it hidden unless you were in the situation where you're detaining a criminal using your firearm.
As we've seen happen several times, uniformed police will shoot even undercover police who are displaying a gun. I'm not sure any 'badge' would be big enough to overcome that.
That reason would be to cause a police officer to delay that second before shooting you because you're a non-uniform with a gun, pointing it at somebody else. That means you'd have it hidden unless you were in the situation where you're detaining a criminal using your firearm.
As we've seen happen several times, uniformed police will shoot even undercover police who are displaying a gun. I'm not sure any 'badge' would be big enough to overcome that.
shooter429
Member
Wanna Bee?
Shooter429
Shooter429
Aguila Blanca
Member
I do the same and I'm not an LEO. No, no badge, but I do have a home state CCW and a couple of non-res permits so I'm good in about 32 states. Aside from the problem of a goblin spotting a badge at a register, there's also the possibility of being caught with your guard down in a situation where you don't have time to react, or circumstances don't allow it. I don't care to hand over a wallet to a bad guy that contains several pretty, laminated pieces of plastic that all say "Shoot me now, I have a gun you might like." I carry the handgun permits in a badge-type wallet -- without the badge. If I go to the post office and leave the piece at home, the permit wallet stays at home too.Jeff White said:
Carl N. Brown
Member
Having the carry permit in a wallet style carrier
next to the concealed weapon holster (and carried
concealed with it) is the closest to common sense
I have seen suggested in any of these threads.
Metal badge implies an official law enforcement
officer, and carrying a badge as a civilian would confirm
that I am an idiot, and I would rather conceal that.
next to the concealed weapon holster (and carried
concealed with it) is the closest to common sense
I have seen suggested in any of these threads.
Metal badge implies an official law enforcement
officer, and carrying a badge as a civilian would confirm
that I am an idiot, and I would rather conceal that.
DoubleTapDrew
Member
As far as having something to show to responding LEOs, no thanks. Even if I'm holding a goblin at gunpoint, I'll hopefully have the dispatcher on the phone with my other hand making sure he/she gives the situation and my description to responding officers and holster/drop my gun when they arrive. I'm not about to whirl around with a badge in one hand and a gun in the other, flashing ANYTHING in their direction. If they want to know if you were legally carrying I have a feeling it would be a while after the fact, during questioning.
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