Glock "one-ups" Springfield's XD

[mattw]

I read an article in the new issue of Combat Handguns, the title was "180,000+ round Glock Torture Continutes!" or something like that. Bottom line is that a 15 year old Glock 17 has had 180,000+ rounds through it with NO failures of ANY kind. It was supposedly subjected to all the torture of the 20,000 round XD test and the original Glock Torture test (including 6 MONTHS at the bottom of the Pacific Ocean [i'm not sure if i believe that but it was printed...]).

Being an XD owner I can only wait and hope my XD hold up as well.

 

[orangeninja]

I would love to see that article. Say, wouldn't 6 months at the bottom of the pacific ocean kinda crush the gun? Perhaps it was not quite at "the bottom".

Personally I am an XD owner and have had several Glocks. Of the 3 XD's I have purchased NOT ONE has had a failure of any kind. Of the 3 Glocks I have purchased, I had exactly ONE, that would suffer from light hits on the primer.

My vote stays with the XD. There are somethings more important than how many times I can run over it with an SUV, like grip angle, ergonomics, trigger, metal sights, lifetime warranty, etc.

 

[tc300mag1]

I think there botom of the ocean is more like 6 foot was the article written by chuck taylor per chance

 

[mattw]

yes, Chuck Taylor was the Author of that article. (btw, the bottom of the pacific does not exactly mean the bottom of marianas trench.)

 

[Boats]

You could put a 1911 in white metal at the bottom of six feet of saltwater for a comparable time and come away with nothing more than some cosmetic blemishes. The Titanic still has structural integrity not to collapse totally after 80 years in the depths of the Atlantic. SIX MONTHS is not impressive, lest one think the ocean is some sort of reservoir of fast acting metal eating acid.

These torture tests simply amount to hucksterism for pistols that have no real combat pedigree.

I'll judge my personal XD by how it performs for me. Still waiting on a failure of any kind after 1200 or so rounds.

 

[Sir Aardvark]

I'm waiting for a .45ACP XD - then I can retire my Glock 30 from CCW duty.

 

[JOE MACK]

Sir Aardvark said

I'm waiting for a .45ACP XD - then I can retire my Glock 30 from CCW duty

You don't have to wait for the .45ACP. I've got 2500 rounds through my XD service model (4 inch) in .45GAP and haven't had one problem. It's ergonomic, accurate, and reliable.

 

[orangeninja]

"These torture tests simply amount to hucksterism for pistols that have no real combat pedigree."

Agreed, I shudder to think of the "combat" weapon with standard PLASTIC sights.

 

[mattw]

These torture tests simply amount to hucksterism for pistols that have no real combat pedigree.

This is true. I think its cool to see how much a weapon can withstand and still hold up to its NIB expectations, though.

 

[Ivy Mike]

No combat pedigree huh?

Why do I see so many police departments issuing Glocks without combat pedigree over the "tried and true" 1911 and 80+ years of military service?

When the guys who carry guns for real in my city get a sidearm, its a Glock 17 or 19.

 

[scubie02]

No combat pedigree huh?

Why do I see so many police departments issuing Glocks without combat pedigree over the "tried and true" 1911 and 80+ years of military service?

When the guys who carry guns for real in my city get a sidearm, its a Glock 17 or 19.

because any monkey can just pull a trigger on a glock? And they are cheap? too much--its like a synthetic stocked hunting rifle.

There's nothing wrong with the glock--if I were a cop I'd probably want something like a glock or xd or some other plastic gun just because I could abuse and whack it on things or whatever and not really care. Its like a hammer. Whereas my 1911's...well, they are serious guns too, but they are also works of art--would hate to bung one all up. But I suppose I could just get a milspec and not worry about it too much.

Anyway, so many cops get issued glocks because they are cheap, and easy enough for even the dullest knife in the drawer to use for the most part. Don't confuse this with being the best tool for the job necessarily. You honestly believe the impala would be alot of cops first choice for a cop car?

On a side note--doesn't the austrian military probably use them?

 

[dolanp]

Even if a 1911 was cheap enough to be issued, I still doubt cops would want to walk around with that much weight on them. Not to mention the lower capacity. There's just no practicality when cops can use good defense loads unlike the military. If you are limited to ball ammo, then the .45 makes more sense.

 

[Rockstar]

Boats: I hereby challenge you to take a 1911 "in-the-white" and spray a little salt water on it and give us a picture taken 24 hrs. later. Your assertion that a 1911 or ANY in-the-white weapon submerged for 6 months in salt water would show no rust damage is silly. I can guarantee you that most of the springs and internal parts of a Glock that'd been under salt water for six months would be rusted. A 1911 subjected to the same treatment would be a pretty ugly paperweight.

Maybe you should do a little reading on the subject of the Titanic. Bad analogy. Wanna take a guess as to why corrosion is minimal at 15,000 ft or so? Hint: Oxygen content of the water.

 

[Boats]

Oxygen content is what is really at issue here. It is a simple fact of life that oxidation over six months via immersion is not going to corrode a 1911 into uselessness. It is not nearly enough time is all.

Iron + water+ oxygen= iron oxide. Salt accelerates that process. However, six months is not really enough time in the dissolved oxygen content of water to really structurally harm the pistol or its components, only sufficient to cosmetically make some surface rust.

So your "spraying a little salt water on it" is just plain silly. Air is much better as a catalyst for iron oxide to form than is continuous immersion in even salt water. And what of it? Were I to spray a little salt water on untreated carbon steel what you'd see is some surface rust, not penetrating corrosion indicative of impending structural failure.

Six months is just not enough time to do fatal damage.

 

[Bobby Lee]

Boats: I hereby challenge you to take a 1911 "in-the-white" and spray a little salt water on it and give us a picture taken 24 hrs. later. Your assertion that a 1911 or ANY in-the-white weapon submerged for 6 months in salt water would show no rust damage is silly.

I agree. I may put that in my list of the top ten BS posts I have ever seen on an internet board.

Salt water spray will rust in the white steel very quickly and it would not take very long for an unfinished 1911 or any machine made from in the white steel to become a worthless hunk of junk.

 

[Ash]

Bobby, salt water spray might, but salt water under water is another matter. It is apples to oranges.

Or, put it this way. Years ago, Masterlocks would show their lock shot by a rifle and still hold. This was true, you could shoot a Masterlock with a rifle and it would remain closed. However, a pair of pliers and a hammer will open a Blue Lable Masterlock without a key and without any damage to the lock. The end result was that the rifle bullet demonstration really has very little to do with the quality of a Masterlock. Sure, a polymer pistol won't rust. But take a blow torch to a polymer pistol and then a 1911. Take a saw blade and you'll discover that Glock can't handle nearly the cutting force that a 1911 can. Do these things indicate a Glock is weak?

Ash

 

[Boats]

What is with the spray obsession? Immersion retards the rusting process, which requires the iron molecules to surrender electrons to oxygen molecules, which are more free to react at the edges of water droplets exposed to air than in any other form. My criticism is not that the 1911 in such condition won't rust into a lump, but that it will not do so in a scant six months underwater when not continuously exposed to air.

It is becoming more and more understandable why these bunk torture tests work as marketing when it is clear that many people can't tell they're being taken for a ride.

 

[gbelleh]

It's a good thing Glock didn't try the torture test with the Glock 36 I used to have. They wouldn't have gotten past round 88 before the recoil spring assembly broke apart, damaging the frame and seriously jamming up the gun. And my gun was no where near the ocean!

Nothing is perfect. Shoot what you like.

 

[45auto]

I haven't read the article, but does anyone really believe that any handgun can go 180,000 rounds without ANY failure, not one?

Not one part broke, not one jam?

Probably still shoots 1" at 50 yards too!

 

[mattw]

I haven't read the article, but does anyone really believe that any handgun can go 180,000 rounds without ANY failure, not one?

Nothing was said in the article about replacing certain key parts on a timley basis and cleaning it probably every 1,000 rounds and i believe the article refered to mechanical failures due to the glock, not the ammo. I'm sure it jammed up on a few nasty reloads, or it was never fed reloads, you'll have to ask Chuck Taylor.... Also, it was 2" at 25 meters.

 

[dolanp]

*yawn*

We'll never know for sure which is best until we can do a torture test on the moon. Until then all arguments are moot!

 

[mattw]

I know that you're just joking but that wouldn't work right? No oxygen on the moon for the powder to burn? Or is the oxygen inside the casing enough?

 

[MICHAEL T]

SAW +Glock= May be the problem is ChuckTaylor is not getting enough oxygen to HIS brain He is getting old.

 

[Ivy Mike]

because any monkey can just pull a trigger on a glock? And they are cheap? too much--its like a synthetic stocked hunting rifle.

There's nothing wrong with the glock--if I were a cop I'd probably want something like a glock or xd or some other plastic gun just because I could abuse and whack it on things or whatever and not really care. Its like a hammer. Whereas my 1911's...well, they are serious guns too, but they are also works of art--would hate to bung one all up. But I suppose I could just get a milspec and not worry about it too much.

Anyway, so many cops get issued glocks because they are cheap, and easy enough for even the dullest knife in the drawer to use for the most part. Don't confuse this with being the best tool for the job necessarily. You honestly believe the impala would be alot of cops first choice for a cop car?

On a side note--doesn't the austrian military probably use them?

While anyone can fire a Glock, I'd imagine that a 1911, with only one more control isn't that hard to touch off either. Yes they are inexpensive, but thats part of the attraction. When issuing, you want the best gun possible for the money you are going to spend. A low capacity, heavy, single action 1911 is not the gun of choice.

A gun does not need steel and wood to be a good gun. In fact, you'll notice that the AR platform has been soldiering on through the better part of 40 years now with plastic and all.

I would hardly call the 1911 a work of art. It is simply a tool. A means of propeeling a little piece of copper and lead at high velocity. The glock does this just as well as a 1911. In fact, some would claim they do it better. Again, you act like it takes a degree to use a 1911.
While police departments and militaries do take cost into consideration, they also want good quality for the money.
A glock stands above a 1911 for a few reasons.

Both guns fire bullets reliably
The Glock holds more, has a lower bore axis, has thousands upon thousands of hours of use with PD's and military forces around the world.
The Glock IS the new 1911. It is simple and it works well.
I'll betcha more than a few US soldiers would be happy to carry Glocks around instead of the Beretta's they got.

 

[Sulaco]

Wow, even threads that don't have anything to do with 1911's get turned into "1911's are better than Glocks" threads by the same morons over and over again.