Gun show incident - Opinions?

[ArmedBear]

People are free to dress as they please, and as said by several other members here, you can be wrongly judged by your appearance.

Yeah. And anyone who doesn't know that he/she is sized up based on appearance is an idiot. "Sized up" is different from "judged".

If someone isn't a gangbanger, but takes pains to look like one, that's his conscious choice, and it says something about him.

Too many are quick to jump on a bandwagon.

Since the old one has gotten boring, here's a new bandwagon:

If you go to a gun show, you do see a few different "classes" of people, on both sides of the table. They're remarkably easy to identify, by and large.

Like the guy with the shaved head, Doc Martens with red laces, and a big swastika tat, he's a skinhead. The dealer selling junk guns to young, uninformed buyers for twice their value, he's a scumbag. The guys with $500 shoes on, their wives think they're somewhere else, and they're looking for expensive rare collectibles. The guys in t-shirts they got free at a Microsoft dog and pony show in their late 20s and early 30s, they're single and they're looking to buy $2500 black rifles they'll never shoot. On and on it goes.

Gun shows are more interesting for people watching than buying guns. You may be right, but there are reasons why people "jump on the bandwagon" with gunshow stories. It's usually because we've been to gun shows.

 

[xcgates]

Well that explains it, aside from the Mass one, I've only been to rural NY ones, where the dudes sit there chewing, and tallking smack to everyone they've known for their entire lives.

Guess you high-life city slickers are more complicated.

(Think I stereotyped enough? I can do more if needed. )

 

[mgmorden]

The guys in t-shirts they got free at a Microsoft dog and pony show in their late 20s and early 30s, they're single and they're looking to buy $2500 black rifles they'll never shoot. On and on it goes.

And you finally got to me. I'm late 20's, work in Information Technology, and wear a decent amount of promo t-shirts from Microsoft, AMD, HP, Ubuntu, Fedora, etc.

I'm neither single, nor do I go to a gun show looking for "$2500 black guns". I typically like bolt actions, and I don't do synthetic stocks except on my duck hunting shotguns (not to mention the most I've ever spent on a gun is around $700).

Your stereotype was off the mark, as stereotypes usually are. You get to sit back and smuggly judge (and yes, it is judging, not "sizing up" or any other euphemism you might think of) others thinking you're right, but with no verification whatsoever. As they say, don't ASSume anything.

A sane person isn't walking around paranoid at all times about trying to look like a gansta, or a nerd, or a redneck, or a biker, or any other stereotype others might throw their way. They dress how they want because that's them. If the knuckledraggers want to jump to conclusions without knowing anything about them, then that's their problem.

 

[heavyshooter]

it´s openly played racism.

Since it has already been said, I have nothing to add to the thread. Both the gunshow dealer's behavior and the wording used in the OP are most disappointing.

 

[ArmedBear]

Seriously, a gun show in a big city, especially one with a diverse array of lowlife subcultures, mixed with yuppies and older money, is an interesting experience, and well worth having.

 

[ArmedBear]

As they say, don't ASSume anything.

LOL

I believe that I can reasonably assume that you have roughly the same sense of humor as a block of granite.

"Paranoid" is also when you're so worried about what people think of your free t-shirt, that you don't even recognize a joke when you see it, and you think that everyone else is a "knuckledragger", too stupid to ever be kidding.

Ah, IT. Some of the people in this field are the most creative, fun and intelligent people you'll ever have the privilege of working with. And some are just unbearable, arrogant savants who think that everyone in the world is an idiot.

 

[Blackhawk30]

I wouldn't buy anything from that dealer.if he would dime out the gangstas,he'll dime out anyone.A lot of gun dealers have junior agent mentality.They want to get in good with the cops.In case they have problems in the future.
When you buy a gun keep the conversation to a minimum.Negotiate on the price or not and I'll take it is all you should be talking about.

 

[sig220mw]

When I got my dealer's license (which years later now, I no longer have) the BATF agent that approved my application told me to always remember that I was not obligated to sell to anyone that my gut feeling told me not to sell to.

 

[Ala Dan]

All I can add, a THUG is a THUG anytime, any where; day or night~!

You gott'a look out for 'em, cuz they are watching you~!

 

[Gouranga]

People are free to dress as they please, and as said by several other members here, you can be wrongly judged by your appearance.

This I would partially agree with. You can dress how you see fit, it is the US. However, you can and will be judged by your appearance. When I was young I used to pretend that was not the way of things but it is. Like it or not, you walk like a duck and quack like a duck people will think you are a duck. If you walk like a thug and dress like a thug (even if you do it cause it is the cool thing to do), people are not going to think you are a choir boy. By cousin is the nicest kid you ever met, he has no criminal background (1 speeding ticket his whole life). He is a lead guitar in a death metal band. The tattoos, the stanky looking dreadlocks he has, the long goatee (like 4-5 inches) he looks rough. He is treated that way. So yes, how you look will impact how you are treated in life. It is a fact of life. I would guess that most folks whether consciously or not, do pick up on those visual cues, amongst other things.

It has nothing to do with classism. My buddy makes about 1/3 what I do and struggles to pay his day to day bills. He does not act trashy. It is the paycheck but the person. So when you come to a FFL whose livelihood is on the line with each sale, yeah he IS going to judge your appearance. Hopefully that is not where he stops but it will be a factor. Now you start asking about full auto conversions, and the nonsense those dudes were doing, he SHOULD shut the door on the sale right there.

Imagine 6 months down the road, those guys change the gun to a FA, and go on a shootout and kill 3 cops and a couple bystanders. Imagine now, when they trace the gun back to the dealer, find the cop and reads his report which has the dealers statement on what the guys said. and they the wave of lawyers who will sue him out of existence. That is just looking beyond the guilt he has to feel about the death that occurred in part because he could not so "No".

The dealer took the cash and set them up.

 

[redbullitt]

He should have refused to sell to them after speaking with them. NOT based on their appearance, but on their shady actions.
Simple. Effective.
Setting up the trap is drawing on lots of assumptions that may seem like a good idea, but could ultimately be in error.
I am not a fan of his false carry information, but as was said, they expressed interest in obvious criminal activity.
I think he chose to sell to them and trap them to get the cash AND cover his conscience. The best outcome he could come up with that helped him out the most. Cash is tight now, can't honestly say I would not have considered the same.
Sticky situation indeed.

 

[Vonderek]

I only learned one thing from this round-and-round-we-go thread...how I got callouses on my knuckles.

 

[Sam1911]

Never judge a book by its cover and whatever you do, never mistrust you insticts!

Report all suspicious activity but don't be a snitch.

Don't be one of those gangsta, hillbilly, yuppie, type hairy knuckle-dragging girly men who make offensive jokes and have NO sense of humor.

And don't mention racial profiling, classism, sexism, ageism, ableism, wrongism, rightism, upism, downism, or organisms on a gun forum.