Gunman at church, what would you do?

[justin 561]

My vote was for getting wife and family out, then return.

 

[george29]

I no longer attend or belong to organized religious services, God is everywhere and IMO church is just another social event and as such is prone to any occurrence where the masses gather, including your scenerio. Because it has happened in the past, it will continue to happen in thge future. I commend 6you for being armed where most people choose to rely on fate. I chose the second option for legal purpoes mainly, for how else could I prove intent? Personally, I would expect a church to post armed guards just as we saw in that last church attack where the female volunteer guard shot the perp OUTSIDE the church.

 

[another okie]

Some years ago the youth group of a church put on a "surprise skit" in which the storyline was that a tyrannical government had banned religion. The start of the "skit" was a group of them walking in carrying rifles. I hope they don't try that nowadays. But after what those stupid educators did in California with the fake DUI deaths, I would believe anything.

 

[CountGlockula]

Not sure. Instincts and adrenaline are unpredictable.

I'd first make sure my wife and child are safe, then fire upon to stop the threat.

If the bad guy dies, then a prayer for his soul for God's mercy.

 

[psyopspec]

I'd have the same reaction to a man menacingly brandishing an assault rifle in church as I would to a man menacingly brandishing an assault rifle in a gas station, or a school, or my home.

Whether I'd shoot or not is a separate question, and the answer would depend completely upon my read of the armed man in question.

 

[FLA2760]

Send him to hell via hollowpoints. He would not expect a fight.

 

[roo_ster]

In sum, there is myself, my wife, and two toddlers ages 2 & 3 with minds of their own. Running is not an option, IOW.

We sit in the second-to-last row with either myself or my wife on the aisle. We would be either among the first killed or the goblin would give us his back, as he made his way toward the altar.

The way the church is laid out, I would likely would have to go out in to the center aisle and go to a knee to keep fellow parishioners from being my backstop.

Do-able if I am on the aisle. A regular effing mess if I am deeper in the pew.

 

[Hardtarget]

I voted "shoot first". All the reasons have been posted. I do like the "lock the doors" ...a lot.

Mark.

 

[Keegan]

I might opine that someone who walks into a church with an AR is dangerously aggressive.

Point taken, and I would treat your typical armed intruder as a dangerous aggressor. The person I had in mind that might not require a lead deterrent is someone that is perhaps not pointing the gun at anyone, or is a known parishioner who is upset. I just don't want to say that I would start shooting outright, because I'm sure there are situations in which I would not.

 

[Treo]

just as we saw in that last church attack where the female volunteer guard shot the perp OUTSIDE the church

Actually the New Life Church shooter made it into the church and was shot in just down the hall from the main sanctuary, where there were literally thousands of people

TO THOSE WHO ARE PASTORS :
God has put you over that church have you implemented a security plan ? have you decided yes/no to armed security?
Maybe this could be a stand alone thread

 

[jfrey]

Church situation

I always sit on the "Baptist row" in church, the last or next to last row, on the outside isle, and have run this situation through my mind several times. If the shooter was to pass me up and get in front, too bad for him. The only police officer I know of in our church sits way up front and from the way he normally dresses, he ain't armed. Most of the "greeters" are a bunch of old guys that I doubt could fend off a real attack. I go prepared to protect myself and family first and the rest later.

 

[Eightball]

It's near impossible to guess without seeing everything, but here's the thing--occasionally, I've heard of churches around here using guns to illustrate a point. I.E, one church a few years back, the pastor, to start off a series of sermons, pulled a gun and fired a blank in the air, to illustrate "THERE! That's how long it took for your life to end," and went with his sermon from there. A church could use a "gunman" to illustrate a different point. Not the smartest idea, but if you fire on him before he fires on you.....bad things could happen.

Just thought I'd point that out.

 

[soccergod04]

I said "other". This is why I don't go to church!

Just kidding, but I don't go to church, so the question for me is what to do if I get woken up in my bed during church hours.

 

[mpmarty]

Other

If he got past me as I sat in the back row on an aisle seat, I'd quietly make sure he had no backup and then slip out behind him. If he pointed the weapon at anyone (rather than carrying at port arms) I'd yell as I took up the slack on my 45 auto and if he began to turn he'd catch one in the back of the head. After all, how far can he be for a head shot if I'm sneaking up behind him?

 

[Ragnar Danneskjold]

I don't have a family, and in the face of that kind of situation, my own life doesn't rank to high on my concern list. So I would do what needed to be done.

 

[Kosh75287]

OTHER:

Break leather, tell him to disarm, and do my damnedest to KILL him if he made a move that could be interpretted as ANYthing but disarming
.

 

[jackdanson]

Illegal to carry in a church in MO... I would curl up in a ball and be shot horribly.

 

[bwavec]

I knew there were other good excuses as to why I haven't been to church in a long, long time.............

 

[bsf]

If I had them, wife and daughter would be more important to me than everyone else in the church combined, assuming other family was not there. My first duty would be to my family. Getting my family to safety would be 1000x more important to me than preventing the gunmen from opening up on everyone else.

 

[Hook686]

I answered 'Other' ... see a good shrink.

 

[shootemup]

I'm one of those on stage during our services. Not the Pastor, but one of the staff.

There are 15-16 of us who carry every service every Sunday. And we also have greeters stationed at every door. We have security guards who walk the church (unarmed) so we are it in the event of an armed assault.

We have discussed this among ourselves, and have code words based on current tactical techniques that we would use if necessary. And we have asignments for all the entrances (12 altogether).

Having said that, I would have to evaluate the situation in 5 seconds or less. And since I am the guy who can see all the exits, I am the one to call the situation. My fellow armed parishoners should respond based on what I see, or on what they see if they have better perspective than me.

And if the shooting begins outside the worship center, we would all head to the scene of the confrontation, weapons at the ready.

We have each had to deal with whether we could pull the trigger, probably ending a life that God sees as precious, and condemning that person to an eternity separated from God (evangelical beliefs.... no flames, please!). That is the difficult decision for me.

My rationale- if that person could physically harm someone in my family our our congregation, he has already made the choice to take the risk of his life and his eternity. If he comes in with an AR, his choice is made.

 

[Clipper]

Watch the whole thing on TV. I'm an agnostic.

Took the words out of my mouth, so to speak...

 

[SRT1]

I head up an armed security team at my church (we are "run" by the elder board and even get a nice break on inusrance for having such a team). We have our men posted at each entrance to the church from the time the doors open to the time the last people leave. During normal worship times, the doors are locked but may be opened from the inside which is what our "greeters" do for late arrivals. If there is someone in any way suspicious, one of the two man team on the main entrance meets the person OUTSIDE the church with the second team member standing behind the locked door observing. We all have radio communication with ear bud speaker/microphone setups to keep it low key, but notcieable to anyone watching. Stopping a problem BEFORE it happens is the preferred way to do it. We have a one touch alert signal on these radios that will bring everyone on the team if activated. For suspicious activities, radio communication is made and the members make a more under the radar approach. We have run into a couple of situations in which just the fact that there were 1, then 2, then 3 people in the door watching outward has discouraged people that were acting suspiciously on church property. Of course the line is fine between being welcoming as we want people to come in and worship freely, and being a deterrant to people who have bad intentions. We want to protect our people and keep them from having to worry about the "what if's" while they are worshipping. We train, and train some more to make that a reality as much as we can.
Good luck!
SRT

 

[doc2rn]

I am my brothers keeper! Enough said.

 

[TexasSkyhawk]

For those that would fire first, consider this--

What if this "gunman" were part of the pastor's sermon? Our pastor gets a little tricky now and then (we're a non-denominational church that is NOT a traditional "dress in your Sunday-go-meetin' clothes, listen to the choir, etc). He often has props, seemingly impromptu demonstrations, and some congregation interaction.

I'd sure hate to cap the new associate minister that was being introduced and who was using an (unloaded) AR15 to make an analogy about how "The Bible is your weapon against the Devil just as this AR is your weapon against mortal enemies."

Or something like that. . .

Being an ex-cop type person, I'd have zero problem standing up with my weapon in hand and pointed at the guy and bellowing, "DROP IT AND RIGHT NOW OR YOU'RE DEAD!"

Anyone who is in the "right" or part of a "play acting" scenario, etc, will stop, drop the weapon and start trying to explain. Anyone who is intent on harming others, will react accordingly and try to get some shots off--and I WILL shoot the SOB dead.

Probably no better place for him to die than in the middle of a church.

Jeff