I'm guessing it's a good thing you wrote that first sentence.Most people have no idea what they're talking about, especially when it comes to technical information. I have no idea if 296 and 110 are the same powder nowadays but I strongly doubt it. To prove me wrong though you'd have to show me the chemical formula for each and proof that they were made at the same plant and simply relabeled by their company.
The last I heard all Winchester powder is manufactured at their plant in St. Marks Fla. and Hodgdon powder can be from several places but not from the St. Marks plant so the chances of them being the same is pretty slim since they are made in two different plants. The confusion probably comes from the fact that Hodgdon is licensed by Olin to use the Winchester name on some of their powders which probably confused some people in to thinking that Hodgdon is using Winchester's powder and simply naming it H110.
Most people have no idea what they're talking about, especially when it comes to technical information. I have no idea if 296 and 110 are the same powder nowadays but I strongly doubt it. To prove me wrong though you'd have to show me the chemical formula for each and proof that they were made at the same plant and simply relabeled by their company.
The last I heard all Winchester powder is manufactured at their plant in St. Marks Fla. and Hodgdon powder can be from several places but not from the St. Marks plant so the chances of them being the same is pretty slim since they are made in two different plants. The confusion probably comes from the fact that Hodgdon is licensed by Olin to use the Winchester name on some of their powders which probably confused some people in to thinking that Hodgdon is using Winchester's powder and simply naming it H110.
Notice that Mr. Hodgdon says that W296 and H110 and a couple other powders are "virtually" the same thing "or" the same thing.
A letter from Hodgdon is a bit more than "third party heresay" to almost everyone. It's not Internet rumor: H110 is 296. And 231 is HP-38. 748 probably has a doppelgänger in a Hodgdon can too. It all comes out of the same factory now.I always wonder about people that have to start a disagreement by being rude. Sorry, but I didn't get the memo on these powders being the same - besides you still haven't proven a thing and third party hearsay isn't factual data.
I did find a good video of an interview with Chris Hodgdon wherein he "seems" to say that H110 and W296 are the same powder (around the 53:20 minute mark in the video) but did he really say that?
Notice that Mr. Hodgdon says that W296 and H110 and a couple other powders are "virtually" the same thing "or" the same thing. Then the interviewers follow up by asking (at 53:45) if these powders are the same thing then why are they made by different companies and Mr. Hodgdon says because of customers have brand loyalty. My point is that Mr. Hodgdon agrees that these powders are being made at different facilities, which means that they are NOT coming from the same spigot. They may have the same formulation but they aren't being made by one supplier.
Like most Internet rumor I feel that this whole argument comes from poor communication skills, people hear what they want to hear and not necessarily what was actually said. I suspect that what the factory reps and others in the industry are doing is taking a short cut to save time by saying that these powders are the same because it's much faster and easier than to get in to a long drawn out explanation about how powder is made and where.
Regardless, I've used both since the late 1970s and simply tune the load when I switch to a different lot number.
Just for your records, there are a handful of Hodgdon powder which are identical to Winchester powders. These are the powders I'm sure of, there may be more.For giggles and grins, add to your list:
W760 is H414
AA2230 is Ramshot Xterminator
I always wonder about people that have to start a disagreement by being rude. Sorry, but I didn't get the memo on these powders being the same - besides you still haven't proven a thing and third party hearsay isn't factual data.
I did find a good video of an interview with Chris Hodgdon wherein he "seems" to say that H110 and W296 are the same powder (around the 53:20 minute mark in the video) but did he really say that?
Notice that Mr. Hodgdon says that W296 and H110 and a couple other powders are "virtually" the same thing "or" the same thing. Then the interviewers follow up by asking (at 53:45) if these powders are the same thing then why are they made by different companies and Mr. Hodgdon says because of customers have brand loyalty. My point is that Mr. Hodgdon agrees that these powders are being made at different facilities, which means that they are NOT coming from the same spigot. They may have the same formulation but they aren't being made by one supplier.
Like most Internet rumor I feel that this whole argument comes from poor communication skills, people hear what they want to hear and not necessarily what was actually said. I suspect that what the factory reps and others in the industry are doing is taking a short cut to save time by saying that these powders are the same because it's much faster and easier than to get in to a long drawn out explanation about how powder is made and where.
Regardless, I've used both since the late 1970s and simply tune the load when I switch to a different lot number.
For years (maybe still) OMC continued making the exact same outboard motors and putting either a Johnson or Evinrude cowel on it before shipping them to their respective dealers.Okay, you made me watch the video you referred to. Chris Hodgdon DID NOT say the two powders (110 / 296) were manufactured a different facilities. The INTERVIEWER said that and said he ASSUMED that. Hodgdon went on to say they keep the powders separate under the two brands (Hodgdon & Winchester) due to "brand loyalty", which does make some sense.
They are the same powders as he said HP 238 / 231 are.
You owe me about 12 minutes of my life back. By the way 760 and 414 are the same also. Go look that one up. I'm not going to prove it to you.
The current data is identical so I'm not sure how to use different data. Add the fact not all sources list both, you would have to use what they list even if it's not the same label on the bottle.macgrumpy,
Just use Hodgdon's H110 data when using H110 and their 296 data when using 296 and you will be perfectly fine.
The current data is identical so I'm not sure how to use different data. Add the fact not all sources list both, you would have to use what they list even if it's not the same label on the bottle.