Hornady 44Mag Factory Small Pistol Primer

[Mr.Revolverguy]

Someone please tell me my eyes are playing tricks on me. I purchased some Hornady 44mag Factory rounds fired them and they were a blast

I go to reload the once fired brass and none of my large pistol primers would fit.
Winchester LP
CCI LP
Tula LP

I started looking at the cases and thought this can't be right let me look at these things under the magnifying glass. Sure enough small pistol primer pockets. I know many started this with 45ACP but with 44Mag CMON.

Usually any day at the bench reloading is a great day but having these hang up my Hornady LnL AP was a pain in the :banghead:

The Hornady seem to be small pistol primer pockets the ones on the bottom worked just fine.

This is what the primer looks like after seating it with a hand primer with two handed force. On the press it won't seat feels like something is going to break. I knew this was dangerous but I had to make sure, I was wearing thick work gloves, eye protection and ear protection when I did this with the hand primer.

 

[ReloaderFred]

I guess the first question is why did you try to force a large primer into a small primer pocket? It would have been simpler to satisfy your curiosity by seating a small primer and you wouldn't have to wear all the protective gear.

You'll also find small primered 10mm brass, and there may come a time when other calibers also get switched over to all one size. The manufacturers don't consult with us reloaders before they make a change in their process.......

Hope this helps.

Fred

 

[Cheesemaker]

Made me go and check a recent purchase of new Hornady 44 Mag brass. LP here. I am surprised that there is 44 Mag SP brass.

Do you have a pic of the box they came in? The headstamp looks different to my new brass (yours has "fatter" print)...

 

[CLP]

Probably lead free, non toxic stuff. At least that's why there's SP 45ACP. What puzzles me is why not make a non toxic, lead free Large Primer and stay with what's been the standard for 50+yrs, or much longer even in the case of the 45acp

 

[Mr.Revolverguy]

These cases came from Factory 240gr XTP Mag.

 

[noylj]

Did you measure the primer pockets or seat a small primer and find that it actually seated tight?
Fast check is just to drop a spent small primer in the pocket and see if it falls in (large primer pocket) or actually needs to be seated (small primer pocket).
Why not call Hornady and ask what they are doing and let us know.

 

[Mr.Revolverguy]

Small primer does go in tight.

It is not a big deal no need for me to call Hornady it just ticked me off, surprised me. I only had 20 of these cases mixed in with my 44 Mag brass. As already been noticed all the ones with small primer pockets had fatter print. I do have some Hornady brass with smaller print that has the large primer pocket.


So the fix to me was easy, take my RCBS trim mate case prep military crimp remover and cut the primer pocket open. Then use my rcbs large primer pocket uniformer. Now theses cases fit large pistol primers nice and tight and all of them fired and set off Alliant 2400.

I think Manufacturers should put this sort of thing on their boxes. Example loaded with LP or SP something like that.

 

[greyling22]

I think the time is coming that all handgun brass will be loaded with small primers.

 

[OilyPablo]

VERY interesting. What did Hornady say when you asked them?

 

[buck460XVR]

I think the time is coming that all handgun brass will be loaded with small primers.

Wouldn't matter to me as long as they don't start using proprietary sized primers so we can't reuse their factory brass.

 

[Reloadron]

While not fancy just use your calipers to do an ID measurement of the primer cup. Large pistol should be about 0.2085 to 0.2100. Small pistol will be around 0.1730 to 0.1745 making it relatively easy to figure what you have.

Ron

 

[mdemetz]

Also check used 44M(and 357m) brass from Hornady. If it is from their LEVERevolution® ammo, it is trimmed short.

 

[buck460XVR]

Also check used 44M(and 357m) brass from Hornady. If it is from their LEVERevolution® ammo, it is trimmed short.

Same goes for the old 200gr SST in .460.

 

[Mr.Revolverguy]

I couldn't help myself and called Hornady today. They said more than likely this brass was a special order/load for a company that wanted 44mag loaded with small pistol magnum.

 

[Reloadron]

I couldn't help myself and called Hornady today. They said more than likely this brass was a special order/load for a company that wanted 44mag loaded with small pistol magnum.

Why would the primers be small pistol magnum? Doesn't the powder used determine if a magnum or standard primer is used? Small pistol magnum or small pistol standard are the same diameter primer correct? I don't think that the name 44 Magnum implies the use of a magnum primer anymore than .357 Magnum requires the use of a magnum primer. Did you ever measure the diameter of the primer pockets?

Ron

 

[Mr.Revolverguy]

Ron,

What Hornady was talking about is they will make special runs for distributors from time to time and the only other primer they have use in 44mag is small pistol magnum.

 

[Bula]

Those would get tossed into the recycle bin. Luckily, I have plenty of brass in the calibers I shoot. I used to keep .45 acp SPP range pickups segregated. I soon realized it wasn't worth the trouble. Thank goodness I'm a brass hoarder. You'd think the retooling wouldn't be worth their time, guess I was wrong.

 

[Mr.Revolverguy]

Bula,

You make a great point about retooling and the impact to the reloading industry as a whole. Meaning you can read here all the time about substituting primers and most all will get varied responses but most say do not do it. Well what will going to all small primers would do to all of the reloading manuals we have.

I know start low and work your way up but financially I would think it would be a huge cost if the industry went this way.

 

[Reloadron]

Ron,

What Hornady was talking about is they will make special runs for distributors from time to time and the only other primer they have use in 44mag is small pistol magnum.

Yeah, and I found that interesting. Would love to have some small primer 308 Winchester brass. So Hornady will crank out brass for others as long I guess as you want a good bit. Pretty cool.

Thanks
Ron

 

[buck460XVR]

I couldn't help myself and called Hornady today. They said more than likely this brass was a special order/load for a company that wanted 44mag loaded with small pistol magnum.

But....I thought you said,

I purchased some Hornady 44mag Factory rounds fired them and they were a blast

...am I missing something? Did Hornady have some of the brass left over from the special order run and used it for their own loads?

 

[2zulu1]

Keep in mind that you can also use small rifle primers in SPP brass.

 

[mgmorden]

Just personally IMHO it'd be better if we switched everything to small pistol. Re-configuring the press or priming tools back and forth from one to the next is just annoying. During the transitional period sorting would be annoying but IMHO we should have started out with one primer size for all of them to start with and just stuck with it.

 

[Schwing]

I can only speak to .45ACP brass with small pistol primer pockets but I can tell you it makes no difference at all. I doubt it would in .44 either.

I am kind of torn on this one. I keep a small stash of the small primer .45 brass around. Back when primers were hit and miss, it was nice to have the option of using small primers when large were not available.

Having said that, it sucks to have to sort them. If it really turns out that most calibers have no performance variance between using small or large primers, it sure would be nice for new reloaders. For most of us who spent years gearing up for both...?

 

[Robert101]

I prefer familiarity in what has been consistent with the various calibers/cases. 44 mag has always been a large primer case. Let's keep it that way. What would be the reasons to change from this standard? Do we get better performance, more consistency? Someone (original designer) thought the larger primer was better for the cartridge, so why change now? I do realize that a small primer pocket can contribute to a stronger case at the base. But if you don't exceed it's design parameters that is a non-issue.

 

[horsemen61]

I would like to see it all standardized to one style