How Many Carry a 1911 with FMJ Ammo?

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Sharp

I don't foam at the mouth either over HP for .45s and often carry mine with 230 grn hardball. I am confident that my gun will function as designed and not worried that I don't have the latest and greatest MANSTOPPER bullet.
That being said I am not opposed to change and will probably purchase some of the ammo posted in this thread for my nines, and at some point in the future my 45s.
 
*IF* we had concealed carry in Illinois, I'd carry the 1911 in a heartbeat. My Springfield 1911 GI model (with walnut grips!) feeds my 185gr Golden Saber load perfectly. It is also consistently the highest velocity handgun I own in 45 ACP, out of 7 different models of 45's. Great barrel. :)

When I shoot the 1911 in competition shooting, I tend to be far more diligent to make my shots count more. Taking an extra shot on a Glock 21 to put one in the A ring or to drop a pin might cost me a .3 split. Having to RELOAD an extra time.. jeez. That's damn costly.

I highly doubt that in the cosmically-unlikely event I'd ever need to use a gun in self defense that I'll need more than 8 shots. This being said, I'm the crazy bastard that sleeps with a PS90 next to the bed... because you just never know. :)

As far as what you guys call "social work"? What the hell am I going to do with 13 rounds that I can't do with 8? If I'm up against more than 4 bad guys chances are I screwed up something fierce earlier in the decision making process and very likely deserve what I have coming to me. :)
 
Trent:
Sometimes it's not about you, and, you have no control over the situation.

For instance 3 huge guys decide to beat some white guy up. Why?
They get kicked out of a bowling alley, being drunk and high, by a white, skinny,
manager.

They come in a side door, see the only other white guy in the alley, follow him into the bathroom, and beat him over the head with a Walther PPKS.

I guess you could say that the person had control, in that he could have made the choice not to be there. That is the liberal position on firearms. Give up your freedom to be absolutely, pretty much safe, by not going into areas that have possible criminal behavior.

This place, Mel's bowling alley in Alemeda, Kali, is sort of a melting pot of people that come in and bowl there. A hate crime? Not likely, but, drugs and alcohol do strange things, and so do people when the drugs and alcohol are in control. Never caught the guys, either.
 
LCPor9mm said:
Now I may not be the rocket scientist you are, but even I can see those two statements are discribing two completely different actions.r
Click to expand...

Hey, you're catching on! The statements describe what can happen WITH the poly plug and WITHOUT the poly plug.

I also don't spend a lot of time in the kitchen with cookie cutters, but your analogy of hollow points punching out little discs of clothing that collect inside doesn't make any sense if your statement "The bullets use a polymer plug that prevents the hollow point from closing in on itself" is to be taken as fact.
Click to expand...

A bullet WITHOUT the poly plug will typically cut discs of fabric that collect in the hollowpoint, thereby likely affecting the expansion.

For me to attempt to explain further will only repeat what I've already posted.

If you want to learn more, I suggest rereading my previous posts and googling some videos showing the Critical Defense and Critical Duty ammo and ballistic gelatin testing.
 
The good news is you have a flat point bullet that works well, if it doesn't expand, in .45 caliber. Better then FMJ.
 
Nice try

A bullet WITHOUT the poly plug will typically cut discs of fabric that collect in the hollowpoint, thereby likely affecting the expansion.

For me to attempt to explain further will only repeat what I've already posted.

If you want to learn more, I suggest rereading my previous posts and googling some videos showing the Critical Defense and Critical Duty ammo and ballistic gelatin testing.

Great diversionary tactic David. Without explaining what you already posted you have brought up more useless information.
I will pass on rereading any of your previous posts, as I have done my own research and satisfied my curiosity, which is apparently what I should have done in the first place.
 
"...As far as what you guys call "social work"? What the hell am I going to do with 13 rounds that I can't do with 8?..."

You just never know. I recently read an account of a bad breath distance shootout between a cop and a bad guy. Cop had a Glock 21, bad guy had a Sig 220...It took 14rds with 7 hits to put the guy down, using CorBon 185gn +P...the cop changed to 230gn Gold Dot after the shooting. The cop ended the shooting on the ground with a hole through his leg. The bad guy, BTW survived. The cop was a 20yr vet and a SWAT team member with SWAT training...The entire shootout lasted between 5 and 10 SECONDS.
Here is a link, story starts on page 32...by Mas Ayoob:
http://fmgpublications.ipaperus.com/FMGPublications/AmericanHandgunner/AHMJ11/
 
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LCPor9mm said:
Great diversionary tactic David. Without explaining what you already posted you have brought up more useless information.
I will pass on rereading any of your previous posts, as I have done my own research and satisfied my curiosity, which is apparently what I should have done in the first place.
Click to expand...

Yes, you should've done your own research in the first place. If you had, maybe you wouldn't still be so dang confused. It wasn't a diversion, it was a valid suggestion since you seemed to keep struggling with understanding the information.

After my last post, I decided to see how hard it would be to find the information I was posting. Answer: about 7 seconds. I found a lot of information, including videos. Take a look and maybe you'll understand....or maybe not, but it's all I can do for you at this point.
 
Does a SWC with a large metplat have any bearing on this thread? Ooops, did I just say that?
 
Does a SWC with a large metplat have any bearing on this thread?
Click to expand...
Probably not while they are better than ball ammo for terminal wounding they are probably the most problematic design with reguard to feeding issues.
Of course when I carry my Goldcup (not often) that's what's in it.
 
United Soviet Socialist Republic(quite a handle, considering they were our enemies. Sorry I'm not politically correct.), how much actual testing have you done with this?
Steve
 
LCPor9mm wrote,
After an hour or two searching the internet for an explanation as to why hollow points don’t reliably expand. Here’s what I came up with:

Hollow points in the traditional sense rely on hydraulic pressure in the hollow cavity to expand. The designers have taken advantage of the fact that the human body is approximately 60% liquid. This expansion does not always take place if the cavity “fills up” with clothing because hydraulic pressure from the fluids in the body is required to “split” the bullet open. If the cavity is filled with enough clothing, the design pressures are not reached and the bullet doesn’t open.

The next type of “hollow point” isn’t really hollow at all. It has what Hornaday refers to as a flexible tip that compresses to open the cavity, preventing clogging and better controlling expansion by a means of what I like to call self contained hydraulics.
Click to expand...
LCPor9mm doesn't your research here confirm what DavidE has been saying? I'm not sure what your argument is?
 
I highly doubt that it is either as common as Hornady claims it is, or that their CD ammo is any more or less likely to expand through clothing than any other premium JHP ammo. It's not like everyone making bullets BEFORE this one assumed that they would be hitting naked people. I think Hornady largely invented the problem.
 
United Soviet Socialist Republic(quite a handle, considering they were our enemies. Sorry I'm not politically correct.), how much actual testing have you done with this?
Steve
Click to expand...

Hmm, Steve. You know what they say about those that "ASSume"? Oh, and with your false assumption, you even blew what you think it stands for.

Don
 
Considering most "bad guys" are running from you, spraying and praying, the chance of you getting off one shot is slim. Unless of course you get that shot off before the bad guy or guys start to run off!. Seems every gun fight gone bad I see on The First 48, or Cops or even read about starts and ends like that. I will say that it is about 90% possibility that if we here ever do have to use our gun in a firefight, it will be with someone trying a home invasion or a regular burglar or robber who doesn't have a gun.
 
Trent said:
What the hell am I going to do with 13 rounds that I can't do with 8? If I'm up against more than 4 bad guys chances are I screwed up something fierce earlier in the decision making process and very likely deserve what I have coming to me. :)
Click to expand...

Apparently you've never seen a gang of sloths hanging outside your local mall/mart, looking for a free lunch.
 
If there was an entire gang of 'sloths', and you decide to take them all on with a pistol, you won't have time to shoot all of your 12 or 15 rounds either. You will be outgunned, they will rush you, or when bullets start flying they will disperse.

We don't live in Melgibsonland where you routinely fire fifteen straight shots without a chance to reload. I strongly feel that rather than depend on a higher magazine capacity, you should be practicing reloads. Even your double-stack can jam.
 
Trent, where in Illinios are you? I'm right where I55 crosses rt. 116.
USSR, your choice of handles, not mine. Just a natural assumtion.
Steve
 
On another thought why do some assume because one carries a hi-cap pistol, they don't practice reloads?

You can bet most the sloths are carrying hi-cap. Who wants to reload before them but I do agree, it probably won't even get that far.

Hell, I don't always carry hi-cap but there is a comfort zone in doing so.....I've always been an advocate of less is more, with many things in life but certainly not when it comes to bullets....YMMV

Thread derail....I'll try and graciously back out now.
 
The whole argument just seems silly to me.

If your HP doesn't expand, you're no worse off than using FMJ.

If your gun doesn't feed HP's, it's broke. Either choose a different HP that it will feed, or get it fixed.
 
It's not like everyone making bullets BEFORE this one assumed that they would be hitting naked people. I think Hornady largely invented the problem.
Click to expand...

About 12 years ago, I was forced to shoot a fairly large, extremely aggressive dog. The 230-grain Federal Hydra Shok bullet passed through the dog lengthwise, and my walking companion found the bullet about 20 feet from the downed dog. It had apparently barely made it through, and skittered along the ground. If she hadn't seen it glint in the sunlight, I'd have never found it.

Aside from the rifling marks, it could have been reloaded and fired again.

That one made two over the course of 22 years. The other one was shot...also lengthwise through and through...with a 210-grain cast SWC loaded to a mv of about 1,000 fps. Neither animal stepped out of its tracks.
 
Good stuff, Tuner.

Many lose sight of the fact that it ain't the ammunition that's important: its what you hit with the ammunition that matters most.

It seems like an over-simplification, but it ain't.
 
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