Hypothetical Machine Gun Question

[blaisenguns]

Disclaimer: This is in no way based upon anything having to do with me or my family, merely a hypothetical situation.

Ok, let’s say that a guy’s grandfather purchased something like a Thompson 1928 model in the 1940s. I imagine this would be grandfathered in since it is before the NFA was passed. Now if the grandfather died, and was survived by his wife, who then gives the gun to her grandson, how should this be dealt with legally? I imagine if you did not get the proper permits BEFORE taking possession of the gun you would be in a world of trouble. I know the ATF looks down on you getting permitted after the fact.

 

[Derek Zeanah]

You can't add a machinegun to the registry.

There is no way to own it legally. Possession of it is illegal.

Hypothetically, the best recourse is to find a lawyer who deals with these issues and use him to help you broker turning this over to the ATF in a way that only costs you in terms of money (for legal fees), rather than prison.

 

[blaisenguns]

Could you convert it to semi?

 

[brickeyee]

Could you convert it to semi?

Nope.

The only thing you can do is donate it to a museum and take a tax write off.

It is illegal to have it.

PERIOD.

It can NEVER be made legal under the present laws/rules.

 

[BK]

grandfather purchased something like a Thompson 1928 model in the 1940s.

Unless it was purchased illegally or illegally converted to full auto, it would likely have been purchased legally and registered properly since it was 1934 when the NFA began regulating machineguns.

If it was purchased legally and registered properly after 1934, and the family simply has no records, documents or tax stamp, it may still be listed in the registry. You would want to contact a lawyer who is experienced in in this stuff so that he could contact the ATF to check the registry for that Thompson.

Also read this: http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=570018

Given the fact that a machinegun like that is worth tens of thousands of dollars, it would be wise to invest in the effort to find out if it is in fact listed in the NFA registry.

The receiver is technically the firearm. Even if the whole gun is disassembled down to every last little part, that receiver is still considered a machinegun. The other components of the Thompson are still quite valuable and could possibly be kept if the receiver is destroyed or surrendered to the authorities. Here's a complete Thompson parts set except for the receiver: http://www.winchesterway.com/class-3/1928a1-smg-partset

 

[Zoogster]

There was several amnesties to register new guns illegally owned after 1934.
They eventually stopped them because sometimes those that tried to register were prosecuted and so the Supreme Court ruled it unconstitutional as it required self-incrimination to comply with the law.

However there was also many allowed to register thier guns in the amnesties.

There was even some full auto AK-47s registered in the last amnesty in 1968 that were smuggled back from the Vietnam War.



Of course the bulk of guns brought back from WW2, Korea, or Vietnam were not registered.
Considering that WW2 vets are dropping quickly and even 18 year old recruits are well into thier 80s now and won't be around much longer I expect many are going to stumble upon Thompsons and similar items when they go to clear out Grandpa's possessions.

They cannot legally be registered or converted. They were illegal and remain illegal to possess.

 

[TRX]

A few years ago I acquired a de-milled Chicom AK-47. Best as I can tell it was done during the Vietnam era, probably for a training aid. The barrel had been plugged, top cover welded on, etc.

Since it had a nice milled receiver I decided to disasemble it and use the receiver to build a new rifle. When I posted a picture on one of the AK forums, several people informed me of the ATF's "three holes is a machine gun" ruling.

I wrote a letter to the NFA branch of the ATF describing the gun. I got a phone call from from the ATF a couple of weeks later. The ATF guy was very polite and helpful; yes, unfortunately what I had was an "illegal machine gun." Drat. Okay, what do I do with it? He said I could donate it to one of various military or law enforcement organizations, or destroy it. He went over the proper way to cut the receiver and mailed me a drawing that showed up a few days later.

I asked if they wanted the pieces, pictures of the cut bits, or other proof that the receiver had been cut, he said no, they'd take my word for it. Since I'd already sent them a picture with the serial number visible and they knew who I was, I guess they weren't worried.

He gave me his number and extension in case I had any further questions, and that was that.

I experienced pain and suffering while torching the receiver, though.

I imagine such things pop up fairly regularly, particularly now that so many WWII and Korea souvenirs are being dug out of trunks or closets.

I've had occasion to call the ATF several times over the years, and each time they've been courteous and helpful.