Is the .38 Super worth it?

[mavracer]

I made a statement based on my own experience, and made my choice...for me...based on that experience. If I'd known that it wasn't gonna "fly" well with you, I'd have just kept it to myself.

Look I refered to it as your opinion, and you are very much entitled to it, By the same token I believe I'm entitled to disagree.
IMHO saying that a 200gr 10mm XTP @ 1200 fps is a poor choice for boar because a 140gr JHP 357 @ 1400 didn't work, just doesn't make any sense.
just as It wouldn't make sense to me to say any cartridge is a poor choice because a poor choice was made in picking a load for said cartridge.
sorry if that hurts your feelings, but hell you could load that same 140gr 357 bullet to well over 2200 fps in a 35 Remington rifle and it'd probably blow up worse and be even less effective (might not even make it through grissle plate) would that make a 35 rem a poor choice for boar?

Those were Winchester factory loads, right?

It was hypothetical, It's the only 41 mag load I could think of that I feel would be a poor performer on heavy skinned game.

The .41 175 Silvertip is a decent defense round...with low recoil and flash from a Model 58, and acceptable expansion/penetration in gelatin...but I don't think it was ever intended to be used for hunting.

Winchester markets it as a hunting round for thin skinned medium game and lists black bear, I think I'd prefer a heavier constructed bullet even for bear.

A 38 Super loaded properly makes a fine choice for a woods carry gun in most parts, As for hunting boar I wouldn't care what was on my hip cause I'm gonna have a rifle too and the rule is the same no matter what the prey is or what's in the holster "If I don't think it'll work it stays in the holster". I'm not real worried about defense from a boar either they ain't exacticly stelthy.

 

[Prosser]

I'm having a hard time with this.

Would a hard cast, or solid turned bullet at 140 grains have penetrated enough
to get through a pig, and if so how far?

Adjusting the bullet type is clearly as important as caliber, velocity and weight.

I keep seeing Lee Jurras doing just that, using 185 grain essentially truncated cone bullets(Silhouette bullets) to take pretty much everything on the planet.
Yes, he used a .429" magnum.

I often wonder if in marginal calibers, like .380, .38, or 9mm I wouldn't be better off with a 140-150 grain JFP, using velocity to create the wound channel.

I just checked and it seems .429" is the smallest Punch Bullet made, and it's not light: 270 grains.

Thoughts?

 

[SharpsDressedMan]

It's not like you are limited to one shot. As is pointed out above, a hardcast 140gr bullet in the .38 Super, at max velocity (and a lead bullet can be pumped up higher than jacketed with less pressure) ought to do some fine damage to a tough critter like a pig. Now imagine drilling 3-4 holes very deep into the pig with 5-6 more as backup. I think a .38 super would make a fine sidearm while hunting with a rifle (which was what the OP orignally stated, I believe.)

 

[tipoc]

You can find a bit more info on the Super here...
http://www.38super.net/

and here...http://www.reloadammo.com/38super.htm

and here...http://www.midwayusa.com/find?&sortby=1&itemsperpage=20&newcategorydimensionid=15427

Keep in mind that there is hunting and hunting. Down south I've seen fellas hunt hogs with dogs and from tree stands above bait. In the latter the ranges are usually short and you can take a sip of bourbon or beer while waiting for the animal to set itself up just right for a nice shot with your handgun. The Super, with the right bullet, would do about as well as anything else under such situations.

Where I am, it's mostly glass and stalk for hogs with variable distances involved. I prefer something more powerful than the Super. Knowing my limitations a long gun works best, except for the little ones.

Mostly I believe the Super is useful for smaller game up to deer at ranges up to 50 yards. For hogs at 200 pds and above I'd use something else.

As a sidearm while hunting with a long gun it makes a good deal of sense.

tipoc

 

[Prosser]

Here is a wart hog, somewhat similar in size to a pig. It doesn't go far:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ShE2rdphWmI
I do admit it was not in attack mode.

Here's another:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cViXU8eXU94&feature=related
.454 Casull, they say 750 pounds.

 

[2zulu1]

NLots of information here, some more accurate than others.

Perhaps this post and thread will help a little;

http://www.thehighroad.org/showpost.php?p=7503121&postcount=36

It took me a number of load workups and bullet testing to achieve these results. I live in active mountain lion country and the N105 loading become my carry load for both mountain lion and head shots on hogs, we have them in this part of Arizona. If I need more gun then I bypass the 10mm and go to the 44mag/300gr WFN.

A note about ramped barrels. My unramped Colt has tighter chamber tolerances, chamber support and barrel bushing tolerances than my Para.

Hornady provides load data for the Super using .355, .356 and .357cal bullets (125gr/140grs). My chronograph results between the 124gr and 125gr XTPs were w/i 04fps of each other. The Colt typically chronographs 20-30fps faster than the Para and is also slightly more accurate.

Hornady data for most of the N105 load weights yields insufficient slide speeds for reliable function. Using overlapping N105 data from Sierra #5 and VihtaVuori #4 yielded upper 1400s through the Colt. VihtaVuori #4 details operating pressures between degressive, neutral (N105) and progressive powders.

The 125gr XTP that penetrated the 14 ply semi truck tire and blew out the range cow leg bone is a testament of the bullet's strong magnum design compared to the 9mm/124gr XTP.

Given proper bullet and component choices, the Super 38 can match factory 357mag 125gr XTP velocities, keep operating pressures under 33,350 psi combined with incredibly fast split times.

As old timers in this part of the Southwest smile and state, the Super is a 357mag in a 1911.

 

[336A]

I'd never entertain the thought of using a light for caliber bullet on pigs. It is no surprise that Silver Tip ammo is considered Self Defense ammo, I give a Tinkers dam what is printed on the box. If you had been using 180gr .44 mag ammo instead of the 175gr .41 mag STHP the outcome would have more than likely been the same. As always tailor the ammo to the job at hand. Had you been using a 210gr bullet in that .41 mag or a 220gr Keith you would of had a dead pig, just lke you did with the 250gr .44 combo. If you think otherwise go try some Rem 180gr SJHP in that .44 mag on a pig.

There is no reason to place blame on the cartridge when the shortcoming was clearly the operators wrong choice in ammo.

 

[silvermane_1]

just curious of what would you folks think of a 230 gr. JHP.45 win.mag @ 1175fps out of a 6.5 inch barrel, would that be adquate for a 300 lb. boar?

 

[Josh45]

This thread has become a pretty wealthy share of info for this cartridge and hunting. I do appreciate the links BTW.

Well, Should I choose to take this sidearm with me, I will make sure it is tailored to the job and in at the same time, I will make sure anything I take with me is tailored correctly to the job.

 

[mavracer]

just curious of what would you folks think of a 230 gr. JHP.45 win.mag @ 1175fps out of a 6.5 inch barrel, would that be adquate for a 300 lb. boar?

that'd be plenty of power IMHO my only holdup would be finding a 230gr JHP that was heavily enough constructed. If you could get one of the 240-250gr 45Colt bullets to feed there are some of those that are constructed for hunting. That or a 240-250 hard cast SWC.