Kids and guns

[CoRoMo]

When I was young, guns were not locked up and neither was ammo. Us boys kept our own shotguns in our bedroom closets, and even ammo.

I'm not going to allow that in my house though. My kids will never know how to get inside any of my safes, and all firearms will be secured in one of them, always. The only exception will be my daily carry, and I will have complete control over it, or it will also reside in one of the safes.

 

[dadof6]

there is alot of weird behaviour in the news these day

almost every day a story appears about a family member that shot up the rest of the family then killed themselves. I've noticed it enough to think there is a pattern there.

While there are many environmental factors involved with people's behavior, don't forget or exclude that there is also evil in the world, plain and simple. We often don't really see it, except when things like this happen that defy any other normal, rational explanation.

Do you think Saddam Husein got the way he was because of video games or rap music? For what ever reason, evil just takes hold of some people.

Right now, guns seem to be the tool of choice. For sure it would be something else if we didn't have them. clubs, knives, swords, garden tools. People have been using things to kill each other for millenia.

It is hard to break that into the current mindset of people though. they are so indoctrinated that 'guns' are the cause of the violence.

Anyhow, don't overlook plain ol evil as a factor in this and other horrible events, like Tuscon.

 

[Seattleimport]

I'm sorry, but the idea your child would seek to use firearms to solve his problems indicates an issue no gun safe in the world can begin to address, in my opinion.

Look up "crimes of passion" and "temporary insanity". Sometimes rational people make irrational choices. Choices they later regret, and would never have made if they'd been thinking clearly. Kids, lacking fully developed brains, are even more prone so such actions.

If the poster says that his kid believes lack of access prevented violence, then I believe him. Seems like in this case, locking up the guns was the right choice.

 

[FAS1]

This is what stuck out to me.

They said the police previously had responded to "insignificant incidents in and around the house," but "nothing directly associated with or related to that family in particular."

How can they respond to something IN that house that wasn't related to that family?

Insignificant to who? Maybe not the kid?

No mention of the mom? Divorced? Were they all discussing or criticizing her and the boy over heard something he didn't like?

I guess the investigation will figure it out. I think that we sometimes believe that kids think in the same capacity and reasoning as mature adults and they don't. I know I made a lot of bad choices as a kid despite what grown ups said. Thank God nothing too serious and I never hurt anyone.

 

[NMGonzo]

If I had kids in the house, I would have the cable lock through the gun.

I was a kid with guns in the house and it took incredible restraint not to mess with them.

 

[gym]

I don't think locking up ammo is a good indicator. Only because if you feel you need to do that for general safety. I think any person of rational mind who turns a weapon on anyone, "unless they are breaking into the house or otherwise threatining the family" needs therapy, not guns. That all starts at home. When you see a kid with skulls all over their room, and dressed ina a black cape walking around angry all the time, it's time to lock up the guns.

 

[therewolf]

I have to agree that this is an issue more of guardian guidance and proper child discipline.

The misuse of a firearm in this particular instance only brings the lack of proper parental control into high contrast.

Many parents mistake "discipline" for "beatings". Real discipline is only achieved
when the parent can communicate their expectations, and the child properly
responds.

I'm sorry, but with limited facts in evidence, IMO, the parents are to blame for this one, from what I can see.

 

[xfyrfiter]

I am almost 60 yo , I have been shooting for at least 55 of those years. My father taught me that if improperly used or handled, that someone could die. I was allowed to shoot by myself from the age of 6. I was also taught that plinking was a waste of good ammo.You needed to " make meat" with every shot. Granted we lived in a very rural area ,and ate game much more than store bought. I raised my two boys to respect the guns as tools of destruction, and if you used irresponsibly the consequences would be dire. The biggest problem with youngsters today is Dr. Spock and the teaching of not disciplining the children, not beatings or abuse but judicious discipline. Ok rant over.

 

[ny32182]

I think most of you guys have the wrong focus here. If the kid accidentally shot himself in the foot once, you could make the case that *mmmm... back in my day, we grew up around guns and shot 1000rds a week outside the school gym at age six...." that, basically education about gun safety would have prevented the problem.

But, the kid didn't accidentally shoot himself in the foot; he intentionally murdered two people and attempted to murder a 3rd. If anything, him being more proficient with the gun would have resulted in an even worse outcome.

Trying to understand the "logic" of something like that from a sane layman perspective is a futile exersize.

As far as "no warning signs", I don't buy that... they were either missed, or have not been released to the media at this time.

There are millions of kids in SC and across the country that have access to millions of guns, who did not murder their family today. And they all play violent video games and listen to evil rock and roll music.

 

[gym]

If you notice I never mentioned either video or rock, as I listen and play both. I said, threatining the family with behavior issues. Like being a loner and maybe deeper stuff like killing small animals like cats and dogs. You are right about the signs, I am sure this kid was giving off vibes, if someone was watching they would have seen something.

 

[lizziedog1]

I was a kid with guns in the house and it took incredible restraint not to mess with them.

My dad's boot was all the restraint I needed.

 

[txhoghunter]

By most of those concerned here I am a kid (18 y/o), but since my parents divorce several years ago it has been more or less my duty to protect my mother and brother inside our house. I have been shooting since i was about 5, and have access to a firearm and ammunition when inside my house so that should I need to, I can protect my family. I have been taught the potential of a firearm and have NEVER looked at one gun as being less dangerous than another. Whether the report says so or not, something did go wrong with this young boy's thought process and the result was tragic. My prayers are with the family, but I do not see this as a reason to keep kids away from guns. They should be taught correctly how to handle them and what they are capable of. However, if a more responsible person is in the home, I would not recommend having a kid (of any age) have a loaded firearm, or ammunition to a firearm within easy access.

 

[neviander]

What do you want to bet that kid was on some sort of meds? It's tragic, but stuff like this has never been, nor ever will be the rule, insanity like this is always the exception. I would say, just stick with what's worked for over a century. Hammer the 4 rules into their pliable little skulls and be a good example; expose media lies and remind them that gun control is not about guns, but control.

Do you think Saddam Husein got the way he was because of video games or rap music? For what ever reason, evil just takes hold of some people.

Ha! Nice point.

Kids, of any sort, (teenagers especially) once gathered together, LOSE 90% of whatever intelligence they may have possessed 10 minutes earlier when they were alone. If there's ever a chance your kids will be left alone at home, for however long, a safe is a good idea.

 

[Patriot1/3]

That's why they are called safes.
You lock weapons in them.
Kids and weapons do not mix.
I guess Daddy thought he did a good job raising junior.
LMFAO! You guys blame everyone else but the responsible party.

 

[txhoghunter]

Patriot, regardless of who is at fault here, I find it hard to understand why you are laughing seeing as 3 people were just killed and a family has been forever changed. Have some respect please

 

[Shadow 7D]

Patriot, what's your points
seems like there is plenty of 'blame' and lots of poster pointing out that there isn't enough facts to come to much of a conclusion other than they were trained differently as children and that much information is lacking from the new accounts.

 

[gym]

Yes you shouldn't make light of it. You need more attention to the actions of young people. There is no general standard anymore. You need a license for everything , in this country, but they don't give people a cousre on how to raise their kids, anyone can have as many as they want and care for them however they choose. If you get a druged out, illterate, or mentally deficiant, set of parents, you are just out of luck. Chances are no one is going to intervene untill something goes wrong. Maybe it's too much Government control, but at least a course for expectant mothers, and fathers might be a good idea, even voluntary if it was accesable to low income familys. If the parents are scewed up, it's going to be so much harder for the kid to rise above it.

 

[Legionnaire]

Sad story. Seems to me, though, that over the past 40 years or so, our culture has generally cheapened the value of life. From violent video games, movies, and television shows, to abortion, assisted suicide, and the so-called "complete lives" and "death panels" popularized in current political rhetoric, the idea that life is sacred is something recent generations just haven't gotten. How else do you explain gang bangers looking to "mess someone up" for no ulterior purpose?

Take guns out of it. When I was a kid, all the guys (and some of the girls) at school carried pocket knives. We used them to sharpen pencils, whittle sticks, play mumblety-peg, and carve our initials where they shouldn't be. But not one of us would have thought of using our knives as weapons. My dad used to hitchhike across country. I did some hitchhiking during my college years. I wouldn't consider it at all today, have strongly counseled my kids against it, and in some states, it's illegal. Too dangerous. Something has slipped.

I have reason to be aware of young people whose first run in with the law was a serious offense against persons or property. It would not have appeared that they were "problem kids" prior to the first incident. But each of the cases I am aware of had some history of trauma, in some instances unknown to the parents, that resulted in suppressed memories that came back to haunt the kid. When they couldn't handle it any more, it came out in some unexpected way. I don't know enough to be able to draw conclusions in this case; I have no idea whether there were warning signs or not. But I'm familiar with enough situations first-hand to know that (1) such behavior typically has a cause, and (2) that cause could be something long past and deeply suppressed that the parents know nothing about.

So I say again, this is a sad story. I'm sure the young man has had difficulty. I pray he is able to work through his demons. At the same time, I don't believe prior trauma excuses his behavior, and think he should be tried as an adult. But I say again that I believe there has been a general cultural slippage in the value of human life that is showing up in many places. This seems like one of them.

Oh, and given all the above, my firearms are locked in the safe when not under my direct control or supervision.

 

[Sauer Grapes]

I grew up with guns in the house just sitting in closets. It was never an issue with me or my siblings. They were always there so it just seemed "normal" to us.
The mindset today with kids and firearms, I'm glad I don't have to deal with it.
I'll leave it to you guys, good luck.
I did have one experience with guns in the house and alcohol. Not good a good situation.

 

[Cmiller21b]

I bought my son a Mk II Ruger .22 the day he was born. I kept it in the safe and told him it was his and when he was old enough he could have it. He could point it out and knew how to handle it safely. I taught him firearms safety and now he's 21 and in the Army. he has almost as many guns as I do and shoots very well. My daughter turned 17 last July and she wanted a pink P 22. She is pretty good with it as to never have had an interest in shooting. She knows how to operate it and how to fire it. She also knows what she doesn't know. It stays in the safe and she doesn't touch it unless I'm there. I just returned from Afghanistan and we'll spend some more time on the range before she gets turned lose with a weapon that may be more dangerous to her that to an attacker. All I can say is teach them well and they will abide by the rules.

 

[armoredman]

Fas1, that last sentance IS an eye opener, isnt' it? What was left out of this story, hard to judge a family's entire history based on a 500 word news story, isn't it?
Patriot, the responsible party is the one who owns the trigger finger that was deliberately used, regardless of age. I also suspect that when more facts come out someone will let slip the kid was on Ritalin or some other mind altering prescription drug. Were the family's other prescription medications locked up? Was Dad on anti-depresseants and Junior wanted to sample? Results of blood testing yet? So much you cannot see in such a small report, so much more likely to be involved "behind the scenes" as it were.
As for kids and guns, hmm...



...mine had a great safe time at the range. We followed Mas Ayoobs advice and removed the mystery - he wants to handle a firearm, he can under adult supervision. He followed all safety rules and did just fine.

 

[Patriot1/3]

Let me lay this out further for those of you,that do not fully understand my point.

KIDS and unlocked weapons do not mix period.
Lock them up because they have not fully developed mental skills of understanding,as well as dealing with problems or rationalizing with emotions.
Never did I say laughing at what has happened but,the FATHER is responsible for this critical situation. It's not blaming but excepting responsibility period.
My father was a WW2 vet,his training was intense on safety at all times. Other training and experiances in my life has even instilled stricter weapons safety in my life.
This is nothing but poor judgement on parenting.The Liberals and anti-gun are going to use this situation and many like them,against or 2nd admendment rights.Lessons can be learned from this,or God I hope so.

 

[00]

+1 for poor parental controls. When a kid behaves badly, the parents need to look at the mirror first.