Looking for a new Pistol

[oldschool]

I’ve been carrying & playing (Steel ,IDPA, Pins etc) with a Kimber Compact Stainless, and now the time has come to add a double stack 9mm to the stable. Help?

There is really only 1 requirement and that is that it have a manual safety (i.e., no glocks, no Springer XD’s) and preferably that it work down to fire like a 1911. This is the wife’s rule for a potential night stand gun.

Features I’d like are;
- full sized ~5” barrel
- tactical rail would be nice (see night stand use)
- ability to carry cocked & locked
- readily available magazines
- polymer frame (Glock 17 weighs fully loaded what my Kimber weighs empty)
- around $500 price range lower would be better

Guns I’ve been looking at;
- CZ’s
- HP- clones

Caliber note here, part of my 9mm kick is penetration through light cover 45’s don’t do this well, 9’s do, 40’s not worth the recoil and 10mm is next years project. Also I can buy 9mm for about what it costs me to reload 45’s but the 9’s will probably be reloaded for 22 level recoil for teaching and competition.

If any body has any specific models that might fit this bill lets hear them I’ll check the ergonomics at a gun show in a few weeks.
Thanks,

 

[browningguy]

CZ or EAA Witness (CZ clone) would fit the bill. Witness would be around $100 cheaper, no loss of quality in my experience with two of them. I keep a 9mm Witness PS in my nightstand, bought it before they cam out with the railed models. I don't know of any HP clones with rails or polymer frames.

http://www.eaacorp.com

 

[The Lone Haranguer]

H&K's full-sized USP came off the top of my head as being closest to your specifications.

 

[Shrike360]

H&K's full-sized USP came off the top of my head as being closest to your specifications.

To get it under $500 though, it would have to be used.

 

[oldschool]

current front runner is the CZ75b SA, I'll have my favorite dealer price one out for me this week.
I can work around no rail but the ability to carry cocked & locked like me 1911 is a big issue for me. Does anybody know if they make the compact in Single action? A compact SA frame with a full size barrel and slide would be in my opinion sweet!

 

[ugaarguy]

Oldschool,
Slightly off from you're requirements, but would an aluminium frame be an acceptable compromise to polymer on weight savings? I know they don't have a light rail either, but the classic C&L SA 9mm is the Hi-Power. You said you've been looking at HP clones, and AIM surplus happens to have Belgian police surplus, aluminium frame, real deal FN/Browning Hi-Powers for $450. They've been tempting me, so I'll share the temptation.
http://www.aimsurplus.com/acatalog/Rare_Alloy_Frame_Belgium_FN_Hi-Power_9mm_Pistol.html
http://www.aimsurplus.com/acatalog/Alloy_Frame_Belgium_FN_Hi-Power_w__RDIH_Safe_Fast_.html

 

[Whirlwind06]

How abut the Taurus 24/7 PRO? Sorry just checked only a 4 inch barrel. Other then that it fits your requirements.

 

[RNB65]

CZ SP01 is a possibility. But it's not poly and weighs a ton.

 

[10-Ring]

My first thought was of a pre-owned USP or USPc 40...great gun!

 

[oldschool]

Looking like CZ or CZ clone
RNB65; SP01 looks like it may be the ticket, weight isn't really the issue if it was I'd probably run a G17/19 or the new Keltecs. That and weight absorbs recoil which might be useful for my wife & full power loads.

Anybody know if a regular DA/SA CZ or Witness can be carried cocked & locked?

 

[Geronimo45]

"Anybody know if a regular DA/SA CZ or Witness can be carried cocked & locked?"
CZ, yes. Everything but the CZ 100 (Glock copy) can be carried cocked-and-locked, as far as I know.

I'd go with the SP-01. Don't know much about the Witness, but I seem to remember that it's a very good copy of the CZ 75.

 

[weregunner]

May I suggest a Ruger P89. Has 4.5 barrel and won't break the bank. Have the Ruger P95s polymer pistol. Accuracy is as good as the other makes and ruggedness is a byword. Does not come with a rail though. For most competition you wouldn't need one. Even a lot of defense trainers are re-evaluating whether having a light on a pistol is a good idea for defense. Under stress one does not want to show themselves to long for any reason by backlighting or showing where you are to the enemy. Police have different reasons for having tactical lights on their weapons. Leading with the pistol into a room and shining a light on the weapon give the perp a target to shoot at. Lighting up an area for a second and shutting it off, then moving is a better choice. It has even been suggested that shining the light up into the room at the ceiling lights up more area for the person to scan all at one time rather than just certain spots in the room. So good luck. Find a pistol that fits you well. There are many choices. Keep us updated. Ruger heft helps me because it sits in the hand and had very little perceptable movement during the firing process. That is why my target pistol is the Ruger Mk.III metal frame and not the 22/45 polymer version.

 

[MatthewVanitas]

www.cdnninvestments.com often has used H&K for under $500. Dig their catalog, but hold on to your wallet!

I'm a CZ man myself; you can't go wrong with the 75, though I stick w/ the RAMI.

-MV

 

[BullfrogKen]

oldschool said: Guns I’ve been looking at;
- CZ’s
- HP- clones

From your criteria, those 2 are your best choices. I'd go with a Hi-Power myself, but a CZ would do just fine, too.

 

[MPanova]

I believe i saw a 24/7 Pro "long" which had a 5 inch barrel. Dont remember where i saw it though :banghead:

 

[oldschool]

Geronimo45; went to 1 gun store and verified that the standard 75b will do cocked & locked and compared to my all steel Kimber they are heavy.

MatthewVanitas; that catalogue is on my work computer most of the stuff they have is 40 S&W or glock trade ins but they are good for mags

MPanova; I like the look and feel of the 24/7 I'm waiting for the 9mm 1911 they are supposed to be bringing out

weregunner; me no likey their mag release that and while I was checking out the C&L on the CZ today a local policeman brought in a Ruger P series to get a holster and to have the shop clean it not the pistols fault but if your life might depend on it, it helps to know how to keep it working, he also didn't know what different retention levels are for holsters. Off topic but I can easily see this cop being shot, if he's lucky with his own gun or killed if he isn't lucky:banghead:

10-Ring; if I went walking in that price range I'd be looking at Sig's or buying a CZ and replacing my AR

ugaarguy; based on weight alone I may go back to the HP's but it won't be a current Belgian, it will probably be used, Charles Daly or HP nockoff from another country

I'm probably going to take the wife to a gun show and let her heft & grip the CZ/Witness and the HP and then take it from there. Based on the weight of the CZ some loaded down lead reloads would probably feel like a .22

 

[oldschool]

And the answer is…

FN Highpower Mk3 SFS in 9mm I picked up Wednesday for $350.
I put 100 rounds of Winchester value pack before I had it an hour. Only one malfunction and that was operator error. The Safe Fast Shooting system is a little “interesting” but the thumb safety engages solidly and disengages crisply. It fists the same holsters as my Kimber and their weights are within 1 oz of each other empty & loaded.

My in-laws got me Stephen Camp’s Shooters guide to the Browning Highpower and the Laminated bench disassembly guide for Christmas. Thanks for personalizing those Mr. Camp.

Next steps are a brass punch to remove the trigger pin and then the magazine disconnect will disappear under mysterious circumstances. That should remove the grit from an already passable trigger pull and allow all mags to drop free without “spring assist”. Then a couple more South African 17 round mags from CDNN for $15 each.

My only thoughts are I will have to change my trigger pull to account for the slightly longer trigger reset on the HP versus my 1911. I may also look into retro fitting the SFS system back to a true SA since Cylinder & Slide offers it as a “upgrade for HP’s & 1911” it stands to reason that it can be undone. Its just really really odd to have to push the hammer foward on a loaded chamber in order to engage the safety.

Thanks all.

 

[strat81]

http://www.taurustactical.com/products/product-details.cfm?id=508&category=Pistol

Taurus 24/7 OSS.

 

[up_onus]

I say get a Springfield Champion....Or Operator, or even better, the Proffesional...
Just me but there is a reason that the contract was awarded to SA....

 

[Juna]

If you ignore the polymer criterion, the CZ SP-01 fits all the others. H&K USP fits all of them except the price.

 

[oldschool]

Removing Mag Disconnect

Removing the magazine disconnect in a High Power,
so easy even a Geico ad copy writer can do it

Much better trigger with no grit and my regular capacity mags drop so nicely now.

 

[ugaarguy]

Oldschool, glad to hear you're enjoying the Hi-Power. You got a screamin deal on it too! My magazine safety also mysteriously disappeared , and the trigger pull improved greatly as a result. If you do take on the project of removing the SFS and putting a standard ignition group in, you might look at a new trigger as well. A friend has a wide target trigger installed on his and it's quite nice. Have fun with the new toy.

 

[Northslope Nimrod]

Except for Polymer and Double Stack......Perhaps you would like a 1911 in
9mm. The Taurus would be in your range. I've been holding out for one. They aren't being manufactured yet, but we should here when they'll come out soon.

For double stack...you could look at a Para Ordinance 1911...but I have no experience with them.

I have a BHP and love it....but I want a 1911 in 9mm too.

 

[DogBonz]

The USP was my first thought...

Then I saw the $500.00 thing. Have you considered a beretta 92 FS? It doesn't break down like a 1911, but it is a double stack 9mm with a 5" barrel, has a manual safety, is accurate, reliable, and rugged. Plus lots of cheap mags, accessories, and spare parts available. you can get them with a rail, and I know that you can find them new for under 5 bills. They are not plastic frames, but I think that given your specs, for the money, you would be hard pressed to do better.

 

[oldschool]

to avoid the "this post is useless without pics"

http://oldigesfamily.com/fnhpsfs.jpg

http://oldigesfamily.com/fnhpright.jpg

that is not a smudge on the frame it is a badly edited out serial number

these pics are not dial up friendly