Looking into a Hi Point

[X-Rap]

Tiger, I just can't imagine being in a situation that would force me to buy a gun like that. I honestly would make what ever lifestyle changes it took to get me to the place where I could arm myself properly with something that I could use for all my PD needs and sorry for my bluntness but shame on you for not having a decent gun to loan your father when he needs it.

 

[Jim NE]

I had a Stallard 9MM ( which is what they called the company before it became Hi Point.) It was a very cheap gun, both in quality and price. I paid $139 for it new back then. It functioned as I expected, more or less. Didn't jam that much, but did jam a few times in the time I had it.

I felt it was a dangerous gun to own. Many el-cheapo semi autos are prone to discharging unintentionally when dropped on the sidewalk. ALSO, because I bought the gun purely for protection in my retail shop, I was worried about it failing at the most inopportune and critical moment...all to save $100. Who's life is worth only $100?

I felt so apprehensive about that gun that I actually took it (and a .25 Raven I owned)down to the police station and told them "Destroy this thing." The cop looked at me like I was crazy, but I didn't care. The world is a better place without those kinds of guns. I could have sold it for maybe $100, but I guess I felt some small responsibility towards the person that would've bought it, too. His life is worth more than $100, as well.

I eventually spent an extra $100 above the purchase price of the Stallard and bought a used Rossi revolver as someone else suggested. If you're going to go the cheap route, I personally think a revolver is a better way to go. More reliable and maybe less prone to tragic accidents.

If you were just going to go plinking, that's one thing, but you should never use one of those for protection, in my opinion. I may be overly cautious, but prudence and caution aren't for the 99% of the time that everything goes as planned.

 

[tprice]

Without making this sound like a Dave Ramsey commercial - he has expressed that he feels he needs a pistol, but can't afford one. I try to help out when I can and thought that on my next trip to see them I'd take him out and buy him a Hi Point .45 ACP or .40 S&W...

So my question is...for this application (strictly power tool style home protection), with his background...would this pistol suffice? I can't afford anything more expensive AND buy him the ammo - and he can't afford...anything else!

Check out Sarco (www.sarcoinc.com) - they have lots of old military/police surplus sidearms from around the globe. Right now they're offering a good-condition used Arcus 94 hi-power clone (9mm) for $225, Star Model 30's (9mm) for $250, and new Rock Island 1911 45's for $350.

If he isn't going to carry, it's better to just spend the $200 on a shotgun. Check out the Maverick line
http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php/cPath/37_591/products_id/42608

 

[Madcap_Magician]

You can do worse than a Hi-Point, but as some other posters have said, if you can't afford a better gun, you should stick to a caliber that you can afford to shoot, which is 9mm or .22 LR, not .45 ACP.

 

[crracer_712]

A buddy of mine has a .40 S&W, I've never shot it, but when we go shooting, its always with him, never has a problem and is the gun he shoots the most, which I thought was odd considering he has a glock as well. I'd never heard of the Hi-Point until his and couldn't believe they were a 200.00 gun. Maybe those that haven't had success don't properly maintain their firearms, well, in this case maybe that doesn't apply because he seldom cleans his Hi-Point either and yet it shoots as good as any other pistol we are shooting on any given day.

Anyway, people bashed the Heritage revolver, even though its a USA product, my dad has one and it has one of the best triggers on a revolver I've shot yet, never failed either. I guess to some, cheap is offensive.

 

[Onward Allusion]

The White Tiger

Sorry to drag everyone back into this discussion, but I have a related question.

Go to CDNN, download their catalog, jump to page 26. CZ-82... $169 + $20 shipping + whatever FFL transfer fees you would have. 200% better than a Hi Point and ammo is about $10 - $11 a box.

Also check out Jetguns.com - They have very good deals on Taurus snubbies in 38 or 327. You can have a Model 85 for $243 (shipping included) or a 327 for $252. Add FFL and you're set. Yes, I did said Taurus (revolvers). Their revolvers are light years ahead of their semi-autos in terms of reliability.

Hi Point quality & reliability can't touch either of the above and anyone who thinks it can doesn't live in reality - and this is coming from a current HP owner.

 

[The White Tiger]

Tiger, I just can't imagine being in a situation that would force me to buy a gun like that. I honestly would make what ever lifestyle changes it took to get me to the place where I could arm myself properly with something that I could use for all my PD needs and sorry for my bluntness but shame on you for not having a decent gun to loan your father when he needs it.

Well in a world where criminals can find guns for $50.00 on the street - that go boom every time they use them - I don't think it's too much too ask if a personal defense weapon like, a High point, do the same for $160.00.

If you have not used one - then I'm not looking for your comment, nor your advice as to my duties.

If you find that offensive, then pardon my bluntness.

 

[gun addict]

you want a reliable personal defense weapon but dont want to spent over $160 and ignores the advices given by members of this board because you're really dead set on a "high point?"

just trying to understand the situation here

 

[G.barnes]

If you look up hi point torture test there are two guys trying to kill a c9. They finally succeed on the third video. It takes put 150% overcharged rounds with a bolt threaded into the barrel and c clamped together to get it to blow up. The tried it with a regular bullet casing hammered into the barrel it not only forced the casing out it still fired accurately. So say what you want but hi point is just a tough as any other gun it's just bulkier and uglier. Anyone who has one that doesn't want it cause it's such a piece of junk let me know I'll buy them. Most people who don't like them have never owned one.

 

[Strahley]

The best thing about buying a Hi Point as your first gun is that you can only move up from there. Actually, that's probably the only good quality

 

[The White Tiger]

you want a reliable personal defense weapon but dont want to spent over $160 and ignores the advices given by members of this board because you're really dead set on a "high point?"

just trying to understand the situation here

No, if I were going to ignore the information I wouldn't bother asking.

I look into the specific models (not similar ones), and then I ask people who own those specific models (not ones made by companies that used to make similar models), what they think about the specific model they own.

See, I already know what the industry reports have to say about Hi Point - that it's a much improved product over Stallard's OLD products (hence why perhaps they went out of business during a time when everyone is looking for something they used to manufacture) - from articles like this one at gunweek.com: Hi-Point’s JHP Pistol in .45 Is Good Defense on Budget...

...but because I know folks can be paid to write positive "puff" pieces, I was wondering if any fellow members of this board A) had experience with the new Hi Point brand (NOT the Stallard), and B) if they did own a Hi Point brand pistol, what did they think of it as a B-A-S-I-C, home/personal-defense weapon - both from a shooters aspect, and from a reliability aspect.

I'm taking this extra time now, to explain it to you because you are a fellow member - and you asked a question. It's not that I disregard your information - it's that I don't like other fellow members (possible gun store owners?) telling me I should be "ashamed" of myself for not buying my dad a more expensive gun.

So, if you have something to add about the Hi Point you own, or have owned, please feel free to comment...as my mind is NOT made-up.

If any of you have owned both a Stallard AND a Hi Point, it would certainly be good to hear from you.

If you've only ever owned a Stallard, or don't own a Hi Point, I don't need your opinions - I get that some of you don't think it a good idea - it just doesn't matter to me!

I especially don't care if you think I need to come to your store and buy my dad a $1200 Model 1911...so you can direct folks away from buying what they need with precious resources...

Hope that wasn't too blunt - as the previous fellow-member has observed.

 

[The White Tiger]

If you look up hi point torture test there are two guys trying to kill a c9. They finally succeed on the third video. It takes put 150% overcharged rounds with a bolt threaded into the barrel and c clamped together to get it to blow up. The tried it with a regular bullet casing hammered into the barrel it not only forced the casing out it still fired accurately. So say what you want but hi point is just a tough as any other gun it's just bulkier and uglier. Anyone who has one that doesn't want it cause it's such a piece of junk let me know I'll buy them. Most people who don't like them have never owned one.

Thanks G.barnes - do you own one?

 

[sniper_nyx]

Hi Point 45 is just OK for me. I've shot a couple and they shot well and never had a failure of any kind. Really big and heavy but is shootable. If it's all you can afford I say go for it. At least your getting into shooting! Enjoy the sport.

 

[The White Tiger]

Hi Point 45 is just OK for me. I've shot a couple and they shot well and never had a failure of any kind. Really big and heavy but is shootable. If it's all you can afford I say go for it. At least your getting into shooting! Enjoy the sport.

sinper - that's what I'm looking for - as I mentioned, my dad is a former Marine who has qualified on small arms and rifles - he's had the old steel boat anchor 1911's...so a big ugly, heavy gun doesn't scare him. He just needs a reliable weapon and because I can't afford anything better (and he can't afford anything at all) I'm considering the Hi Point for him.

 

[The White Tiger]

I had a Stallard 9MM ( which is what they called the company before it became Hi Point.) It was a very cheap gun, both in quality and price. I paid $139 for it new back then. It functioned as I expected, more or less. Didn't jam that much, but did jam a few times in the time I had it.

I felt it was a dangerous gun to own. Many el-cheapo semi autos are prone to discharging unintentionally when dropped on the sidewalk. ALSO, because I bought the gun purely for protection in my retail shop, I was worried about it failing at the most inopportune and critical moment...all to save $100. Who's life is worth only $100?

I felt so apprehensive about that gun that I actually took it (and a .25 Raven I owned)down to the police station and told them "Destroy this thing." The cop looked at me like I was crazy, but I didn't care. The world is a better place without those kinds of guns. I could have sold it for maybe $100, but I guess I felt some small responsibility towards the person that would've bought it, too. His life is worth more than $100, as well.

I eventually spent an extra $100 above the purchase price of the Stallard and bought a used Rossi revolver as someone else suggested. If you're going to go the cheap route, I personally think a revolver is a better way to go. More reliable and maybe less prone to tragic accidents.

If you were just going to go plinking, that's one thing, but you should never use one of those for protection, in my opinion. I may be overly cautious, but prudence and caution aren't for the 99% of the time that everything goes as planned.

Thanks Jim, I have seen an OLD Rossi .38 spl for around $200 - but even the owner says it's pretty beat up and has not been cared for in a long while (as it was his fathers "boat gun".

So, I'm weighing the old, beat-up, Rossi .38 spl boat gun, versus a new $180.00 Hi Point.

 

[gohogs93]

I'd strongly recommend buying a Ruger Mark II or Mark III .22 to try out shooting. They can be had for about $250. You can shoot a LOT cheaper than a 45. .22's are about 5 cents per round when a 45 is about 60 cents per round (at least with ammo prices around here) And there isnt anything much more fun to shoot than a .22. No recoil at all and they're super accurate. I can pretty much guarantee that you'll enjoy it more than a Hi Point 45. I sure as hell would.

Not saying a Hi point is a bad gun. I'm just saying it may not give you the best impression of how much fun shooting can be. They do function and the warranty is nice, but they're hella ugly and uncomfortable (for me) and that trigger is TERRIBLE. On the other hand, the Ruger feels awesome, shoots soft and the trigger is surprisingly smooth and crisp. And since it's a .22 you can shoot all day long and rapid fire without breaking the bank or wearing out your wrist. My first pistol was a Ruger MkII and my first rifle was a Ruger 10/22. The .22 is what made me fall in love with shooting along with countless other people.

If you get the .22 and decide you like shooting like I know you will then you can save up some money and get a good high quality but decently priced centerfire like a Glock 17 or a Ruger SR9. And if you decide shooting isn't your thing then you can turn around and sell it. A ruger Mark III will hold its resale value a lot more than a hi point. Good luck selling a used hi point for half of what you paid for it. The Ruger would get you probably 200 or more back.

 

[kayak-man]

I like the Hi-Points. I have one of the .45s from maybe three years ago. I like that gun because I know that if I do my job, the gun will do its job.

Right now, its serving as my trunk gun. I have NEVER cleaned that gun beyond just oiling it and running a patch down the barrel. I have had 2 problems with it: One FTE, and one incedent of the slide not locking back after the gun ran dry. BOTH of those were because I was seeing how much I could limp wrist the pistol and still get it to work.

The HI-Point is the gun I have to lend to family if they need it. I see it as the pistol version of my H&R single shot shotgun: Its simple, its reliable, it packs a punch, and if the police take it after a shooting, or I lose it in a car crash, its no big deal.

A lot of people are saying that you could save up just a bit more and then afford a nicer gun - thats true, but you have to take into acount the amount of time that it will take to save up. If you feel the need to own a gun for HD or SD today, and you feel like you can't wait the 3-12 weeks to save up for something better, you would not go wrong with the Hi-Point. In that kind of situation, I think the best course of action would be to buy a Hi-Point, and keep saving up so you can get an old S&W to go with it. Sorry for the mini-rant.

To White Tiger: I'll agree that the Hi-Point is ugly, and big, and heavy, and its not the best bullseye target pistol in the world. I'll agree that for a little bit more money, you can get some pretty good guns. But, I have found mine to be as reliable as any other carry gun I own, and accurate enough to get the job done. I admit, ammo can be pretty pricey, but at the same time, .45 is a pretty good HD and SD round. Yes, .22 and 9mak are cheaper, and are still effective SD rounds (OK, .22 is borderline, but thats a discussion for another thread) but they aren't quite a .45.

Best of luck to ya'

Chris "the Kayak-Man Johnson

 

[KimberUltra]

A hi point is cheap. While some say it's a great gun I personally would not want my life depending on a $175 gun. Save up for 2 or 3 more weeks and you can have a high quality CCW pistol.

The one rule I live by is "you get what you pay for."

 

[makarovnik]

When you're comparing the Hi-Point the OP mentioned to other used guns, remember the $175 price tag (or lower ) and the .45 acp caliber which is excellent for home defense.

This pistol works way better than a Thompson 1911A1 (Kahr) that I bought new for three times the price of the Hi-Point. The Hi-Point fed hollowpoints nicely when the Thompson couldn't even digest roundnose even after tuning and different magazines. "King of feedway stoppages".

I would trust my life to that Hi-Point way before the Thompson.

Isolated incidence? I don't think so. They go bang, consistently.

Now the Hi-Point .9mm or .380 is another matter. I had both of those and they jammed a FEW times but my larger .40 and .45 have never... that's right never, jammed.

I also have a "new" P64 that I paid $150 + tax plus a stronger recoil spring from Wolff ($10) and now I can shoot that gun without nerve damage.

The other good deal I got was a Polish TT-33 for $150 but I don't think you can get them that cheap anymore.

They are all good but boy, for anything other than concealed carry I would reach for my Hi-Point before either of my admittedly excellent surplus pistols. And the trigger ain't that bad after a LITTLE polishing of the firing pin and sear.

 

[Jim NE]

"So, I'm weighing the old, beat-up, Rossi .38 spl boat gun, versus a new $180.00 Hi Point."

Well, I'm not ever going to tell someone else what to do in a crifitical situation. It's your choice, but keep in mind that, among cheap guns, revolvers are a bit more reliable. In my opinion 95% or 97% reliability isn't good enough for personal protection. I'll go for 99.99 % all of the time.

Your post reminded me that I recently found the receipt the cops gave my for destroying my two saturday night specials. I'll never forget that stallard...the slide was so big and heavy I could hear it everytime I shot it..."BOOM!-clank-clank....BOOM!-clank-clank." It's possible that Hi Point has improved the design.

Again, the stallard wasn't HORRIBLE, just so cheap I didn't have confidence in it. I still have the Rossi I bought 10 years ago, btw...It's not a fancy S&W, but I STILL keep it for protection without hesitation, along with other decent quality, but affordable guns. (I don't like spending a lot either. All my guns are under $500.)

Of course, check out the Rossi good before you buy it. This one looks like it might be in better shape for that price -
http://www.gunsamerica.com/936578420/Guns/Pistols/Rossi-Revolvers/Rossi_Interarms_Model_68.htm

Best of luck.

 

[Strahley]

Seriously though, if you're on a budget just get a used Glock 22 or something. JG sales has them for $350. It will be miles ahead of any Hi Point

 

[The White Tiger]

For those who understand, thanks for the patience and the honest feedback. I think the ol Marine can handle the .45 JHP, or the .40 S&W JCP.

For those who don't have a Hi Point but are incredulous that I'm considering it...

Seriously, if I had a spare $350 - he'd already have a pistol.

It's not like I can just walk over to the display case and pick out any of the one's you guys have for sale.

I'm buying my dad a pistol, and after just buying 3 in a row - plus the ammunition for them - I just don't have it, and I'm not going to for a LOT longer than 4 additional weeks.

So, if the Hi Point is better than a zip gun, never jambs, and has a lifetime warranty - is it something the ol' Marine can rely on?

 

[Onward Allusion]

^^^

One more thing to consider with the Hi Point versus say a Taurus or Rossi revolver... Break-in ammo.

At $25 for a box of 50, .45ACP is a bit expensive. A Hi Point should have at least a few hundred rounds through it. Any semi-auto for that matter should have a few hundred rounds through it before it's used for home defense. That's $150 or more.

DO NOT depend on a Hi Point for SD/HD unless it has been broken in. Those who say otherwise are fools.

With an inexpensive 2nd tier revolver, it'll just need to run through a box to ensure it functions properly. If one is concerned about 2nd tier quality, just stick to non +P 38 spl rounds.

 

[isc]

There's a guy here that has a sigma 9mm in the for sale section for $260 shipped It's alot more gun for just a bit more...

 

[X-Rap]

I'm buying my dad a pistol, and after just buying 3 in a row - plus the ammunition for them - I just don't have it, and I'm not going to for a LOT longer than 4 additional weeks.

This is the point I was trying to make, it sounds like you have other guns, let him have one of them.
As to owning a gun store or trying to sell you something, I don't get how you got that idea.
I do feel strongly about what people who are important to me are protected, heck my ex wife has a very nice S&W 66 2 3/4" revolver or mine. I'm not wealthy by any means but I try not to skimp on the real important stuff. Sorry to have pissed you off but it is a subject I take seriously.