mortablunt
Member
M1 HD gun? Sounds cool.
M1 Garand Self Defense Rifle?
- Thread starter BluedRevolver
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mortablunt
Member
None, probably only the PING-! of the ejecting clip. But then modern media makes it almost as loud as the gunfire itself 
!
!How many guys could still hear ANYTHING after 8 rounds of .30-06 were fired off in close proximity?
BluedRevolver
Member
How many guys get shot at but not hit with 8 rounds of 30-06 indoors? 30-06 turns cover into concealment!
Andrew Wyatt
Member
a tanker is smaller than my 20" mossberg.
Holds the same number of rounds, recoils a little less, and it's a semi-auto.
An AR-15 would be a better choice, though.
Holds the same number of rounds, recoils a little less, and it's a semi-auto.
An AR-15 would be a better choice, though.
theicemanmpls
Member
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My father served in Korea, 1st Cav.M1 as a home defense rifle. BAD idea. The bad guys would just wait
until they heard the "PING" of the clip being ejected & then rush you.
Roger
I asked him about the "ping", and the enemy rushing in when the M1 made that noise. He said, "most of the gun fights were at distances more then 50 yards. The troopers wished the bad guys would come out of hiding and would rush them if they heard "pings". Would of sent more china men to their maker" His words.
I think the ping rush was great in the movies. But in real battle didn't happen that much.
BluedRevolver
Member
Yup. If I was a Jap or Chinaman or Korean (or anything else for that matter!) I wouldn't have the guts to rush Americans as soon as I heard a ping. Surely there'd be at least 2 other guys with fully loaded Garands for every man that "ping'd"
P-32
Member
I highly doubt any bad guy would know what the sound of an ejecting clip would sound like anyways. If the Garand was the only thing handy at the time, then so be it. It's better than nothing. I just can't stand the "Tankers". There were only about four proto types built, they were a failure then as they are now.
I figure if it took more than 8 rounds of ’06 to make a bad guy want to leave, I might be in trouble. Not because I needed to reload but rather because of the bad guys apparent resolve.
I don’t agree a Garand is hard to reload; it does half the work for you. A person isn’t going to be particularly fast with an unpracticed mag change either.
dmazur
Member
A bit of truth buried in this, somewhere. Yes, there are a few different patterns of adjustable gas cylinder lock screw (aka gas plug) available. However, none of them can make a smaller impulse larger. They all are designed to moderate the high pressure at the gas port created by commercial ammo so it does not bend the op-rod (or batter the receiver heel.)
However, this does not mean that someone could not create a reduced powder/bullet combination that had the required 8000 psi or so at the gas port. It would not have been in the military's interest to go in that direction, as they were looking for long range performance.
I have read of folks shooting lead bullets, at reduced velocities, with a M1 Garand.
I'd have to agree with the majority of comments on this, however. Unless the Garand is the only gun you have, there are far, far better choices for home defense.
(And just because I presently have mine set up with an Eotech on a scout mount doesn't mean I'm planning on shooting zombies...
)Vern Humphrey
Member
Dead men can't hear the "PING." Live men can't get to their feet before there's anther clip in the rifle.
dprice3844444
member
I have a Shuffs mini G. After handling it one of the first thoughts I had is that this would be a great house clearing weapon.
The shorter barrel of the Shuffs or tanker can let you get away with lighter loads, but not that light. Using standard USGI M2 ammo, you need to bleed quite a bit of pressure off the Shuffs with a Shuster plug to prevent opp rod damage, for example.
Unless your home is made of cinder blocks or you live alone in the sticks, thats just too much lead plowing through potentially innocent things for me to be comfortable with.
Plus the short barrel Garand is LOUD. Flash is huge. Overkill for HD.
Flatbush Harry
Member
I recently parted ways with a SOCOM16 M1A, leaving me with my Garands, a Supermatch M1A and an AR15A2 for what might be termed home defense or defensive rifles (I actually use them for high-power mil. rifle matches). I would feel comfortable with the M1s or M1A in any situation. The full size versions are the same size and weight with a loaded Garand a bit lighter than a loaded M1A because of the smaller capacity. As to reloading speed, I can probably reload a Garand more quickly than an M1A because it kicks the clip free whereas I have to remove the empty mag from the M1A in two movements, put in the new one in two movements and work the action while the Garand requires one move.
In all, I would be happy with a Garand and would not reduce its reliability by building a "Tanker" version, though if such is desired, Tim Schuff is a fine smith and builder thereof.
FH
In all, I would be happy with a Garand and would not reduce its reliability by building a "Tanker" version, though if such is desired, Tim Schuff is a fine smith and builder thereof.
FH
Cosmoline
Member
There's nothing wrong with the .30'06 for defensive use. With a high velocity light expanding round it's going to make quick work of anything. Overpenetration concerns are overplayed when it comes to rifles and underestimated when it comes to handguns. Slow and big handgun rounds will typically pose a far greater threat than supersonic expanding rifle rounds. And they're more likely to miss and go flying off lord knows where.
The Garand, however, has some drawbacks as a home defense firearm. The safety catch is not the best design for this purpose, and it was not really designed to be toted or stowed with one in the chamber. I could see a potential ND there with one's finger poking around the trigger area trying to engage or disengage a safety in the middle of a rather tense situation. If you do go down that path, I'd suggest using Israeli presentation methods and IGNORING the safety. Just chamber if the need arises. After the threat has resolved one way or the other, carefully eject the live rounds entirely in the accepted fashion for Garands. Never even touch anything around the trigger.
It's also heavy and bulky even in "tanker" format. There's no real place to mount lights or optics without mods. And the action is designed to work within pretty narrow confines of ball ammo without tweaking. I don't know how reliable it would be with some kind of alternative light high speed ammo or slower home defense ammo.
In short, it can be done but there are better long gun options. I'd rather have a Mauser or Mosin if it came down to using a war rifle for defense. Lighter, better places for a light with a barrel clamp, no pressure issues to worry about, reliable feeding, etc.
The Garand, however, has some drawbacks as a home defense firearm. The safety catch is not the best design for this purpose, and it was not really designed to be toted or stowed with one in the chamber. I could see a potential ND there with one's finger poking around the trigger area trying to engage or disengage a safety in the middle of a rather tense situation. If you do go down that path, I'd suggest using Israeli presentation methods and IGNORING the safety. Just chamber if the need arises. After the threat has resolved one way or the other, carefully eject the live rounds entirely in the accepted fashion for Garands. Never even touch anything around the trigger.
It's also heavy and bulky even in "tanker" format. There's no real place to mount lights or optics without mods. And the action is designed to work within pretty narrow confines of ball ammo without tweaking. I don't know how reliable it would be with some kind of alternative light high speed ammo or slower home defense ammo.
In short, it can be done but there are better long gun options. I'd rather have a Mauser or Mosin if it came down to using a war rifle for defense. Lighter, better places for a light with a barrel clamp, no pressure issues to worry about, reliable feeding, etc.
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RPRNY
Member
I say, that Shuff's Mag fed Mini G is the business. What a great weapon.
dmazur
Member
...I just keep my finger outside the trigger guard until ready to fire. ( )
Seriously, even with gloves, I haven't had any trouble. Fumbling inside with safety on doesn't do anything. Trigger and hammer are locked. Once you push forward, you'd best get your finger (or thumb) outside the guard, however.
Putting safety on is fairly positive, as long as you don't get careless and slip off the front of the trigger guard. I put a finger all the way across. No "fingertip" stuff here.
I understand there was a winter trigger mod for Korea that allowed use of mittens, but I wouldn't recommend that for normal use. I can see that being difficult to avoid accidental activation, being outside the trigger guard -
http://www.civilianmarksmanship.com/accessoryhtml/accwintertrig.html
)Seriously, even with gloves, I haven't had any trouble. Fumbling inside with safety on doesn't do anything. Trigger and hammer are locked. Once you push forward, you'd best get your finger (or thumb) outside the guard, however.
Putting safety on is fairly positive, as long as you don't get careless and slip off the front of the trigger guard. I put a finger all the way across. No "fingertip" stuff here.
I understand there was a winter trigger mod for Korea that allowed use of mittens, but I wouldn't recommend that for normal use. I can see that being difficult to avoid accidental activation, being outside the trigger guard -
http://www.civilianmarksmanship.com/accessoryhtml/accwintertrig.html
Bartholomew Roberts
Member
Federal loads a 150gr VMAX in .30-06. With an adjustable gas plug so you don't bend the oprod, you can have a round that will make BIG holes in gel, while penetrating about the same as many .223 loads. Having said that, I don't have the first clue how it performs outside of bare gel.
Hmm, I'm not familiar with this one. Federal makes a 150 gr FMJ Garand load (and a few other 150 gr .30-06 loads), but the V-max is a Hornady bullet, and only comes in 110 gr in .30 cal. Hornady loads a 168 gr A-max round for the Garand. A bit pricey, but it's good stuff.
Bartholomew Roberts
Member
My bad, I use a lot of Hornady stuff so I tend to call all varmint-type bullets "VMAX" regardless of who actually made them. The Federal load actually uses the Nosler Ballistic Tip. The load is Federal Premium P3006P.
Andrew Wyatt
Member
There is physically no way to carry a garand with ammunition loaded in it without one in the chamber without handling the gun in a dangerous manner or having a bolt over base malfunction.
If you are taking it off safe, you are ready to fire. if you are putting it on safe, your finger is not in the triggerguard.
USSR
Member
Wrong M1 for self defense:
Right M1 for self defense:
Don
Right M1 for self defense:
Don
mortablunt
Member
^That's pretty much a given. However, I wonder how a Garand would work as a defensive gun...
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