Magazines and clips...

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At least one manufacturer has referred to their detachable-box-magazine rimfire rifles as being "clip fed."
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The people who publish catalogs and websites for gun manufacturers, or even the CEO's and MBA's that often run them, aren't always necessarily "gun people."

Case in point:

HK%20catalog.jpg

What's wrong with this picture?

Actually "pistol" was the common term for any handheld gun (or "gonne") for centuries before the invention of the semiautomatic handgun...and before the invention of the revolver for that matter. Whether it were horse pistols, dueling pistols, whether wheelock or flintlock...none were semiautos and all were called "pistols". Later, Sam Colt himself called his revolvers "pistols" or "revolving pistols". Gunfighters of the 19th Century were called "pistol fighters". It's only in the last 100 years that "pistols" came to mean semiautos and not revolvers. Historically it's inaccurate.
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Actually, "pistol" generally refers to any firearm with a fixed chamber (e.g., the old Remington XP100 bolt-action single-shot is a pistol, though not semiautomatic). The old flintlock and wheel-lock pistols are indeed pistols in the modern sense as well, as the word is generally used.
 
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Vonderek said:
Actually "pistol" was the common term for any handheld gun (or "gonne") for centuries before the invention of the semiautomatic handgun...and before the invention of the revolver for that matter. Whether it were horse pistols, dueling pistols, whether wheelock or flintlock...none were semiautos and all were called "pistols". Later, Sam Colt himself called his revolvers "pistols" or "revolving pistols". Gunfighters of the 19th Century were called "pistol fighters". It's only in the last 100 years that "pistols" came to mean semiautos and not revolvers. Historically it's inaccurate.
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That's correct, and I wonder when and why people started to change the word "pistol" to refer specifically to magazine-fed autoloaders (or at least non-revolvers). :confused: I still use "pistol" and "handgun" synonymously, but occasionally avoid using "pistol" when the meaning isn't clear from the context, in order to avoid confusion. :eek: If I had to venture a guess, the word "revolver" became so popular and well used, just as the type of firearm did itself, that people stopped using "pistol" and gradually began to think "revolver" was the only word that described this type of firearm. Then when autoloaders began to gain in notoriety, at least among the public, they needed a word for it that was familiar and didn't intimidate them like "autoloader" or "semiautomatic," and that was good old "pistol."

Although it's only my guess, that goes to show how things can change in language, but those who wish to be knowledgeable about a subject should at least look into the history of the nomenclature. Keeping in mind that outside of this thread, I have never once corrected anybody for using the word "clip" to refer to "magazine" when the meaning was clear, am I arrogant for assuming that those who are interested in a subject, namely firearms, generally wish to become more knowledgeable about it? Is it arrogant to think that even people who have used firearms since before I was even born may still have something to learn about their beloved pursuit? Or are they arrogant to believe that they know everything and have nothing more to learn? Just thinking out loud....
 
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Colt used to make Automatic Pistols with none of the modern precious distinction of semi-automatic or autoloading jargon.
Hiram Maxim patented a Silencer, no tackytickle supressors in 1909. Jim K. says it was quiet enough to deserve the name, too.

The language evolves... or degenerates.
 
Splitting hairs because its winter, and more people experienced what winter TRULY is, this year. A rose by any other name is still a rose. Yes, I'm thinking about spring....
Carry on.
 
If I had to venture a guess, the word "revolver" became so popular and well used, just as the type of firearm did itself, that people stopped using "pistol" and gradually began to think "revolver" was the only word that described this type of firearm. Then when autoloaders began to gain in notoriety, at least among the public, they needed a word for it that was familiar and didn't intimidate them like "autoloader" or "semiautomatic," and that was good old "pistol."
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Yes, but in the case of the parallel universe that is The News Media, everything can be anything, including pistols and revolvers. I recently read a news report of a police shooting that mentioned "the officer's Glock service revolver." Egads!! :)
 
Clips feed rounds into a magazine. They are called stripper clips.

Magazines hold a round in the proper position to be fed in to the firearm.

Bullets are the lead or lead/copper slugs inserted into the brass or steel casing.

A rounds consist of a bullet, a primer, powder, and a cartridge.

Lazy people say clip is a four letter word so it is easier to say. I tell them you can call it a mag which is a three letter word, even easier.
 
Wow,

A rounds consist of a bullet, a primer, powder, and a cartridge.
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Uh...a "cartridge" (or "round") consists of a bullet, powder, primer, in a "case" or "casing."

"Cartridge" always denotes the entire assembly.

This nomenclature thing is more controversial than I'd thought!

-Sam
 
Jim Watson said:
Colt used to make Automatic Pistols with none of the modern precious distinction of semi-automatic or autoloading jargon.
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True, but sometimes things change in ways that do justify changing or adding new terminology, and that's OK as far as I'm concerned. But calling something by one name when it's really still another type of object to this day is different. I refuse to throw a blanket excuse over any and all changes that anybody--including marketers, media, and the general public--wants to make that further degrade the meanings of words.

Vonderek said:
Yes, but in the case of the parallel universe that is The News Media, everything can be anything, including pistols and revolvers. I recently read a news report of a police shooting that mentioned "the officer's Glock service revolver." Egads!! :)
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I read that article, too, and according to some here, it seems, if it catches on with the public, then it's alright for everybody here to start calling Glocks and 1911s revolvers. :eek: After all, only an arrogant pedant would dare protest the inevitable evolution of language, huh? :rolleyes:

Sam1911 said:
Wow,

Uh...a "cartridge" (or "round") consists of a bullet, powder, primer, in a "case" or "casing."

"Cartridge" always denotes the entire assembly.

This nomenclature thing is more controversial than I'd thought!
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There's no controversy with this example--somebody simply made an error and you caught it. Hopefully everybody who thought the same will learn the correct terminology now. Similarly, if somebody can prove that "pistol" only ever referred to non-revolver handguns, then I'll admit that I was wrong and refrain from calling revolvers pistols from now on. It's called learning, and it's good for you. Never stop doing it. :)
 
we know what people mean when they use the term clip.
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I also know what people really mean when they call a firearm a "gat", or ask where they can get "gas" for their diesel truck, or when they call a flat panel monitor a "CRT", or call a DVD a "CD". I wouldn't correct them, either, but neither would I view it as a positive reflection on their knowledge of the subject.
 
Tire = black rubber part
Rim = shiny metal part
Wheel = tire & rim together

Be that as it may, like firearms vernacular

If someone says my 'wheel is flat', or even 'my rim is flat', I generally know its usually a tire that's actually flat. Because I know what they're trying to convey. But staying in the business long enough, I've actually seen a flat rim (crushed).
 
If someone calls a magazine a "clip" in my presence, I won't correct them, but I will assume that they got their gun knowledge from Hollywood and don't know much about firearms, the same as if they called a handgun a "gat".
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And your assumption could be very wrong. Many of the men who fought in WWII in the Army and Marines called magazines "clips." Most of them had a very intimate knowledge of firearms and got the job done despite their dreadfully incorrect terminology.

Tinpig
 
And your assumption could be very wrong. Many of the men who fought in WWII in the Army and Marines called magazines "clips." Most of them had a very intimate knowledge of firearms and got the job done despite their dreadfully incorrect terminology.
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The issue arm of WWII era Army and Marines was the M1 Garand rifle. The Garand uses a clip not a magazine. My Grandfather, may he rest in peace, was one of those that would quickly and often with a great deal of... um... clarity... let you know that a detachable box magazine was not a clip.

If you REALLY want confusion with battle rifles though... Observe if you will the venerable Lee Enfield rifle. Although this weapon has a detachable box magazine said magazine is loaded in the rifle with stripper clips or 'chargers' and the magazine only removed for cleaning the weapon.
 
I have went to the range with both clips and magazines in my box.

So yes, if you have both in your possession then calling a magazine a clip is erroneous. Can I call a stripper clip a magazine and people are "just supposed to know"?

Ex:

Hand me a magazine to load my clip.

They are interchangeable, correct?

Until I read this thread I did not know that "gat" was a pistol. I guess I was just supposed to know.

If one is going to take the time to learn firearms, them learn them correctly.

I was corrected, yes it is casing not cartridge (cartridge denotes the entire round). I can accept the fact that I was wrong and learn from it.
 
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I was corrected, yes it is casing not cartridge (cartridge denotes the entire round). I can accept the fact that I was wrong and learn from it.
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NO! NO! You're doing it all wrong. You're supposed to get all pi$$ed off and argue about it for a few more pages!


:D
Ha ha!

-Sam
 
stchman said:
Until I read this thread I did not know that "gat" was a pistol. I guess I was just supposed to know.
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I didn't, either. :confused: I've never heard of the word before. As if we needed another word for pistol or handgun or "piece." :rolleyes: Although I'll continue to consider it Hollywood or street slang, and never use the term myself, at least I'll know what people are talking about if I ever come across it again.

stchman said:
If one is going to take the time to learn firearms, them learn them correctly.

I was corrected, yes it is casing not cartridge (cartridge denotes the entire round). I can accept the fact that I was wrong and learn from it.
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That's a healthy attitude to have, definitely. I used to think for many years that "clips" were pistol magazines, and that "bullets" and "cartridges" were the same thing. :eek: Likewise, I was wrong but I learned. Learning is the only way to overcome the ignorance with which we were all born into this world. How can we expect ignorant gun-haters to learn and apply what's right if we can't--or won't--learn a simple bit of terminology?
 
You guys that have never heard the term "gat" are lees than 900 years old.

It is a Hollywood term that was used in a lot of movie made in the '30's, '40's and 50".

ggeeerr you got your gat with you ?

:cool:
 
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