Travis McGee
Member
"Cleaning the gun when it just went off."
Yeah, right. How original.
Yeah, right. How original.
Man Kills Neighbor While Cleaning Rifle
- Thread starter RioShooter
- Start date
- Status
wingnutx
Member
Funny, when I clean my AR it gets broken in half. Hard to ND with half a rifle.
K-Romulus
Member
Umm, probably NONE.
I have seen a lot of newbies pay money and go home with a gun they barely know how to load (usually a handgun, often a rifle, but even a shotgun like in my FIL's case
).Whenever I see these sort of guys at the range counter or shop, I am "that guy" who tells them to take a class FIRST before buying the gun.
I make a lot of gun store worker "friends" that way, but every one of these "I didn't know it was loaded" episodes is another step towards a nationwide mandatory training/"licensing" requirement like in Canada, Mass., MD, NJ, NY or California.
Snake Eyes
Member
You must not own any Glocks.
American By Blood
Member
wingnutx said:
Bingo.
Dude was jay-ohing with his weapon and killed his neighbor. However, when the cops question you it sounds a whole lot better to say "I was cleaning my gun" than "I was reenacting the pivotal chase scene from Heat."
What really peeves me is how the press and the public at large buys the "just cleaning it" excuse. There's already numerous responses that it's obvious to all of us that to clean a gun, the first step is to unload it and break it down. Even if they did have an ND as part of preparations for cleaning, why is it any different?
A. From what I've seen the little I dabbled in Mass Comm studies during my University days, the press truly is this ignorant/stupid.
B. Those who are not that ignorant/stupid propagate the lie, hoping that they can sway the public even further anti-gun, by implating the meme that "How awful guns must be if people can die just from cleaning them."
A. From what I've seen the little I dabbled in Mass Comm studies during my University days, the press truly is this ignorant/stupid.
B. Those who are not that ignorant/stupid propagate the lie, hoping that they can sway the public even further anti-gun, by implating the meme that "How awful guns must be if people can die just from cleaning them."
Peet
Member
Trigger pull to field-strip...
...and to re-assemble.
Anyone know is same is true for the MKI?
P.
...and to re-assemble.
Ruger MKII (and likely the MKIII though I don't own one, looks the same).TX1911fan said:
Anyone know is same is true for the MKI?
P.
ProguninTN
Member
AJ Dual
Right on !
Right on !
Jorg Nysgerrig
Member
- Joined
- Apr 13, 2006
- Messages
- 7,822
The "gun went off while cleaning" has long been a euphemism for suicide, particularly in small towns.
Similar happened to my cousin in the early 70s
A similar incident happened to my cousin in the early 70s. He and his family returned home to find a broken window, then a hole in this wall, out the other side, through the next wall, out the other side, etc. A 180 grain 30 Cal. round completely penetrated his home, through multiple walls. How did they now it was 180 grains? Simple, one of the 3 bullets lodged in the 2X4 studs. Given the angle of impact, they estimate it had traveled about 1 mile before impact. Seems odd they can calculate that.
Anyhow, that is why when I bought my house, I bought brick. You see, between seeing those bullet holes, and hearing the story about the "Three Little Pigs" (no pun intended toward police) I learned to have a solid home.
Doc2005
A similar incident happened to my cousin in the early 70s. He and his family returned home to find a broken window, then a hole in this wall, out the other side, through the next wall, out the other side, etc. A 180 grain 30 Cal. round completely penetrated his home, through multiple walls. How did they now it was 180 grains? Simple, one of the 3 bullets lodged in the 2X4 studs. Given the angle of impact, they estimate it had traveled about 1 mile before impact. Seems odd they can calculate that.
Anyhow, that is why when I bought my house, I bought brick. You see, between seeing those bullet holes, and hearing the story about the "Three Little Pigs" (no pun intended toward police)
I learned to have a solid home.Doc2005
No such thing as dry firing
You shouldn't even believe in dry firing if you are a responsible gun owner. Treat every gun like it's loaded because it might be. When you pull the trigger the barrel needs to be pointed in a safe direction. "The wall" doesn't count as a safe direction. If you're on the second floor of a 3 story building the floor and ceiling don't count as safe directions either.
As for the adequacy of the AR-15, any piece of crap rifle can kill a guy with a headshot through drywall and some cheapo headboard. Definately low class and NOT high-road to turn this into an AR-15 orgasm thread.
You shouldn't even believe in dry firing if you are a responsible gun owner. Treat every gun like it's loaded because it might be. When you pull the trigger the barrel needs to be pointed in a safe direction. "The wall" doesn't count as a safe direction. If you're on the second floor of a 3 story building the floor and ceiling don't count as safe directions either.
As for the adequacy of the AR-15, any piece of crap rifle can kill a guy with a headshot through drywall and some cheapo headboard. Definately low class and NOT high-road to turn this into an AR-15 orgasm thread.
Stiletto Null
Member
FWIW, my (personal...roomie has a shotgun) HD piece is an 8mm FN49.
That said, I also know how to do a CHAMBER CHECK before dryfiring.
Something about this story smells. Still, at least the poor guy died of a headshot—even if he had been conscious, he wouldn't have felt a thing.
That said, I also know how to do a CHAMBER CHECK before dryfiring.
Something about this story smells. Still, at least the poor guy died of a headshot—even if he had been conscious, he wouldn't have felt a thing.
Jorg Nysgerrig
Member
- Joined
- Apr 13, 2006
- Messages
- 7,822
You seem to be confusing dry firing with randomly pulling the trigger on an empty gun with no regard to the direction in which it is pointing. Dry firing drills are commonly accepted practice techniques. You should choose better terminology for your sweeping generalizations.
By the way, how would a "responsible gun owner" disassembly a Glock or Ruger MKII if they don't believe in dry-firing?
Here is the long version of the story from the San Antonio Express News.
Neighbor accidentally kills man while cleaning rifle
Web Posted: 09/23/2006 11:37 PM CDT
Brian Chasnoff
Express-News
Jesse Hernandez paid no mind when his new rifle suddenly fired as he was cleaning it early Saturday. The bullet had pierced the bedroom wall of his West Side apartment, but the odds of it harming someone, he reasoned, were too remote.
Thirty minutes later, Hernandez heard a woman screaming. It was his neighbor's wife, and he realized that the remote chance had become a reality.
The bullet had passed through a headboard in the neighboring bedroom and struck 24-year-old Saulo Garcia in the back of the head, killing him, police said.
Hernandez, who considered Garcia a friend, panicked at the screams and fled to his brother's house. At the time, he didn't know whether his buddy had been killed or wounded, he said.
"I stayed up all night just thinking about my friend," Hernandez, 35, recalled later that morning outside his apartment in the 1800 block of Bandera Road.
Hernandez eventually drove to police headquarters to report the incident, he said. He had not been charged on Saturday, but police spokesman Joe Rios said authorities were investigating the case as a criminally negligent homicide and Hernandez could be charged.
"Anytime anyone discharges a weapon, there's accountability. They still have to be held accountable," Rios said.
"At this point it does appear to be accidental," he added.
Hernandez recently bought the M16 rifle for protection, he said. It was the first firearm he had ever owned.
Arriving home from work around 12:30 a.m., Garcia's wife discovered her husband in bed bleeding from the head. She called police, believing he had been beaten, a police report said.
Emergency medical technicians discovered the gunshot wound. Police entered Hernandez's apartment to check for other victims but found no one inside, the report said. They later returned with a search warrant and found a rifle and a shell casing, Rios said.
Garcia's wife was too upset Saturday to talk. But Carlos Diaz, a friend of the couple's, said, "It's just a tragic accident. It's one of those things that you don't have any control over it."
Diaz added, "The basic rule to clean a gun is make sure the gun's not loaded."
Hernandez believed the rifle was not loaded. But he said he has a plan to avoid another tragedy.
"Get rid of (the rifle)," he said, "and hopefully keep on going with my life."
Neighbor accidentally kills man while cleaning rifle
Web Posted: 09/23/2006 11:37 PM CDT
Brian Chasnoff
Express-News
Jesse Hernandez paid no mind when his new rifle suddenly fired as he was cleaning it early Saturday. The bullet had pierced the bedroom wall of his West Side apartment, but the odds of it harming someone, he reasoned, were too remote.
Thirty minutes later, Hernandez heard a woman screaming. It was his neighbor's wife, and he realized that the remote chance had become a reality.
The bullet had passed through a headboard in the neighboring bedroom and struck 24-year-old Saulo Garcia in the back of the head, killing him, police said.
Hernandez, who considered Garcia a friend, panicked at the screams and fled to his brother's house. At the time, he didn't know whether his buddy had been killed or wounded, he said.
"I stayed up all night just thinking about my friend," Hernandez, 35, recalled later that morning outside his apartment in the 1800 block of Bandera Road.
Hernandez eventually drove to police headquarters to report the incident, he said. He had not been charged on Saturday, but police spokesman Joe Rios said authorities were investigating the case as a criminally negligent homicide and Hernandez could be charged.
"Anytime anyone discharges a weapon, there's accountability. They still have to be held accountable," Rios said.
"At this point it does appear to be accidental," he added.
Hernandez recently bought the M16 rifle for protection, he said. It was the first firearm he had ever owned.
Arriving home from work around 12:30 a.m., Garcia's wife discovered her husband in bed bleeding from the head. She called police, believing he had been beaten, a police report said.
Emergency medical technicians discovered the gunshot wound. Police entered Hernandez's apartment to check for other victims but found no one inside, the report said. They later returned with a search warrant and found a rifle and a shell casing, Rios said.
Garcia's wife was too upset Saturday to talk. But Carlos Diaz, a friend of the couple's, said, "It's just a tragic accident. It's one of those things that you don't have any control over it."
Diaz added, "The basic rule to clean a gun is make sure the gun's not loaded."
Hernandez believed the rifle was not loaded. But he said he has a plan to avoid another tragedy.
"Get rid of (the rifle)," he said, "and hopefully keep on going with my life."
Axman
Member
All of my long guns are bolt actions. Anytime I clean them I remove the bolt first, in doing so it ejects the cartridge from the chamber. Then the mag can be removed. My .22 LR has a trigger assembly that also gets removed. What's so hard about disabling the gun first? I'll tell you, he was fiddling around with it pretending he was a tin soldier in a make believe battle with his itchy trigger finger inside the guard. What a poor example of a gun owner!
RioShooter
Member
I bet this idiot didn't even know how to properly clean his weapon. Ignorance is bliss, until it causes a tragedy. I would also bet, as a newbie he had an itchy trigger finger, and couldn't resist the temptation.
I'm glad he said he plans to never own a gun again.
Geronimo45
Member
Depends on how you define 'clean a gun'. If you're wiping the outside surfaces with a rag, it can go off if you're going into the trigger guard area.
So, the guy discharged his weapon into the wall of his apartment. He didn't bother to find out where the bullet went. When he did realize where it went, he fled the scene. The police had to get a search warrant to get into his apartment. Yeah, that is a responsible guy.
Aguila Blanca
Member
He's a male. You know we males never open the instruction manual until after something has gone seriously wrong.
All I'm saying is that I believe he may have thought the gun was empty. I didn't say I don't think he was stupid or negligent.
Ala Dan
Member in memoriam
It's called Urban Warfare Protection from other idiots~!
Hell, if I lived near Houston I proly would have a loaded AR myself;
but not while cleaning it~!
Heck, I live near Bombingham, AL fastly becoming
the murder captial of the South; and I keep a loaded AR~!
Hell, if I lived near Houston I proly would have a loaded AR myself;
but not while cleaning it~!
Heck, I live near Bombingham, AL fastly becoming
the murder captial of the South; and I keep a loaded AR~!
Relax Jorg
I'm making a point by using the terminology "dry firing". People dry firing should take the same care with the direction of their muzzle as people live firing. So if you "dry fire" your Glock or Ruger MKII to disassemble it you should still treat it as if it could fire. Otherwise it's not "dry firing", it's "idiot firing".
The proper terminology may be "dry firing" but the proper mindset should be that your gun is always loaded. Otherwise you might do something regretable like shooting your neighbor in the head.
So, no "sweeping generalization" here. No need to get your boxers all bunched up. There's nothing wrong with dry fire drills.
I'm making a point by using the terminology "dry firing". People dry firing should take the same care with the direction of their muzzle as people live firing. So if you "dry fire" your Glock or Ruger MKII to disassemble it you should still treat it as if it could fire. Otherwise it's not "dry firing", it's "idiot firing".
The proper terminology may be "dry firing" but the proper mindset should be that your gun is always loaded. Otherwise you might do something regretable like shooting your neighbor in the head.
So, no "sweeping generalization" here. No need to get your boxers all bunched up. There's nothing wrong with dry fire drills.
molonlabe
Member
You must not own a glock. Even so I squeeze the trigger after dropping the mag and checking the chamber while pointing it in a safe direction. It's not rocket science
Last edited:
- Status
Similar threads
- Locked
