Modern combat revolver?

[pmeisel]

For military combat, a handgun is an emergency weapon... close quarters self defense, surprised without your rifle, personal weapon for those whose primary weapon is a crew-served type, aviator survival weapon....

For most of these roles, autoloader vs. revolver is less important than a lot of other factors like ammo, holstering, etc.

But logistics being the factor that it is, once a service standardizes on something, it will tend to be the default.

 

[mesinge2]

LoneStarWings's revolver was design for SWAT entry teams in which a shield would be employed and the slide of an auto could impact the shield and cause the weapon to malfunction

 

[mesinge2]

Here is a site that explains my last post.

http://www.woodscustomrifles.com/id34.html

 

[Erik]

"Are there any circumstances where the simplicity of operation of a revolver, particularly a DAO revolver, might actually make it better choice as a combat sidearm than an autopistol?"

No.

Some may make mention of semiautos being better suited for under foul conditions, but it mainly comes down to size efficiency re ammunition; capacity, manner of carrying ammunition, and ability to (re)load ammunition.

 

[pps]

I can never miss an opportunity to show my favorite revolver:

Does that thing come a tactical bottle opener and cup holder.

 

[pmeisel]

Wonder why aviation personnel were so often equipped with revolvers for so many years?

a) they don't really need a gun, let's give them this paperweight so they think they have one....

b) they are too ADD to remember their training on a semi-auto, give them something that is squeeze-go-bang...

Other?

 

[DR505]

Wonder why aviation personnel were so often equipped with revolvers for so many years?

a) they don't really need a gun, let's give them this paperweight so they think they have one....

b) they are too ADD to remember their training on a semi-auto, give them something that is squeeze-go-bang...

Other?

c) When they eject from a jet they will only lose a revolver and a few rounds, rather than a valuable semi-auto.

 

[wilkersk]

The Navy used a Ruger Service Six with a 4" barrel as standard issue for use in their aircrew survival vests as recently as 1999 when I retired.

A lot of aircrews opted for the M1911A1, or M9, in a shoulder holster. But, the SV-2 survival vest is still designed to hold a .38 revolver as far as I know. The things were tied into the vest with a lanyard.

Why a revolver? Because as long as the cylinder stayed closed, there was little chance of FOD-ing the aircraft. That's important when you're flying a zoom-zoom that flies as fast upsidedown as rightsideup.

 

[JellyJar]

Read about Eddie Rickenbacker

Read the autobiography of Eddie Rickenbacker. He was on of the first American Aces during WWI and one of the founders of the now defunct Eastern Airlines. During WWII he was traveling on an Army Air Force bomber to some destination in the Pacific when the plane had to ditch due to mechanical problems. All got out of the plane before it sank.

There were two handguns among the group floating in the Pacific Ocean. One was a revolver, make not known but probably a S&W, as well as a 1911. The 1911 rusted shut in just a couple of days but the revolver kept right on working until they were rescued after about two weeks.

There are good arguments for the auto loader in most situations but when you need a handgun that will absolutely work under all conditions then you still cannot beat a revolver

I think I remember them killing a couple of seagulls with the revolver to eat. Don't quote me on that because I read the book way back when I was in High School.

 

[Vern Humphrey]

Rickebacker's experience doesn't jibe with mine -- one reason may be perhaps one of the pistols got dunked and not disassembled and dried.

I carryed an M357 Colt during my first tour in Viet Nam (and used it twice.) But it was my gun, and I treated it like my gun. On my second tour, I carried an M1911A1. During the same era, the Army issued .38 S&Ws to helicopter crews, and I saw many a fine S&W revolver turn into junk.

 

[mordechaianiliewicz]

I see revolvers in modern combat having only 2 applications. One is you can shoot it from any position, and all it has to do is turn a cylinder. So, you can shoot from inside a pocket. Secondly, you don't have cartridges ejecting, so you don't leave evidence behind.

The first makes it very good for self-defense, but not battlefield use.

The second (if a special silencer could be rigged, like with the Nagant) makes it an excellent tool for orgs like the CIA, Specops, etc. As well as unfortunately, criminal elements.

 

[DougDubya]

>snip< Secondly, you don't have cartridges ejecting, so you don't leave evidence behind.

>snip<

The second (if a special silencer could be rigged, like with the Nagant) makes it an excellent tool for orgs like the CIA, Specops, etc. As well as unfortunately, criminal elements.

Or, since it doesn't eject empties, it can be used in situations such as on boat decks, where rolling brass could trip the shooter up if he's firing and moving.

 

[Zeke/PA]

I'm sold on the relative simplicity of a revolver especially if a SHTF situation ever presents itself.

 

[LEVRLOVR]

Anyone ever see that episode of Cops where the officer and his canine were wresting with a drug offender?

Florida I believe it was.

Anyway, the perp wrestled the officers semi from his holster and took a couple of swipes at the canine before attempting to shoot the officer.

While striking at the dog the slide hit the ground and caused it to jam out of battery.
Meanwhile the officer had drawn his bug and fired off 4 or 5 rds. killing the offender.

So a definite yes to your question: There are times when a reliable 6 gun is more preferrable than an auto.

 

[Vern Humphrey]

And if it had been a revolver and he'd bent the crane?

 

[DougDubya]

And if it had been a revolver and he'd bent the crane?

Moot point. Officer had a back up gun (most likely a revolver). If his main service revolver had its crane bent, the situation would have been exactly the same - dead offender and need for maintenance work.

Absolute declarations are absolutely dumb.

 

[MR_A]

revolvers VS AUTO

I love my 1911 45 auto, but i would not be without my .357 revolver it is a do all do everything from nightstand duty to deep woods carry. I was a policeman for 12 years and a probation/parole officer for for 27 years and have seen a lot of calibers come and go and some have come full circle again the 45 and the 357, even though the 40 cal. In going strong also. I would not stay up late at night pondering thoughts of which is best i have seen the distruction both can do, and they do the job well.

 

[PT1911]

is it so easy to bend the crane of a revolver? hit a dog and break the gun?

 

[cluttonfred]

Question...in the U.S. Army and Marine Corps or other militaries, how prevalent are handguns. Do all combat troops get one these days? If so, I could definitely see a role even for something like a DAO, small-frame .38 special as a lightweight, reliable BUG for all.

Handguns are, of course, not the ideal combat weapon, but if I had to rely on a handgun alone to get me through a combat situation, I think I could do a lot worse than a 6" barrel .357 magnum. I would be trading capacity for long range and ruggedness, not a bad deal.

 

[Vern Humphrey]

is it so easy to bend the crane of a revolver? hit a dog and break the gun?

Yep, in fact you can ruin a good revolver by simply snapping the cylinder shut as they do in the movies.

 

[wheelgunslinger]

you can ruin a good revolver by simply snapping the cylinder shut as they do in the movies.

That's right.
They are somewhat delicate Victorian era works of art in various respects.
Their points of failure are different from those of the average pistol like a 1911, but that doesn't mean they don't have their own Achilles' heel.

 

[rogertc1]

"It would only make sense if the military dropped the 9x19 and adopted the .44 Mag or something"

If so we would all be using Desert eagles?

 

[Gary K]

"Are there any circumstances where the simplicity of operation of a revolver, particularly a DAO revolver, might actually make it better choice as a combat sidearm than an autopistol?"

Absolutely. Speaking as a recently returned Air Advisor who worked hand in hand helping a foriegn military try to rebuild its force after we effectively destroyed it, I can say without question I'd have preferred a revolver to the issue 9mm I carried. While prepping to deploy we knew we had to trust our lives to the foriegners we were educating, but had to also realize a couple of them might turn on us any moment when we were alone in one-on-one situations, so we trained for it. The 9mm Beretta can be taken out of battery very quickly by an opponent in close quarters during a hand to hand engagement, so our TTP accounted for it, but wasn't as good as I'd have liked. Wouldn't be so easy with a revolver to take it out of battery, and if I had to pull it during a one-on-one scuffle I'd have been as or more effective with a revolver than with the restrictive TTP forced onto me from a weapon not designed for engaging within breathing distance. Simple fact. Anyone who gives a blanket answer that a revolver doesn't have its place compared to autos in the military environment of today hasn't paid attention to the new battlefield environment we're in. It's more diverse than most people realize.

 

[SharpsDressedMan]

"Wouldn't be so easy with a revolver to take it out of battery, and if I had to pull it during a one-on-one scuffle" Ever grab the cylinder on an uncocked revover?

 

[Gary K]

"Ever grab the cylinder on an uncocked revover?"

Most BGs will grab the closest piece of weapon to them in a scuffle, and attempt to get leverage and gain possession of the weapon or at least try to control where it points, not reach past the barrel and grab the cylinder. Your point is taken, though. In fact we discussed at length as one of the cons. End result of discussing this and other methods of disabling both weapon types resulted in most of us believing a revolver had an advantage in this situation. Of course, so did a good combat knife carried on the other side.