My Thoughts on the FN FAL

[HexHead]

One of my favorite movies when I was a kid was, "The Odd, Angry Shot." It was an Australian Vietnam film and the FAL played an extensive role. From that point forward, I have always loved the look of the FAL and wanted one for my collection. While working in a gun store during college, I had access to an extensive collection of rifles and machine guns. After using the FAL, I was just not that enamoured with it to ever buy one. The sights were OK, but the trigger was horrible on the few we shot. From time to time I get the itch to buy one, but always just end up buying more 5.56 for my AR's and shooting the heck out of them. I realize that they are two distinctly different animals, but they just don't fit any realistic need I have at this point. I still think they are very cool and if I had tons of cash would own one or two just for fun.

Here is the trailer, there is some good FAL action towards the end..

I didn't see a single FAL actually fired in that clip. Mostly M16s.

 

[GBExpat]

... Are the M14-M1A as reliable as the FAL? I know they are more accurate, but I'm just curious.

FWIW ...

I have experienced the same level of reliability (or lack thereof) issues with the 2 M14 Variants that I built as with my FAL Variants; none.

With the first FAL Variant that I built (off of an StG-58 kit) I could reliably hit golfballs from 100yds over irons.

I never shot at the golfballs with either my carbine or my FrankenFAL, so all I can say is that they are more than acceptably accurate ... for me. O'course, I don't do any long range shooting and I've never been much interested in paper-punching once I have a rifle sighted-in.

 

[Acera]

I didn't see a single FAL actually fired in that clip. Mostly M16s.

It was in the movie.

 

[Meplat 308]

I've had a Century L1A1 sporter chambered in .308 for about ten years now. I've heard bad things about the Century builds but I guess I'm one of the lucky ones. I can hold 6" groups at 200 yards offhand. It has the DSA over the dustcover optics rail and I run a Burris 3X prism. What I really like is it will accept both the inch and metric pattern mags.

Haven't had any misfires but once in a while it'll fail to feed, usually I can trace it to a combination of mag choice & ammo.

 

[Ironicaintit]

I have a century built R1A1 (ban era L1A1) that I really like. ergonomically, it is my favorite semiauto 308.
but man, is she picky about mags! metrics fit, but lead to serious feeding issues.
with inch mags, she runs just fine.
I don't worry about the optics mounting issues, I'm fine with the irons.

I have much respect for Dieudonné Saive. the man surely knew how to make a weapon feel like an extension of yourself

 

[jimherb]

My only complaint about the FAL is the weight. I thought it would be perfect for Afghanistan.

 

[kimberkid]

First of all, the FAL isn't a cheap rifle nor is it cheap to feed, but beyond that I think a lot of the reason is that for the new breed of shooters, the trigger is too heavy and the recoil is too harsh ... these days if it doesn't have a 3-4 pound trigger it's crap. If they can't mount some sort of optic or RDS, they can't hit anything, so it's crap ... in other PC words, it's not user friendly

Meanwhile, a similar cartridge did become popular in the Nagant. I think the Nagant made the transition to popularity because it was cheap and cheap to shoot, so people learned to cope with the "crap" trigger and "crap" sights then actually learned to shoot beyond 50 yards.
The other thing is that when it was hinging on popularity the aftermarket latched on to it with optic rails, bolt kits and stocks and grabbed the attention of "builders" and sales took off again

It's kind of like what happened with the life line of the Mauser (which is a much more elegant design than the Nagant) ... but then the supply of cheap surplus ran out and the market dropped it like a hot potato ... and when the stores of Nagants run dry, the prices will skyrocket but then like a shooting star, will burn out & only the "old timers" will have or want them!

The first time I shot a surplus Mauser (with surplus ammo) ... It had a steel butt plate like most of the guns of that time ... I shot about 20 rounds and instantly had a much greater appreciation of those boys in WWI and WWII ... I could barely move my arm for a couple days, and it was a good 10 days before I wanted to shoot any long gun again.

 

[Clark]

When I was building FALs the surplus 308 ammo was 10 cents a shot delivered from Shotgun News. There was no internet, not the www. There was only usenet, like email and rec.guns.

FALs were good for shooting up the trail. Huge dirt clods flew in the air. The AR15s with the wimpy 223 made little pitiful dirt clods.

 

[armoredman]

I have always wanted an FAL carbine...but on the very rare occasions I had the money, I couldn't find one before an emergency took the money away. Perhaps someday, but as I get older, the chances are becoming slimmer.

 

[kimberkid]

When I was building FALs the surplus 308 ammo was 10 cents a shot delivered from Shotgun News. There was no internet, not the www. There was only usenet, like email and rec.guns.

FALs were good for shooting up the trail. Huge dirt clods flew in the air. The AR15s with the wimpy 223 made little pitiful dirt clods.

Yep. It must be 25 years ago, but I've still got 3 cases and a couple sleeves left of surplus (I think it's Hirtenburger but it may be the Argentine) left, each case has 5, 200 round sleeves sealed in that heavy green plastic ... $99 a case at our local gun show. I was going to keep 5 cases back but ... 1.5 - 2 moa out to 300 yards is the furthest I've shot it.

I remember those days ... waiting 3 weeks to a month on an order was normal ... now the web would drive a company out of business for service like that. Still, looking back I wish I'd bought more ... of course I also wish I'd bought a bunch of HK auto sears too ...

 

[salt&battery]

First of all, the FAL isn't a cheap rifle nor is it cheap to feed, but beyond that I think a lot of the reason is that for the new breed of shooters, the trigger is too heavy and the recoil is too harsh ... these days if it doesn't have a 3-4 pound trigger it's crap. If they can't mount some sort of optic or RDS, they can't hit anything, so it's crap ... in other PC words, it's not user friendly

Meanwhile, a similar cartridge did become popular in the Nagant. I think the Nagant made the transition to popularity because it was cheap and cheap to shoot, so people learned to cope with the "crap" trigger and "crap" sights then actually learned to shoot beyond 50 yards.
The other thing is that when it was hinging on popularity the aftermarket latched on to it with optic rails, bolt kits and stocks and grabbed the attention of "builders" and sales took off again

It's kind of like what happened with the life line of the Mauser (which is a much more elegant design than the Nagant) ... but then the supply of cheap surplus ran out and the market dropped it like a hot potato ... and when the stores of Nagants run dry, the prices will skyrocket but then like a shooting star, will burn out & only the "old timers" will have or want them!

The first time I shot a surplus Mauser (with surplus ammo) ... It had a steel butt plate like most of the guns of that time ... I shot about 20 rounds and instantly had a much greater appreciation of those boys in WWI and WWII ... I could barely move my arm for a couple days, and it was a good 10 days before I wanted to shoot any long gun again.

come on I shot 1000's of 8MM out of Mausers and recoil was not much at all. rifle is heavy enough to absorb a lot of it

 

[Sarge]

Geeze! Everyone bitches about "recoil" from rifles that almost have No recoil! By that I mean most 308s!
I have hunted with either a K98k or G/K 43 - both in 8mm - for 65 yrs and I find recoil NOT to be a problem!
On the other hand I find that I notice almost NO recoil from my FN/FAL!!! Even on Full Auto!!!
Sarge

 

[Robert]

While everyone is different I have to agree that out of the heavy FAL, recoil is not a problem. But them my elk rifle is a 375H&H so maybe it's just me...

 

[Clark]

My 338 WinMag BAR with large Limbsaver recoil pad 250 gr bullets at 2600 fps is NOT painful to shoot.
But my 45 Colt Win94 with 250 gr bullets at 1500 fps is very painful to shoot.

Per my tests and calculations, the threshold of pain is 20 psi on the shoulder. That peak pressure is mitigated by spreading the force over area and time.

 

[salt&battery]

My 338 WinMag BAR with large Limbsaver recoil pad 250 gr bullets at 2600 fps is NOT painful to shoot.
But my 45 Colt Win94 with 250 gr bullets at 1500 fps is very painful to shoot.

Per my tests and calculations, the threshold of pain is 20 psi on the shoulder. That peak pressure is mitigated by spreading the force over area and time.

also stock design would make recoil worse or easy on the shoulder. lever actions to me have a stock design to give maximum recoil to the shooter

 

[GBExpat]

Interesting ...

FWIW, I consider my FAL Variants to be relative sweethearts, recoil-wise (shooting military ammo)

I can still recall learning to shoot the bringback K98k that my grandfather gifted me in the late '60s. My cousin and I shot it quite a bit that summer (both military & reloads) and quickly learned the importance of holding it properly & tightly to our shoulders. The buttplate is steel, but it is also w-i-d-e (on a ~10 pound rifle), which probably saved us some grief.

The recoil was notable but we shot that thing all summer off of teeshirts or skin with no bruising or distress, either immediate or delayed.

Now (in the near future) I will have to grab that rifle & a few clips of milsurp and walk over to the farm to see what effect it has on my, now, 65-year-old shoulder.

 

[ttarp]

A K98 isn't bad standing or sitting, but shooting 20 rounds of S&B prone with tshirt leaves my bony shoulder sore for a day or two. Never found a semi .308 that was uncomfortable to shoot in any position though.

 

[Merle1]

Interesting ...

FWIW, I consider my FAL Variants to be relative sweethearts, recoil-wise (shooting military ammo)

I can still recall learning to shoot the bringback K98k that my grandfather gifted me in the late '60s. My cousin and I shot it quite a bit that summer (both military & reloads) and quickly learned the importance of holding it properly & tightly to our shoulders. The buttplate is steel, but it is also w-i-d-e (on a ~10 pound rifle), which probably saved us some grief.

The recoil was notable but we shot that thing all summer off of teeshirts or skin with no bruising or distress, either immediate or delayed.

Now (in the near future) I will have to grab that rifle & a few clips of milsurp and walk over to the farm to see what effect it has on my, now, 65-year-old shoulder.

Yep, but with an arthritic shoulder that steel buttplate still hurts.

 

[Clark]

When I was a kid, my father's shoulder would get all black and blue from recoil.
At 85 pounds, I could shoot the same gun and not get bruised. It pushed me back a couple feet, but I did not bruise.

 

[M1key]

Elmer Keith shot some bigguns and he was a little guy...

M

 

[Ironicaintit]

Elmer Keith shot some bigguns and he was a little guy...

M

Little guys hurt less because their mass gets pushed away easier.
Same reason that shooting from prone tends to hurt more than from offhand.

I can shoot the FAL all day.... But if I put the same cartridges into my Winchester mdl 88, I've had enough after 20 rounds.

 

[kimberkid]

come on I shot 1000's of 8MM out of Mausers and recoil was not much at all. rifle is heavy enough to absorb a lot of it

I don't know, maybe I'm just a wimp but I didn't have that problem with my 303 enfeilds or other 308s maybe it's because it was machine gun ammo maybe my position on the bench just wasn't conducive to this particular gun but I haven't had this problem before or since ... when I down loaded the ammo from 57 grains to 40 it was fine

 

[salt&battery]

I don't know, maybe I'm just a wimp but I didn't have that problem with my 303 enfeilds or other 308s maybe it's because it was machine gun ammo maybe my position on the bench just wasn't conducive to this particular gun but I haven't had this problem before or since ... when I down loaded the ammo from 57 grains to 40 it was fine

at least you found a load to shoot with comfort. with full power loads try a pad between the butt plate and your shoulder. if you were a young guy you would laugh at the recoil