NEVER use 147 gr AMMO in a 9mm pistol?

[bluetopper]

The majority, it seems, only shoot their guns to maim and kill? Seems no one speaks of the pure fun and enjoyment of shooting?

I like shooting the X ring at 25yds. with my 9mm 1911 and I do it every weekend and I find my 147gr cast lead reloads perform the best for me in that regard.

 

[1SOW]

parasite +1 (Texans like to play with guns while smiling)

If you check the competition forums, you'll find 9mm 147gr is VERY popular.

It's low percieved recoil, tight groups and ability to knock down heavy steel targets make it a successful round for competition.

I don't use 147gr, but I believe most competitors who do use fmj rn.

CZ 75 users have to slightly reshape the end of the slide lock to reliably clear the 147gr bullet while cycling.

 

[rscalzo]

My department has used Winchesters 147 grain HP 9mm Ranger SXT load for over ten years in their S&W 2nd. & 3rd. Gen semi-autos. Reliability has been virtually absolute. I never felt the load was the best for that caliber and as stated, probably better suited to suppressed weapons.

However the standards are set by the department. Fortunately I was able to get a 40 S&W option added and most switched over using Winchester's SXT/Ranger T 165 grain loads.

 

[SharpsDressedMan]

I have several 9mm guns that have been fitted for use with sound suppressors, and I use 147gr ammo all the time. The Winchester FMJ-FP bullet is loaded for practice, and the Remington Golden Sabre HP is loaded for maximum effect with subsonic 9mm. A walther P99, Browning Hi Power, and Colt 1911 w/9mm barrel all work fine with both loads. I have NOT had to modify the feed ramps, or do any special reliability alterations to get good results in my guns.

[/IMG]

 

[mete]

The 147 gr 9mm was based on stupidity !! An agency was looking for an accurate round for a SMG for use with a supressor .That's all , nothing about expansion or anything else.. They came up with the 147. Some dummies then concluded that this was the answer to all 9mm problems !
Of course it was a poor performer on the street as there had been no effort to make a proper expanding bullet.
After many failures the ammo companies redesigned the bullets and the second generation ammo performed well. When you read about ammo tests remember that ammo is constantly redesigned and date of tests can be very significant..Todays 147 performs though like any ammo make sure it functions perfectly in YOUR gun.

 

[SharpsDressedMan]

I was loading .38/.357 158 gr. bullets in the 9mm by sizing them down in a .356 sizer die before the ammo companies ever created a 147grain load. The purpose was maximum power in a subsonic load. The reason the 147 load got interest was the FBI's Miami Shootout failure, where light bullets failed to penetrate a bad guys arm and dig deep enough into his chest to stop him...the flesh wound on the arm basically drained the bullet's inertia enough that the chest wound was superficial. They deduced that a heavier bullet would have penetrated deeper. Bullet development enhanced the structure, expansion, and penetration of almost all new bullets, be they 9mm, .45, etc. Some agencies are still using the 147grain hollowpoint, and are very happy with it, with many sucessful police shootings on record for performance results.

 

[Island Beretta]

have used the sxts 147g and nary a problem. in a 92fs very little recoil.

 

[Island Beretta]

..btw not to cause an uproar here but in field tests, i have had 147s penetrating targets that the 115s did not.. the 147s however did not expand as consistently as the 115s did with a g19 and g17 as it did with the 92fs.. i attribute this to the longer 92fs barrel.

 

[Philo_Beddoe]

147 gr is fine, its actually outperforms many of the +p and +p+ 115gr and 123gr gee whiz loads

those light fast loads tend to over expand and not penetrate enough (FBI min is 12 inches, ideal is 12-15, 18 is over penetration, bullet should expand at least to .50 too)

http://ammo.ar15.com/project/Self_Defense_Ammo_FAQ/index.htm#9mm

http://www.firearmstactical.com/ammo_data/9mm.htm

 

[Philo_Beddoe]

generally the heavier the bullet the more penetration in a given caliber

momentum

in hollow points the faster the bullet the quicker it will expand, which can be good and bad, it means a larger wound channel, but it may expand so fast as to not reach the vitals.

 

[106rr]

Many local PDs using the 9mm have switched to the Federal 147gr HST2. They report excellent results on the street. This ammo is supposed to be LE only but it sometimes shows up on the regular market.

 

[Lonestar49]

147gr JHP's works for me

...

I too, switched to Winchester 147gr SXT JHP's with my Sig P229R CT 9mm for HD/SD.

Couldn't be happier with accuracy at SD/HD ranges with less recoil and fast follow-up shots using them for about a year now.


Ls

 

[MichaelK]

I developed this load a decade ago. My cast Lyman 358477, sized and lubed to .356" weighs 147 grains in #2 alloy. Loaded with 6.0 grains of Blue Dot, it became my standard 9mm load. I've been shooting it for 10 years before I found out it didn't work.


It looks bizare, but yes, it does feed flawlessly, and shoots fine.

 

[Onmilo]

I am not a fan of 147 grain loads in a 9mm.

As stated earlier, where this particular grain weight load really shines is in suppressed pistols to keep sound levels to the absolute minimum.

The loads are not any better or effective than +P 158 grain loads fired from a short barrel revolver and that means they aren't bad, they just aren't great.

 

[LeonCarr]

After lots of trial and error, the most accurate load in my buddy's P89DC 9mm used 147 grain Hornady XTPs loaded with Blue Dot. The groups were half the size of the groups shot with 115 grain Winchester White Box. It was also not the first P89 I have seen that liked the heavier bullets better.

Also, I haven't heard any of the 147 haters volunteering to get shot with one .

Just my .02,
LeonCarr

 

[sigma 40ve]

I use Winchester 147 Rangers in my carry nines. I have always had good performance out of them.

Not to stray but, I use 147's reloaded in my 9mm's for pistol games. Lot of other people do too.

 

[WRGADog]

147 grain has worked fine for me

My PD ammo is the 147 grain Winchester Ranger Bonded JHP. I shoot this round in each of my 9mm's and have experienced no problems whatsoever. This includes 9mm's mfg by Beretta, Walther, S&W, Springfield, and CZ.

 

[KBintheSLC]

A 147 gr. 9mm bullet of modern design (not a cheap standard bullet like the WWB) can be expected to perform well at the lower velocities of this heavy-for-caliber projectile. A cheaper, old-school 147 (like the WWB) probably can't.

I have to politely disagree with you on your opinion about WWB 147g JHP's. All of my testing with these bullets indicates that they perform very well for a discount loading... comparable to premium loads. The ammo is 100% reliable in my Glock's, it expands and penetrates well through denim covered wet phone books, and it even maintains its jacket integrity after passing through an auto windshield.

I use these as a cost-effective way to fill my spare mag.

 

[Shawn Dodson]

Chuckhawks says:

Now it is time to impart some crucial information: NEVER use 147 grain ammo in a 9mm pistol! There was a stupid fad for 147 grain hollowpoints a few years ago, and many were suckered into buying these weak, worthless and malfunction-prone rounds. I don't care what you've heard: never use any 9mm hollowpoint heavier than 125 grains. 147 grain hollowpoints often jam in many popular 9mm guns like the Browning Hi-Power, SIG, Beretta 92, S&W and Glock. Ignore the gun magazine hype and stick to what works. If you want to gamble, go to Reno. Don't gamble with your life. 147 grain ammo sucks.

The absolute lack of any credible information to support the claims being made should be a red flag to everybody.

 

[EOC_Jason]

1. Register domain for a few bucks.
2. Post whatever you want on said domain.
3. Watch and see how many people blindly think said content on said domain is gospel.

 

[silversport]

as I remember it the 147GR 9MM round was made to be subsonic to be fired through suppressors...

I remember choosing the 147GR round (Winchester) when the 147GR was brand new and was going to be the next big thing...it was under 1000fps and some had problems with it...no one at my department but some reported it so...

Later I remember a department my brother works for using the 147GR (Winchester copper colored jacket) used in an actual shooting where the officer made two good body hits where the offender gave up but was not killed...more hated the round (opinions formed from rumor)...they gave up on it as did many other departments that were using it...

We gave up on it and went to the Illinois State Police load of a 115GR Winchester Silvertip in +P+ and later replaced that with the Winchester Black Talon 127GR +P+...

Development of the 147GR round continued and is still made...I haven't heard horror stories as I did in it's infancy...
I suspect some problems were from pistols with springs tuned to higher slide velocities that the initial 147GR bullets didn't equal and it being the wrong bullet for the task (because we didn't have suppressors)...

IIRC we carried 147GR Winchester bullets in Silvertip, Black Talon, and Ranger configs before giving it up for the ISP load and settling on the 127+P+ Ranger T...those with 9MM carry Speer Gold Dot in 124GR today but I don't make that decision any more...

Bill

 

[Kurt S.]

I've used 147 gr FMJ on steel plates from an FEG (Hi-Power knockoff) and a Ruger P89, no problem. Also used it as a plinking round from HiPoint 995 carbine but for some reason it is not as accurate as 115 grain.

There's a picture floating around the web with a comparison of 9mm 147-124 gr, .357 SIG, a couple of .40s, and .45 ACP hollowpoints in gelatin. Penetration and cavity sizes all look really similar. To a ballistics nonexpert like me it's a convincer that I wouldn't want to get shot with any of them. Looks like the 147 grain would be a good defensive round.

I think the picture might be on Shawn Dodson's website, but I haven't checked.

 

[Boba Fett]

Can't imagine why the 147gr would be a problem

The 147gr being a fad sounds like a complete BS opinion.

I prefer the 147gr hollow points if my pistol will feed them well.

Perfect example is my full size Baby Eagle. It loves the stuff and seems to be more accurate with a heavier bullet. For defense, I load it up with the Winchester RA9B (147gr bonded) (on the Winchester link, be sure to scroll over to the right...more types of material tested).

But I don't always use it either.
I still need to do some more tests with it, but thus far my Walther PPS doesn't seem to like the Winchester RA9B. Doesn't always feed it well. I've only fed a few brands/types of HP through it so far, but it only had a problem with the RA9B. Easy enough to fix, I just carry the brands/types that worked.

 

[Cayoot]

The majority, it seems, only shoot their guns to maim and kill? Seems no one speaks of the pure fun and enjoyment of shooting?

I like shooting the X ring at 25yds. with my 9mm 1911 and I do it every weekend and I find my 147gr cast lead reloads perform the best for me in that regard.

Would you please state what profile that bullet is? I'm planning on getting a 9 mm in probably a Glock 34 (I only own revolvers at this time). I was wanting to get a good feeding 147 grain bullet with as wide a meplat as possible (I don't like putting my faith in hollow points...penetration and placement is all I care about).

And yes, I know about lead bullets and Glocks, but I know a couple of guys who only shoot home cast bullets (I'm a caster also) in their glocks and have never had an issue.

Thank

 

[Cayoot]

I developed this load a decade ago. My cast Lyman 358477, sized and lubed to .356" weighs 147 grains in #2 alloy. Loaded with 6.0 grains of Blue Dot, it became my standard 9mm load. I've been shooting it for 10 years before I found out it didn't work.


It looks bizare, but yes, it does feed flawlessly, and shoots fine.

I like that bullet! What gun are you shooting it out of?