New 7MM PRC will it kill the 6.8 Western?

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12Bravo20 said:
The cheapest I can find for the 108Gr ammo is $39.99 from a reputable online retailer. Yes some of the sellers on ammoseek.com are cheaper but have shoddy reputations that I just don't trust.. And of course my 6 ARC build prefers the 108Gr stuff best.
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I'm just finishing my arc build so I don't know yet what factory ammo it would like so I got a box of each. Hope to get it finished in a few weeks and shoot it and buy what ammo it likes for brass.
 
AJC1 said:
6.8 was doa because it was launched into a covid market. Timing matters. The 7 is joining an already established family of cartridges. Im not jumping but i do find it interesting. Its compition is the saum, rum and 284, which is well established. Ill wait and see.
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6 arc was launched during covid and is becoming very popular, Winchester has about the worst rep for not supporting there cartridges. Think on launch there were 2 rifles in 6.8 over 6 guns for the arc and many more weeks after. At least with the arc you can make some brass for the 6.8w you would have to form from even more hard to find brass to make it. Not saying the 6.8 is bad I have the 7wsm and really like it, but Winchester will be Winchester.
 
Between Winchester and Browning they have over 40 models chambered in 6.8 Western. But the only other rifle I could find with a quick search chambered in 6.8 W was a Fierce model for well over $3000. I'm sure custom makers will chamber for it same as they will chamber for whatever you pay for them in any other flavor.

Whereas 6.5 PRC is available from more gunmakers than I can count on the fingers of both of my hands including Ruger, Howa, Tikka, Christensen Arms, and Bergara. Savage alone has more than 20 models.

Ammo prices for the 6.8 W seem to be close to double what the 6.5 PRC from Norma is. For Hornady in 6.5 PRC they are about even.

Before I purchased my 6.5 PRC rifles (Savages and Bergara) I looked hard at the 6.8 Western and had the opportunity to shoot a fellow's Browning X-Bolt Max Long Range in 6.8 W at my range. It shot fairly well and was a good looking rifle. But the guy said he wishes he did not buy it because he was having a difficult time getting a gunsmith to work on his X-Bolt. Something about their reputation for being difficult to work on the barrels because of the how finely threaded they are or something. I have no experience with them, so that's entirely hearsay on my part. But it spooked me enough to get a Savage in 6.5 PRC first instead, knowing that I can change barrels and work on it myself if needed.

When news broke of the 7 PRC a couple months ago my interest in the 6.8 W pretty much died. I've got the 6.5 PRCs and a couple .300 PRCs, so I'll wait and see how the 7 PRC shakes out. I think it will fill the gap between the 6.5 and .300 fairly well, but my hunting is limited to Texas whitetail deer and hogs so I don't need a Western big game rifle and if I did the .300 PRC would probably fit the bill nicely. I can always download it with 168 or 178 grain bullets to get close to the 6.8 loads. There is an old fellow at my range who does just that with his Ruger Precision Rifle in .300 PRC and with his 168 grain load it shoots like a pussycat.

If some other rifle or ammo makers jump onto the 6.8 W in the next year or so I may take another look. As is I'll have to see what the 7 PRC does that I can't already do with what I have. So y'all educate me - what niche is the 7 PRC going to fill?
 
3-4 of the 6 or so local shops have 6.8w on the shelf, I'm pretty sure it's the same ammo that's been there since the round and ammo were released. Price of 6.5 prc ammo is coming down seen some new Norma for $47 and looked online and seen it for about $30 a box but have to look more $30 just seems to cheap, need to find some from a more reputable site.
 
I don't know anything about 6,8W except it uses a ..270 bullet like the .270 Winchester. And that cal was a one of a kind at the time. It got a lot of press and popularity by the gunwriters of the time because it was a fast/flat loading. Then the .280 Remington came along. Both based on the 30-06 case A common .284/7mm cal that should have made the .270 obsolete but it was loaded to lower pressure because of the Rem 740/760 rifles. So it hung on. A .270 will do nothing that a .264 or .284 cal will do except still be oddball with less bullet varieties and weights to chose from. JMHO
 
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The 7 PRC will make a hole in the sales of the 6.8 Western for it to die in largely because the 6.8 Western is not getting manufacturers support for production rifles AND ammo. Most hunters don’t reload, so they have to rely on the retail stores / manufacturers for ammo. It’s not just that——Browning and Winchester are making 6.8 Western rifles with different twist rates. WTH??? Hornady had solid support with rifle makers before the 6 ARC was announced publicly. The Dept of Defense production contract was fulfilled so the public part of it could proceed. Hornady is pushing the ammo for the rifle makers. Big H does their marketing very well (and they are right with what shooters want).

The 6.8 is getting military backing but it is not the same rifles and cartridges as the civilians will have access to. It think the Western is going to fall into the category of “ OK, but not better than the ________ I’m using and like.” If I was starting over with building a battery of rifles for any purposes, the 6.8 Western would not be in it.
 
I think the 7 PRC will supplant the 6.8 Western. HOWEVER, the 7 PRC won't be a success like the 6.5 Creedmoor for couple reasons: 1) It's going to be spendy if you are buying factory ammo and 2) It's going to have some recoil. I can't see recreational shooters leaning towards it like they did the 6.5 Creed. I will give it that the specs on the 7 PRC look great. If I was in the market for a new elk round, I would look hard at it.
 
JeeperCreeper said:
My conspiracy theory is that the competition purposefully snubbed 6.8 Western.

Hornady refused to make components, dies, ammo for it.

No other brands hopped on, but those same brands had 7 PRC rifles spooled up and ready to go on release day from Hornady.

I wonder what kind of golf course deals were going on...
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Conspiracy? Naw. Every other manufacturer has watched Winchester step on their own…tails…for years when it comes to cartridge development. The WSM debacle assured that Winchester/Browning will never receive support from other major players again. And Hornady was never going to make dies for the 6.8W knowing that they were planning to bring the 7 PRC to market. It’s not a conspiracy. It’s just good business sense.
 
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A slight change of cartridges but there are common things with a 6.8 Western:
The 300 and 338 Ruger Compact Magnums didn’t take over the market because they really only offered long-action performance in a shorter action. In other words, no appreciable gain unless you count barrel length and a shorter bolt throw. Still, either can do the job if you’re a good enough hunter. Hornady had the ammo production——so sometimes a great design and ammo supply isn’t enough to overcome the ordinary, established cartridges in the market. The 6.8 is not offering a great charge for hunters despite the rifles being well made and capable of more accuracy than the hunter can maintain, usually.
Where these cartridges flattened it, the 375 Ruger offers speed over the tried and true 375 H&H and standard length actions. I inherited a 375 H&H so there is no need for me to look for a faster whimper of game on the High Plains.
 
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I see the 7PRC as a successful proposition, especially if you’re into long range hunting and/or competitive LR shooting. Hornady already makes good brass and I’m sure others will start making it. If competition is your thing I think it will over take the .284 Win., a clear benchmark for LR applications. Look at the advantages: No rebated rim and a longer neck than the 284.

For hunters, it appears to be a better mousetrap than a lot of our wildcats (think WSM, SAUM, PRC,etc.) and the 7mm is the darling of the hunting crowd. Why fool with necking up/down when you have this case, and it will likely out sell the 6.5 and 6.8 crowd. JMHO. Kudos to Hornady for innovation.
 
troy fairweather said:
The 6.8 was doa, the tikka guys are going to love the 7 prc been looking for a magnum tikka myself.
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That's my plan, I'd like to make a 18"-20" 7mm PRC on a Tikka magnum action, maybe a proof CF or a factory profile steel barrel. It'd be perfect for Tikka to offer from the factory, but they are usually pretty slow on the draw with new cartridges, so I'm not holding my breath.

12Bravo20 said:
The only problem I see is if Hornady is the sole producer of the ammo, it could be hard to get. IMHO, that is what is keeping 6mm ARC from really taking off.
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I probably won't jump until Hornady has cases widely available for the 7mm PRC. I've had similar issues with my ARC, I haven't actually seen a bag of cases available, so I've been buying the regularly available factory loads in my area, shooting them and loading those cases. That's been a viable tactic with 108gr ELD (which my rifles like) for $26/box, but it's not going to fly with $60-$70/box 7mm PRC.

On the upside for the ARC, I heard Peterson is supposed to start making 6ARC cases ~Jan '23, and Alpha is considering production as well.
 
JeeperCreeper said:
My conspiracy theory is that the competition purposefully snubbed 6.8 Western.

Hornady refused to make components, dies, ammo for it.
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Not uncommon... Remington 'snubbed' the 6.5 Creedmoor for a long time, and same with the .243 when it came out. Ruger and Hornady 'snubbed' the .300 WSMs. All the makers seemed to 'snub' the .338 Federal. If a round gets popular enough they change their tune.
 
Gtscotty said:
That's my plan, I'd like to make a 18"-20" 7mm PRC on a Tikka magnum action, maybe a proof CF or a factory profile steel barrel. It'd be perfect for Tikka to offer from the factory, but they are usually pretty slow on the draw with new cartridges, so I'm not holding my breath.



I probably won't jump until Hornady has cases widely available for the 7mm PRC. I've had similar issues with my ARC, I haven't actually seen a bag of cases available, so I've been buying the regularly available factory loads in my area, shooting them and loading those cases. That's been a viable tactic with 108gr ELD (which my rifles like) for $26/box, but it's not going to fly with $60-$70/box 7mm PRC.

On the upside for the ARC, I heard Peterson is supposed to start making 6ARC cases ~Jan '23, and Alpha is considering production as well.
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I think I’ve saved some once fired 6 ARC brass if you want it. Just PM me. No cost and I can ship it to you if I have it.
 
AJC1 said:
6.8 was doa because it was launched into a covid market. Timing matters. The 7 is joining an already established family of cartridges. Im not jumping but i do find it interesting. Its compition is the saum, rum and 284, which is well established. Ill wait and see.
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There’s quite a bit to unpack here.

There have been other cartridges introduced during covid which have rocketed past the 6.8 Western - hell, the 6 ARC was even LEAKED for months by its SAAMI standardization publication long before its commercial announcements, and guys were drooling to get barrels and dies made. So much so that some guys were ordering reamers before the commercial launch! Covid isn’t a good excuse.

Yes, the 7 PRC is being introduced as a new member to a 4yr old case family (which already had rebranded themselves from their parent cartridge) - but it’s false to claim it’s entering steep competition from the RSAUM’s or blocked by existing 7mm cartridges. Why do we have so much “saturation” in the 7mm market? Or the 30cal market? When the 6.5 PRC and 300 PRC came out, folks said the 6.5 PRC wouldn’t make it because it couldn’t keep up with the 7 mags, and because it didn’t have enough quality heavy weight bullets available to make use of its case capacity, and folks said the 300 PRC was just another redundant round on top of over a dozen existing 30 cal magnums… yet here we are, both are kicking ass and taking names in their respective markets. All of these 7mm and 30 cal cartridges exist because PEOPLE WANT THEM!!! We had a dozen 30 cal mags before the WSM’s came out 20yrs ago, and now we have over a half dozen more since then. Of course… it is obvious that the 284win has never really enjoyed public acclaim anywhere outside of LR benchrest & some F-class shooters, which certainly don’t rule the shooting sports zeitgeist - and seem to have near zero influence on hunting cartridge preferences.

Also, don’t forget - Remington RUM and RSAUM brass has been quite difficult to source since the very beginning, has been relatively poor quality - albeit typically more consistent than the Winchester WSM supply, and naturally, nobody else has been making any of this brass except their respective mommies… oh, yeah, both of which experienced bankruptcies… so now we have a sole source RUM and RSAUM IP owner which just adopted that particular red headed stepchild, and Olin’s just doing Olin things and making **** brass to ruin its own legacy… oh wait… who else is making RUM brass with a relatively reliable supply? Hornady… nice as a manufacturer to have your cake and eat it too…

And frankly - finally - there is a massive market of folks out there buying stuff they don’t understand for a purpose they pretend to pursue, and having a “responsibly bigger” hammer than your brother-in-law, or the dude at work is always a desire of some folks. A lot of folks bought 6.5 PRC’s just because they’re bigger and faster than 6.5 creeds. A lot of those folks will buy 7 PRC’s just because they’re more powerful than 6.5 PRC’s. The 7 is not yet long enough to demand too much powder or require an over-length magazine like the 300, so there’s a specific tolerance threshold there where guys can brag on their big truck without buying a Peterbilt… There have been a million Ruger Precision Rifles sold since inception - do you think all of those folks - or even 1/3 of those folks - are shooting competitions, or even shooting long range with them? Not a chance.

So I don’t think any of those particular arguments hold water.
 
Varminterror said:
There’s quite a bit to unpack here.

There have been other cartridges introduced during covid which have rocketed past the 6.8 Western - hell, the 6 ARC was even LEAKED for months by its SAAMI standardization publication long before its commercial announcements, and guys were drooling to get barrels and dies made. So much so that some guys were ordering reamers before the commercial launch! Covid isn’t a good excuse.

Yes, the 7 PRC is being introduced as a new member to a 4yr old case family (which already had rebranded themselves from their parent cartridge) - but it’s false to claim it’s entering steep competition from the RSAUM’s or blocked by existing 7mm cartridges. Why do we have so much “saturation” in the 7mm market? Or the 30cal market? When the 6.5 PRC and 300 PRC came out, folks said the 6.5 PRC wouldn’t make it because it couldn’t keep up with the 7 mags, and because it didn’t have enough quality heavy weight bullets available to make use of its case capacity, and folks said the 300 PRC was just another redundant round on top of over a dozen existing 30 cal magnums… yet here we are, both are kicking ass and taking names in their respective markets. All of these 7mm and 30 cal cartridges exist because PEOPLE WANT THEM!!! We had a dozen 30 cal mags before the WSM’s came out 20yrs ago, and now we have over a half dozen more since then. Of course… it is obvious that the 284win has never really enjoyed public acclaim anywhere outside of LR benchrest & some F-class shooters, which certainly don’t rule the shooting sports zeitgeist - and seem to have near zero influence on hunting cartridge preferences.

Also, don’t forget - Remington RUM and RSAUM brass has been quite difficult to source since the very beginning, has been relatively poor quality - albeit typically more consistent than the Winchester WSM supply, and naturally, nobody else has been making any of this brass except their respective mommies… oh, yeah, both of which experienced bankruptcies… so now we have a sole source RUM and RSAUM IP owner which just adopted that particular red headed stepchild, and Olin’s just doing Olin things and making **** brass to ruin its own legacy… oh wait… who else is making RUM brass with a relatively reliable supply? Hornady… nice as a manufacturer to have your cake and eat it too…

And frankly - finally - there is a massive market of folks out there buying stuff they don’t understand for a purpose they pretend to pursue, and having a “responsibly bigger” hammer than your brother-in-law, or the dude at work is always a desire of some folks. A lot of folks bought 6.5 PRC’s just because they’re bigger and faster than 6.5 creeds. A lot of those folks will buy 7 PRC’s just because they’re more powerful than 6.5 PRC’s. The 7 is not yet long enough to demand too much powder or require an over-length magazine like the 300, so there’s a specific tolerance threshold there where guys can brag on their big truck without buying a Peterbilt… There have been a million Ruger Precision Rifles sold since inception - do you think all of those folks - or even 1/3 of those folks - are shooting competitions, or even shooting long range with them? Not a chance.

So I don’t think any of those particular arguments hold water.
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One would have to be insane to argue against rifles or chamberings are not bought to brag about. It's just as bad trying to swim up stream believing they are bought and used for the application they do best or were designed for. I will brag all day about my 6.5x55 over a new prc because my gun is way cooler ;)
 
Scooter22 said:
I just wish the D*** ammo companies would focus on producing ammo for the excellent cartridges that have been around for decades and centuries instead of the flavor of the month club. jmo
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I can say the same for newer calibers too, 6mm ARC is a prime example. There are plenty of commercials on the outdoor channels pushing the 6mm ARC but finding ammo can be difficult depending on where you live.
 
12Bravo20 said:
I can say the same for newer calibers too, 6mm ARC is a prime example.
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You know - one thing I will say is that these 3 letter acronyms behind cartridge names make them all start to blend together. Its hard to remember which is which when we have 6mm ARC, 6.5 PRC, 6.5 BRM, 6.5 JDJ, 6.5 MPC, 6.5 TCU, 6.5 STW.

Luxury car makers use this trick to intentionally make their models hard to remember. While you might buy a Ford Mustang, if you're buying a Lexus the models are UX, NX, RX, GX, LX, or RZ 450e - the reason being they WANT the model numbers to be hard to differentiate because they want the focus to be on the "Lexus" part rather than the specific model.

That works well for car makers, but bad for rifle cartridges. I will say that 6.8 Western is definitely easier to remember and differentiate versus 7mm PRC. My first inclination when I hear of any cartridge with the 3 letters behind it is "Oh, that's one of those weird benchrest cartridges.".
 
I’m kind of one of those guys that likes anything that guides projectiles to a target. Within reason obviously. But I’ve been very impressed with the Cartridges that Hornady has developed or helped develop. I think I just might end up with the entire PRC family nestled in my safe. Since I currently ownnone of the “predecessors” (7mm rem wby etc, or 300 win wby etc) I can definitely see no reason to not take advantage of the technical advancements and shoot the PRC. I personally have been underwhelmed by the 6.8 western from day one. I just thought it looked way to much like a wildcat hatched in bubbas shed than a well thought out cartridge(my opinion). Hornady does their homework, and they have customer service like very few other companies today. Like someone said/alluded to, you feel like you’re dealing with a family friend, not a big corp. So, especially in the Midwest/breadbasket, the PRC will trump the western hands down in my view.
 
Scooter22 said:
I just wish the D*** ammo companies would focus on producing ammo for the excellent cartridges that have been around for decades and centuries instead of the flavor of the month club. jmo
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Ammo companies aren’t making people buy new cartridges. Consumers want new cartridges to buy - developers just try to fill that desire in the particular market favor prevailing at the time.
 
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