Coyote3855
Member
I had no idea there was such a thing. Obviously. Thanks for the education. Now to find one I can afford. They seem to be rare and pricey.You could try your luck with the AMT Backup in 38 Super.
I had no idea there was such a thing. Obviously. Thanks for the education. Now to find one I can afford. They seem to be rare and pricey.You could try your luck with the AMT Backup in 38 Super.
LOVE your 'flame proofing'.One of those deep, thought provoking questions. For those of you who carry a BUG (Back Up Gun) in addition to your primary carry; is it the same caliber as your primary carry ? Larger, more effective caliber ? Or smaller caliber ? It's always baffled me (still does) about people carrying BUG's. If I'm gonna carry a BUG to supplement or replace my primary carry in case of unrepairable mechanical issue, lack of ammunition, being forcibly deprived of said main carry, or (continue ad nauseum), I'd want it in at least the same (hopefully ballistically effective) caliber as my primary, if not in an equally effective or *more effective* caliber.
Good Example- primary carry being a... S&W Shield in 9x19mm. BUG being a S&W 640 Pro in .357 Magnum.
Acceptable Example- primary (S&W Shield, 9mm), BUG (Ruger LCR in 9mm)
Bad Example- S&W Shield (9mm), BUG- Beretta 21a Bobcat in .22LR
I can understand the simplicity of slipping a Ruger LCP into a pocket, don't get me wrong... but (perfect world scenario here, you successfully put your entire magazine into a series of textbook CoM shots) if your Shield in 9mm failed to stop that 6'6" 350lb druggie with body armor and a car door for a shield, I fail to see how that little LCP in .380 is gonna do any better.
Disclaimer- nothing wrong with any of the above handguns. Platform was mainly used for ease of familiarity (and Google-ability) and said platform being chambered in a caliber suitable for demonstration.
*Checks to insure proper seal on fire, flame, roasting spit, and grill proof suit*
*Let the flaming commence*
*For the purpose of this post, a Back Up Gun (BUG) is any handgun carried in addition to an individual's primary carry piece (whether open or concealed) for the purpose of "continuing the fight" if the primary carry piece should fail, run dry, or be forcibly taken. *
Exactly. I don't want a Baby Browning as a BUG (as much as I like em). If that S&W Mdl 19 fails to do the job, I want a 640 or .45 Automatic subcompact. Something with some butt behind it.LOVE your 'flame proofing'.
I taught LEO's for a few decades [ retired now myself ].
And I taught that when you NEED your BUG,you will pray its a LAW rocket .
So that little gun might have to do a job that your primary can no longer do.
Its not going to be target shooting,it will be a real bad SHTF day.
Imagine taking out a pea shooter [ older guys know what they are ] when you wanted a handgrenade.
My average BUG to my G-19 is a S&W 340 or 360,instead of magnums in those VERY light guns ,I carry +p loads.
And a speed strip too,my theory is,if it needs being loaded it might need reloading.
Folklore.Something with some butt behind it.
I disagree. For a BUG, I'd rather a J frame .357 Magnum or a subcompact .45 Automatic. Even if the .45 doesn't expand, it's still putting a .45 caliber hole in someone.Folklore.
An expanded .380 ACP bullet is slightly larger.Even if the .45 doesn't expand, it's still putting a .45 caliber hole in someone.
I agree with your comments.An expanded .380 ACP bullet is slightly larger.
Larger diameter may provide some benefit, but not much. Research tells us that an expanded 9MM that penetrates far enough will do the job.
The bleed rate of a wound is not going to matter at all when one is engaged in close-quarter combat.
The gun writers once put a lot of stock in the alleged effectiveness of bore diameter for "knock down".
I started in handguns around 1960, and as late as fifty years later I really wanted the effectiveness I thought a .45 would provide. All I got for my trouble was more weight and more recoil.
What matters most is what is struck inside the body--not the boom and the whoomph of the gun.
The myth of the Moros led to a lot of oft-repeated exaggerations about the .45.
There is still a lot of that going around.
It is easy to catch, and it takes a while to get over it.
I do not recommend an LCP. I said that many officers I have known carry them.Only a revolver can & will do that if you use contact discharge.
Its not a "back up" its my 2nd option™
I cant put my hand on the pistol that I'm carrying IWB without revealing I'm carrying.
There are times where being able to discretely put hand on pistol is desirable - ex: if approached by someone "shady" in parking lot.
2nd option is carried in weak hand front pocket, if dominant hand is unavailable it offers me the option to easily access pistol with weak hand.
I have carried both pistols in same caliber ex: Glock 22 or 23 IWB with either a Kahr PM40 or Shield 40 in pocket, but same caliber is not a priority.
What is a priority is the 2nd option being at least 9mm, if its needed (pocket gun) the reason its needed is probably very close.
Today I had (have) a Glock 20SF IWB and a Kahr PM9 in weak hand pocket.
Yes, I live in a "good" area.
proactive > reactive
Glock Owners---If you carry a G19(primary) and a G26(BUG) + a G19 mag for a reload---If a "situation" came up and you ran the G19 dry would you
reload or just grab the G26?
Its not a "back up" its my 2nd option™
I cant put my hand on the pistol that I'm carrying IWB without revealing I'm carrying.
There are times where being able to discretely put hand on pistol is desirable - ex: if approached by someone "shady" in parking lot.
2nd option is carried in weak hand front pocket, if dominant hand is unavailable it offers me the option to easily access pistol with weak hand.
I have carried both pistols in same caliber ex: Glock 22 or 23 IWB with either a Kahr PM40 or Shield 40 in pocket, but same caliber is not a priority.
What is a priority is the 2nd option being at least 9mm, if its needed (pocket gun) the reason its needed is probably very close.
Today I had (have) a Glock 20SF IWB and a Kahr PM9 in weak hand pocket.
Yes, I live in a "good" area.
proactive > reactive
As you say, guns can be lost or malfunction without all possible rounds being used.I do agree that "any BUG is better than none"... but I'd hate to have the hope that after two mags from a 9mm/.40/.45 service sidearm, with a decent number of rounds on target; that an LCP would "finish the job". If your primary piece is taken or fails ? Certainly. But as a failsafe against ~60 rounds of 9mm not doing the job ? Not hardly. And yes. I know actual "rounds on target vs rounds fired) is especially low. Especially for today's trigger happy "spray and pray" cops.