Civilian Back-up gun,odds you will ever use it?

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DasFriek

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While picking out a bug that will rarely ever be carried by itself,ive been stressing over what caliber i should have bought.
But then i just thought "seriously as a non LEO whats the odds ill ever need it?".
Not that i want to down play its usefulness but if i had to make up a number of the chances ill ever even have to use my Main gun is pretty high odds.
If i thought of the odds on needing my BUG id have to say like a 98.9% chance ill never need it.
Now maybe thats a lot higher since i don't ever think about having to use it while being injured first.An injury to my right arm could make reaching my main impossible,so maybe that number is 85% chance ill not need it.

What do you think the odds are you would ever need to use a BUG?
 
turn the question around, if you do need it how badly will you you want it?


Look, carrying a gun is a gamble.... are you willing to bet your life that you won't need one, vs the weight, discomfort, and training required to carry one?


add the same question for a BUG
 
Look at it this way: If you CAN have a BUG, in addition to a primary, why not make it a "weakside" gun? That way, if you are injured, or pinned, or otherwise unable to access your primary with your strong side, you still have defensive options.
 
Im not questioning carrying it due to low odds are needing it,im talking about the odds it will matter what caliber my BUG is since the odds of me ever using it is so low.
Make more sense? I see i wasn't clear in transferring brain thoughts too a keyboard again.
So basically im asking how important is a BUG's caliber to you,since its so unlikely you will need it?

BTW i bought a bug to carry it,or at least grab it when i dont have time to holster up and throw it in a pocket holster and head out the door.Oh and yes,it will be a 100% placed weakside gun,ill be practicing alot of left handed shooting also.
 
Not that it's a bad idea, but what I think of is, if I have two guns, that's twice as much gear to keep accountable. Twice as many things I can drop, twice as many guns to make sure the kids can't reach, twice as many mechanical devices that can fail.

If I did carry a backup, I would make it a system that uses as many of the same parts, mags, and accessories as possible.

We live in a world where bad things happen. If you are fighting for your life, they are all happening at once. If your gun is going to fail, NOW is when it will happen. This is why we train to redundancy. I will never mock anyone for carrying a backup.

Having said that, I think that your time is better spent learning failure drills, tactical and emergency reloads, and stoppage drills than planning on having a backup gun available. I think that the bulk of the advantage comes from being armed at all. Having more than one gun offers limited advantage.
 
Ok, to answer your clarification, if you are fighting for your life, your main gun has failed, and you have switched to your backup gun, is NOW the time you want to find out the hard way if those guys on THR were right about the .25 ACP after all?
 
Ok, to answer your clarification, if you are fighting for your life, your main gun has failed, and you have switched to your backup gun, is NOW the time you want to find out the hard way if those guys on THR were right about the .25 ACP after all?
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BWWHHHAAAAhhaaaa!!! i did find that pretty funny,as i feel the .25 is useless also.
I bought a .380 but was wrestling hard over a 9mm tho,but i think i did ok.
 
Not that it's a bad idea, but what I think of is, if I have two guns, that's twice as much gear to keep accountable. Twice as many things I can drop, twice as many guns to make sure the kids can't reach, twice as many mechanical devices that can fail.

If I did carry a backup, I would make it a system that uses as many of the same parts, mags, and accessories as possible.

We live in a world where bad things happen. If you are fighting for your life, they are all happening at once. If your gun is going to fail, NOW is when it will happen. This is why we train to redundancy. I will never mock anyone for carrying a backup.

Having said that, I think that your time is better spent learning failure drills, tactical and emergency reloads, and stoppage drills than planning on having a backup gun available. I think that the bulk of the advantage comes from being armed at all. Having more than one gun offers limited advantage.
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A lot of good points.
I did keep the systems similar,but not interchangeable.Both are 1911 and 1911 inspired.I no doubt need more training,like 99% of us do.Due to finances ill do good to get practice at the range in with the costs of ammo,but if im gonna carry im gonna practice.
I do wonder if i did run into a LEO if he would be concerned as to why a civilian would be so armed tho.And yes i have a legal permit.
 
Find a balance between size and caliber.

I haven't carried a BUG yet, but when I do, it will be my Keltec P3AT in .380.

If I had to resort to a BUG I would prefer it was my SP101 in .357, but that is too heavy to carry in a addition to a full size 1911, my primary carry piece. The P3AT fits comfortably in a front pocket. Having an extra gun on my belt is just too much for me or most people, in a addition to spare mags..
 
I'm borderline on .380. With modern loads it's 'good enough', inasmuch as any handgun is good enough, but I just don't see why I would use one if I can get a subcompact Glock in 9, .40, .45, .357 SIG, or 10mm.
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And i wrestled with that alot,and no way would i feel good about a .380 as a main carry weapon.Im a .45acp guy.
I just couldn't find the right 9mm that was small enough with the features i wanted at the right price.The .380 fit the bill perfectly except it was a .380 and not a 9mm.That's what started all this thinking and i think im kinda worried over something that wont have much impact due to me choosing a .380 over the 9mm for this bug.
 
Better to have it and not need it than to need it and not have it:uhoh: is my motto when it comes to such things. I frequently carry a G27 with a Keltec P32 or Ruger LCP as a BUG. The trigger and general operating principles are the same with these pistols. If I carry a K or L frame revolver, the BUG is generally a J frame. I have found that it is best to have a primary and BUG that operate the same way. When I was a city cop, I had a radio and backup. As a civilian, I may well be on my own. The second gun makes sense in that situation.
 
If you have to resort to a BUG, you will probably be so close, it won't matter that it is only a .380.
 
I carry the same Glocks (31 and 33) off duty as I do on duty.
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Those are so thick,and i feel it takes a more trained person to carry a Glock safely than i am.Im a 1911 guy and carry a 5" or my micro .45 at all times.

The KT is a great gun,i wanted something a bit different tho.I really was wanting the PM9 but availability and price killed that idea for now.Thats all in another thread i have around here anyhow.
 
I felt keeping the platforms similar kinda important,even my micro is a SA i carry in condition 1.
If you have to resort to a BUG, you will probably be so close, it won't matter that it is only a .380.
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And i was thinking along that line also,plus with a .380 you only loose penetration.With good ammo i shouldn't be too far off from mid range 9mm ammo results.Plus i never thought about it,but a .380 shooting in my off hand is alot better than a higher recoil caliber.
I have shot my 1911 off hand during my ccw training,unpleasant but fun.
Im the kind of guy who will carry his 5" 1911 over my micro .45 just cause i like the gun better.
 
When I first started carrying off duty, I carried a full size 1911 and two spare mags and, occasionally a Chief Special as a back up...Then a 1911 with one mag. Then a Sig P220 (alloy frame) and two mags...then one mag...then an HKP7M8....And finally decided that I was tired of always dressing around the gun in everything I did. I had more Cammo jackets with the sleeves torn off into vests than I knew what to do with. Carrying a full sized gun, 24 hours a day is a real pain in the butt...carrying a BUG on duty and off duty seemed a bit much.

If you honestly look at the odds of getting into a shootout, they are incredibly small...How often does your primary fail on the range? What are the odds of it failing during the two or three rounds you may actually need it for?

Wearing a photographers vest, a jacket or other cover garmet when its 105, fanny packs and everything else to conceal a full sized gun AND a back up isn't worth it to me.

Realistically, I feel plenty armed with a 6 shot revolver and a speedloader or two or, a Sig P239 .357 SIG carried appendix and a spare mag is enough. Shorts, T shirt etc...I'm good to go.

Honestly, you can what if yourself into a coma. If I actually prepared for anything that might happen, I would carry my AR with an ACOG and my Ithaca Stakeout everywhere I went...but, its not worth it for me.

Not to mention, the chances of getting into a brawl is higher than a shooting, as someone else pointed out, now you have to keep track of two guns.

If you feel the need for two guns, more power to you, I can't say much as I always carry two, sometimes three on duty. But, Off duty, I'm just an average shmuck, unless somebody is about to die (me in particular), I'm not going hands on. I don't worry about someone trying to snatch my gun because its concealed.

To your original question:
Civilian Back-up gun,odds you will ever use it?
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In 25 years of being a police Officer in a 250 member department, we have had numerous Police Shootings. No Officer has ever needed a BUG....If, however, you are truly playing the odds, I will take any bet that unless you really try, you will never get into a shooting, therefore negating the need for a BUG. But, I have carried a BUG for the last 25 years and will until the day I retire...:)
 
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What do you think the odds are you would ever need to use a BUG?
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* The odds of using a main gun are astronomical...almost never happens (thank God).
* The odds you need a reload... zero. It hasn't happened yet in a civilian defensive use of a firearm.
* Therefore the odds of a civilian using a BUG are zero.

Doesn't mean it won't happen, just hasn't happened yet.
 
* The odds you need a reload... zero. It hasn't happened yet in a civilian defensive use of a firearm.
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I don't believe this is correct, but I can't find the information at the moment to support a claim otherwise. Even so, part of the reason there have been so few (if any as I can't prove it at the moment) civilian uses of reloads is because so few civilians carry any spare ammo. It becomes rather tautological because people don't carry reloads because of a lack of documentation of them being used, but if they aren't being carried then they can't be used.

There are instances of people being killed after emptying their weapons. If that isn't justification for carrying reloads or a BUG, I don't know what is.
 
What do you think the odds are you would ever need to use a BUG?
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For a civilian, very low odds. However, with my day-to-day carry activities; I find that just concealing one-handgun is a job in it's self. I think one tries to find some balance with personal protection and some semblance of comfort & practicality. BTW, in NM, you cannot legally carry more than one....The only B.U.G. I use consistently is in my vehicles.
I often wonder with those that utilize a b.u.g. and carry mulitiple mags on how they manage it w/o a "screaming gun" image....:rolleyes:
If you can do it, more power to you....
 
If you don't feel the need for a bug then don't carry one.

Food for thought:

It's better to have it and not need it than it is to need it and not have it!

:neener:
 
* The odds of using a main gun are astronomical...almost never happens (thank God).
* The odds you need a reload... zero. It hasn't happened yet in a civilian defensive use of a firearm.
* Therefore the odds of a civilian using a BUG are zero.



At the other end of the spectrum:

*The odds of using a gun to defend yourself...sure thing.
*The odds of needing a reload....absolutely.
*The odds of a civilian using a backup gun....always.

As with anything else the truth lies somewhere between the two extremes.

If you are thinking that it shouldn't matter what caliber it is as you'll never use it you are entilted to that. A far as the inconvenience, I carried either a J frame 38 or 380 in addition to my main battery for over 30 years and didn't think it was trobulesome.

i feel the .25 is useless also.

.25s are lacking in all areas but concealment. The fact is no one wants to get shot with one and see if it's reputation still stands. I tend to agree with Skeeter Skelton who once stated in regards to the usefulness of 25s with "you might be able to use it to bluff your way out".
 
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