Open carry activist at Dallas shooting

[silicosys4]

And it looks like he did everything right.

Cnn is reporting at this time that a man listed as a suspect for a short time in the breaking Dallas shootout is no longer a suspect, as he has turned himself in immediately after being listed as a suspect and having his picture circulated.

Cnn had a fit for about an hour over pictures of an open carry activist walking through the crowds about an hour before the shooting involving 11 officers at a Texas protest this evening. He was listed as a suspect and was part of the manhunt for a short time before turning himself in.

Well, turns out that there is now footage of him running along with everyone else away from the shooting while the shots can be heard in the background.

It is very important to note that this man did not mistakenly engage civilians or police, was not mistakenly engaged by police, did not turn into a mall ninja Rambo, and basically behaved perfectly for the situation.

(Mind you, this is already being used as an attack against open carry by CNN talking heads, and expect to hear more about body armor and "high capacity" magazines, as one of the shooters is described as having took shots to the back without visible effect before turning and killing the officer shooting, and were described as having "high capacity 30 round magazines spilling out of his pockets")

But this is a real world instance that did not follow the anti open carry rhetoric at all.

I'm sorry I don't have a link, I will look for one, this is all via live television.
Edit: http://www.redstate.com/absentee/20...erest-shooting-11-police-officers-1-civilian/

I'm not posting this to start a discussion about the event, as that is not a topic for THR.
I do think it's of value to note the behavior of an open carrier in contrast to the rhetoric of anti open carry activists.

 

[gbran]

Just now reported both real suspects are in custody.

BTW, I would not be unarmed in that area, but not sure I'd open carry. i'm also pretty sure this was a venue I'd not attend anyway.

 

[BigBore44]

Would have been awesome if he would have engaged and neutralized the shooter and saved an officer. That would have REALLY put a damper on the left's spin on this. But he did it right.

 

[HetchHetchy]

And it looks like he did everything right.

Cnn is reporting at this time that a man listed as a suspect for a short time in the breaking Dallas shootout is no longer a suspect, as he has turned himself in immediately after being listed as a suspect and having his picture circulated...

Just what we need -- some more "open carry activism." Sad. He would have saved himself and others plenty of grief if he would simply have concealed his firearm.

 

[silicosys4]

This is exactly what we need, IMO.
Instances of open carriers behaving entirely appropriately, debunking the lies told by anti open carry activists.
CNN is already attacking open carry, but they are having to pick very carefully around this one precisely because this particular instance directly contradicts nearly every fear about open carry they have voiced.

 

[gspn]

I dont see how marching with a rifle in an anti police Black Lives Matter protest march is going to endear anyone to the cause of open carry.

At the least he took resources and attention away from the search for the actual shooters while they were still on the loose. All i saw was an anti police protestor who found himself in grave danger by accidentally bringing a riflle to the exact spot where gunmen shot 11 police officers, killing at least 4 of them.

I dont see how this will do anything positive for any fans of open carry.

 

[silicosys4]

I dont see how Marching with a rifle in an anti police Black Lives Matter protest march is going to endear anyone to the cause of open carry.

At the least he took resources and attention away from the search for the actual shooters while they were still on the loose. All i saw was an anti police protestor who found himself in grave danger by accidentally bringing a riflle to the exact spot where gunmen shot 11 police officers, killing at least 4 of them.

I dont see how this will do anything positive for any fans of open carry.

That's the beauty of it. It doesn't matter what me, you or anyone else thinks about the morals, intelligence, or appropriateness.
I wouldn't be anywhere near a protest like that, and definitely not open carrying an ar15.
But that doesn't matter in the least. I respect and support the rights of others to open carry, regardless of my personal preference to stay concealed.
The fact is this man was there legally, hurt no one, and behaved appropriately in a situation that until now hadn't been encountered, just fantasized about by both anti and pro carry factions. It is a positive example that cannot easily be spun.

This guy singlehandedly had CNN admitting that open carry is legal in certain areas, that you can not use open carry as an indicator of ill intent, that you need to know your local laws concerning open carry before you panic, and that open carriers are capable of and even likely to engage in responsible, legal, and harmless behavior.

 

[gspn]

This guy singlehandedly had CNN admitting that open carry is legal, that you can not use open carry as an indicator of ill intent, that you need to know your local laws concerning open carry before you panic, and that open carriers are capable of and even likely to engage in responsible, legal, and harmless behavior.

CNN said all that? Do you have a link? Which talking head on CNN stated all of that? Seems very unlike them.

 

[silicosys4]

CNN said all that? Do you have a link? Which talking head on CNN stated all of that? Seems very unlike them.

It was definitely a reluctant statement and tinged with gentle understanding that open carrying is so very frightening to their viewers.
It was on their live broadcast as they were backpedaling away from their statements of the man as a suspect soon after he turned himself in.
Couldn't tell you which one, I'm not familiar with CNN, or most talking heads in general...the 40'ish bookish blond guy, if that means anything

 

[shafter]

This is exactly what we need, IMO.
Instances of open carriers behaving entirely appropriately, debunking the lies told by anti open carry activists.

I agree wholeheartedly. I also agree he did right under the circumstances.

 

[Speedo66]

Here's an article in the NY Times about some open carry protesters at that rally. The African-American open carry advocates fear that being Black and legally carrying a gun is tantamount to being guilty, or worse, reason to be shot.

It also quotes the sister of the man in MN shot after announcing to the police he had a permit, she also has a permit. She worries that being Black, if the police see the gun, they will shoot first and ask questions later.

Here's the article: http://www.nytimes.com/2016/07/09/u...ackage-region&region=top-news&WT.nav=top-news

 

[Jeff H]

It was definitely a reluctant statement and tinged with gentle understanding that open carrying is so very frightening to their viewers.
It was on their live broadcast as they were backpedaling away from their statements of the man as a suspect soon after he turned himself in.
Couldn't tell you which one, I'm not familiar with CNN, or most talking heads in general...the 40'ish bookish blond guy, if that means anything

They could say anything they want on CNN and I wouldn't know. I don't watch that station.

 

[wally]

When I saw that photo on FOX news last night, I immediately thought it was one of those open carry people that had been on the news, but couldn't really be sure. Glad things seemed to have worked out for him!

 

[jmorris]

I dont see how marching with a rifle in an anti police Black Lives Matter protest march is going to endear anyone to the cause of open carry.

That's just it, exercising both his First and Senpcond Amendment rights at the same time. Doesn't matter if you like his speech and doesn't matter if Liberals don't like his gun.

When I am in that area I always have a firearm too, just prefer mine concealed.

 

[BigBore44]

You can be a responsible, law abiding gun owner and protest two potential "bad shootings". We still don't know enough facts yet to make any determination. Not everyone at the black lives matter protests are ill-informed white cop haters. When his picture showed up on the news, I was highly suspect that he was a shooter. His choice to be in a crowd and shoot at cops would more than likely have resulted in more protesters being shot/killed. And he wouldn't have been viewed as a martyr. Turned out I was right. Just a guy exercising his right to protest, and OC. More than a lot of us would do with a similar cause to stand behind. I hope the big news stations interview him.

 

[SilentStalker]

So, the guy was at a protest carrying an AR where shots were fired, police officers killed? That's bad on many levels IMO and something I have always pondered with situations like this is, "what keeps the cops from shooting you?" I mean seriously, this could have ended real bad for this gent despite not doing anything wrong. In fact, I have pondered this question for any active shooter situation. Say you have a permit and are ccw where a real threat is with multiple people and say you do happen to neutralize the situation and the cops arrive about the same time. How do they know who is the real shooter and who is the responder? You see where I am going here?

 

[yugorpk]

Really the wrong venue to be open carrying unless you are trying to support the case of the protesters. White guy open carries and AR-15 down the middle of main street and its his 2nd amendment right. Black guy does it he gets shot. Remember what happened when the Black Panthers open carried in the California state capital. They made open carry illegal. I mean they've got a point.

 

[barnbwt]

Yugo, this exact incident disproves that point.

 

[jmorris]

So, the guy was at a protest carrying an AR where shots were fired, police officers killed? That's bad on many levels IMO and something I have always pondered with situations like this is, "what keeps the cops from shooting you?"

Not being a bad guy? The guy was part of the crowd, reacted like the rest of the crowd and remained safe. Later, when he was a person of interest he went in and cleared it up with the police. What am I missing that is bad?

 

[Flfiremedic]

Open carry is legal in Texas...but just because you can do something doesn't mean it's a good idea...open carry with a large conspicuous weapon at a protest....especially of a type that has historically gotten violent is a bad idea. Regardless of race, political/religious beliefs etc, we have to police ourselves...good on the guy for turning himself in...but it was still a bad choice.

 

[shafter]

I didn't realize that individual was open carrying a rifle. I think that's a bad judgement call, however, an individual right is an individual right.

We all have the right to free speech but does that mean we should only whisper or speak behind closed doors about things that other people might find offensive? Hardly! I think if more people over the years had the guts to boldly exercise their rights we wouldn't be losing them so fast today.

 

[BigBore44]

Why what it a bad choice? Because of the venue? Because it was a black lives matter protest? Should we not exercise our rights? Ok...Then when IS it appropriate to exercise that right that that gentleman exercised?

 

[Flfiremedic]

Why what it a bad choice? Because of the venue? Because it was a black lives matter protest? Should we not exercise our rights? Ok...Then when IS it appropriate to exercise that right that that gentleman exercised?

Don't try to make this a racial or 1st Amendment thing. My point (and I stand by it) is that when you pick up a gun, you pick up additional responsibilities. Open carry of a weapon with " shock value" in certain circles at an event which has historically had a potential for violence isn't a good idea. The gentleman carrying the weapon did the right thing post event 100%. No doubt. But for several hours we had pics of him in the news as a "person of interest". It also potentially put him at additional risk. AND at least in my mind, it makes us all look bad.
Opinions vary...your entitled to yours...I'm entitled to mine.

 

[SilentStalker]

You guys are missing my point entirely. This guy was lucky that he was able to turn himself in. Think about it, in a situation like this, cops come storming in from all over to answer an active shooter call and as soon as they are on scene they see a guy with an AR. Do you see where I am going here? Shouldered or not, adrenaline pumping, it would be very easy for he cops to assume you are the shooter and shoot you. There is mass confusion in these situations and that guy is really lucky he wasn't lit up by any cop arriving on scene.

 

[Flfiremedic]

That was part of my point.